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Opening a new exit/entrance

Author
Daniel Plain
Doomheim
#21 - 2012-07-06 11:12:51 UTC
Barrak wrote:
joes Bazooka wrote:
Well imagine i am in my WH smashing sites, i have not spawned my HS for a little extra safety as i watched it die i know its now no longer active.

This means from HS,LS or Null that you cannot scan down and find that entry to my WH until i initiate a warp to my static.

I can however get nasty bad men come in from other ways to touch me in bad places.


Based on this comment, if I wanted to try and secure my WHspace as much as I could, I would want to do the following:


  • Close existing EXITS
  • Scan new ones but NOT warp to them
  • Close existing entrances
  • Pray new EXITS (K162's) do not appear, but scan for them.



Regards


this is basically correct except you can never be 100% sure there is not some *** in a covops sitting in your system. also, unless you scan 24/7, your safety could have been compromised while you were away (people coming in through a K162 and then collapsing it before you notice).
that said, you can generally assume you are safe if you have no specific reason to believe you are not alone, you did not open your static and did not see any K162s in the last few days.

I should buy an Ishtar.

Barrak
The Painted Ones
#22 - 2012-07-06 11:37:08 UTC
Thank you all.....

I feel like I am finally getting the basics down.

Regards
BobFenner
Black Hole Runners
#23 - 2012-07-06 11:37:36 UTC
Please be aware that some pilots roam w-space in covops capable ships (normally T3's but some in bombers) just looking for kills. They have been known to camp systems for days on end if they spy a particularly 'bear'ish corp.

So my advice is, even if you have the wormhole closed off and you have someone probing for new connections. STILL keep spamming d-scan regularly. It may just give you a few seconds if you are lucky enough to scan when they log in and before they can cloak up.

However, if your system is HUGE then they will have logged off in a spot far enought from any celestial so your chances get slimmer.

I have of course NEVER sat in someone's systems for ten days hoping to catch that solo Nightmare running sites.

But I know someone who did.....
My missus thinks of EvE as 'the other woman'. :)
Daniel Plain
Doomheim
#24 - 2012-07-06 12:03:53 UTC
out of curiosity, what DPS can you expect out of a well skilled stealth bomber assuming the target is large enough?

I should buy an Ishtar.

Godfrey Silvarna
Arctic Light Inc.
Arctic Light
#25 - 2012-07-06 12:29:14 UTC
Daniel Plain wrote:
out of curiosity, what DPS can you expect out of a well skilled stealth bomber assuming the target is large enough?

400-500 or so
Hard1234
Hard1234's industries.
#26 - 2012-07-06 14:01:05 UTC
I lived alone in c2 wh until 2 months ago. I read on a forum before, that you can lock wh by colapsing old wh exit then imedietly scan for new one. BM it, but not initiate warp to it. I'm prety sure I was alone in the wh at the time.

I did just that thinking that I was safe. But sceptic that I am, I was pasivly scanining the system. I notice someone was inside. I ask him in local where he enter. He said from high sec. High sec exit was exactly the one I "lock".

So it seams that you cant lock any more.
Fradle
Collapsed Out
Pandemic Legion
#27 - 2012-07-06 14:12:32 UTC
Hard1234 wrote:
I lived alone in c2 wh until 2 months ago. I read on a forum before, that you can lock wh by colapsing old wh exit then imedietly scan for new one. BM it, but not initiate warp to it. I'm prety sure I was alone in the wh at the time.

I did just that thinking that I was safe. But sceptic that I am, I was pasivly scanining the system. I notice someone was inside. I ask him in local where he enter. He said from high sec. High sec exit was exactly the one I "lock".

So it seams that you cant lock any more.

Or someone else activated your static.
Rroff
Antagonistic Tendencies
#28 - 2012-07-06 14:34:35 UTC
Definitely still possible few days ago I scanned our static, didn't warp to it and a bit later someone else warped to it and narrowly missed catching site runners who'd had probes out and saw the new WH spawn when he warped to it.
Barrak
The Painted Ones
#29 - 2012-07-06 16:20:20 UTC
So, if you wanted to mess with someone, you could warp into their system and open up all the gates you find........... I guess this would work especially well if they are a solo camper.

Mongaar
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#30 - 2012-07-06 17:23:57 UTC
This is part of GM's reply to question about static spawn.
Quote:
...As we have stated multiple times, when a wormhole is spawned, both sides are spawned at the same time. The site can be scanned down from either system. Scanning the site down has no relation to when or where the site spawns.


New Static spawn 60sec or so after old is closed and spawns on both sides.
Rroff
Antagonistic Tendencies
#31 - 2012-07-06 17:30:49 UTC  |  Edited by: Rroff
Mongaar wrote:
This is part of GM's reply to question about static spawn.
Quote:
...As we have stated multiple times, when a wormhole is spawned, both sides are spawned at the same time. The site can be scanned down from either system. Scanning the site down has no relation to when or where the site spawns.


New Static spawn 60sec or so after old is closed and spawns on both sides.


When its spawned both sides are spawned the sig you scan down isn't a spawned wormhole its just a deadspace signature until someone tries to warp to it at which point the wormhole is spawned.

You can see this if you go on SISI there are very few k162s from w-space in k-space on there and quite a few untouched wandering outgoing holes from k-space to w-space (k162 on the wormhole space side).
Svodola Darkfury
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#32 - 2012-07-06 18:32:37 UTC  |  Edited by: Svodola Darkfury
Rroff wrote:
Mongaar wrote:
This is part of GM's reply to question about static spawn.
Quote:
...As we have stated multiple times, when a wormhole is spawned, both sides are spawned at the same time. The site can be scanned down from either system. Scanning the site down has no relation to when or where the site spawns.


New Static spawn 60sec or so after old is closed and spawns on both sides.


When its spawned both sides are spawned the sig you scan down isn't a spawned wormhole its just a deadspace signature until someone tries to warp to it at which point the wormhole is spawned.

You can see this if you go on SISI there are very few k162s from w-space in k-space on there and quite a few untouched wandering outgoing holes from k-space to w-space (k162 on the wormhole space side).



It has to be spawned, I.E. Warped to. I've done a ton of testing on this and I was of the opinion that it was just "you have to find the corresponding high-sec or something!" Then I let a high-sec wormhole roll for 4 days (never warped to it, and it was there each day). When I finally warped to it it was in Aikoro, the Citadel, 4 jumps from Jita. Within an hour of warping to it 6 different pilots had poked their heads inside. Seemed highly unlikely that it went unnoticed for 4 days and then the hour after I warped to it 6 different guys just happened to scan it.


[edit] I'm confirming what Rroff is saying :p

Svo.

Director of Frozen Corpse Industries.

Rroff
Antagonistic Tendencies
#33 - 2012-07-06 19:10:17 UTC  |  Edited by: Rroff
^^ Thats another way to confirm it tho - a spawned WH will die after 16-24 hours in most cases, but if you don't warp to the sig (and no one else does) the sig will stay there in the same place indefinitely until you warp to it after which it will despawn as expected within 16-24 hours - I find it hard to believe no one would have scanned the other side if it existed the number of times we've left WH's not warped to and not seen a single person and when finally warped to it several days later it spawns to a busy system.
Fitz VonHeise
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#34 - 2012-07-06 22:41:32 UTC
Here is the definitive answer on how to be ‘safe’ in a worm hole per my guys who do the scanning.

They will scan out our worm hole and see if there are other k162’s. If so they will close them. They then scan out our static worm hole and once they warp to our static we know it has shown up on the other side. (It might have already shown up if others have warped to the static) So now we close our static worm hole. (Yes this takes practice to not get left on the other side).

Once we have closed our static we now know for sure our worm hole is ‘safe’. No other ships can attack us from outside unless they come through a k162 wh. But we need to be constantly scanning with one probe. By constantly scanning, if we suddenly see another wh show up we know our wh has been invaded by at least one probing ship and possibly more. But until we see other wh’s appear we are safe to go about doing stuff in our worm hole.

Theoretically we could jump into our static and do the above to that static wh (closing all k162’s) and closing its static and we could safely run stuff in that wh. (We have actually done this a few times and have not been ganked when we did this tactic)
Masikari
State War Academy
Caldari State
#35 - 2012-07-07 01:25:55 UTC
Fitz VonHeise wrote:
Here is the definitive answer on how to be ‘safe’ in a worm hole per my guys who do the scanning.

They will scan out our worm hole and see if there are other k162’s. If so they will close them. They then scan out our static worm hole and once they warp to our static we know it has shown up on the other side. (It might have already shown up if others have warped to the static) So now we close our static worm hole. (Yes this takes practice to not get left on the other side).

Once we have closed our static we now know for sure our worm hole is ‘safe’. No other ships can attack us from outside unless they come through a k162 wh. But we need to be constantly scanning with one probe. By constantly scanning, if we suddenly see another wh show up we know our wh has been invaded by at least one probing ship and possibly more. But until we see other wh’s appear we are safe to go about doing stuff in our worm hole.

Theoretically we could jump into our static and do the above to that static wh (closing all k162’s) and closing its static and we could safely run stuff in that wh. (We have actually done this a few times and have not been ganked when we did this tactic)


Unless, as mentioned before, someone invades and cloaks up waiting for you to log. Then they jump you when you think you are safe! This has happened to me before when we thought we were safe. We were using the exact tactics you described. So don't always assume that you think you are alone Blink

At least 1 probe to detect new anomalies and never stop spamming that D-Scan!
Fradle
Collapsed Out
Pandemic Legion
#36 - 2012-07-07 02:44:05 UTC
There is no safe in WHs. You are always being watched, someone is always looking to kill you, keep probes out and watch D-Scan to decrease the amount of times you'll get caught with your pants down. Dieing isn't a possibility in WHs, it's an inevitability.
joes Bazooka
Doomheim
#37 - 2012-07-07 04:27:57 UTC
Fradle wrote:
There is no safe in WHs. You are always being watched, someone is always looking to kill you, keep probes out and watch D-Scan to decrease the amount of times you'll get caught with your pants down. Dieing isn't a possibility in WHs, it's an inevitability.



^THIS^
Bugsy VanHalen
Society of lost Souls
#38 - 2012-07-09 17:38:00 UTC
joes Bazooka wrote:
Barrak wrote:
thanks for the explanation.

So what's all this stuff I have read about not being able to scan a wormhole unless the other side has been scanned/used first?

Is that true?

Regards


Well imagine i am in my WH smashing sites, i have not spawned my HS for a little extra safety as i watched it die i know its now no longer active.

This means from HS,LS or Null that you cannot scan down and find that entry to my WH until i initiate a warp to my static.

I can however get nasty bad men come in from other ways to touch me in bad places.

Wormholes spawn in one system and have an exit (K-162) in another system.
Every wormhole has a spawn side (unique I.D.) and a exit K-162 side (all exits are K-162) Nobody can scan down the K-162 side of your static until it is spawned, but that does not stop someone else's K-162 exit from spawning in your system.

I say again, If the static wormhole in your system does not get activated nobody can scan down the K-162 exit on the other side.

However there is always a chance you could get an exit (the K-162 side) from another wormhole spawning in your system. This can be from anywhere, another wormhole, or k-space, but it is the exit of a wormhole that spawned in a system outside of yours. You can never scan down a K-162 in your system unless someone has already activated the other side. Just as they can not scan down the K-162 exit from your static until it is spawned.

To make it simple, you can control your static wormhole buy popping it and not spawning the new static, you however have no control over K-162 exits that spawn in your hole. If you ever see a K-162 exit in your hole, then you know somebody scanned it down and spawned it from the other side. Chances are, you have company.



That is about as simple as I can make it.
Barrak
The Painted Ones
#39 - 2012-07-09 18:30:02 UTC  |  Edited by: Barrak
So.... if you are going in through the out, then the chaps within must have scanned their out from in.

Simples..........

ffs...... please tell me that, however funny i was trying to be, i got it right.
BobFenner
Black Hole Runners
#40 - 2012-07-09 18:33:02 UTC
Bingo! Big smile
My missus thinks of EvE as 'the other woman'. :)
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