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EVE Alliance Tournament Discussion

 
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Tiebreak ranking problem
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James Arget
Future Corps
Sleeper Social Club
#1 - 2012-07-01 17:57:14 UTC  |  Edited by: James Arget
Quote:
If at any point, teams are level in Win/Loss and also level in points scored, the following will be used in order to determine ranking position.

If the teams disputing rank have fought each other at any point, the winner is higher.
The current ranking (W/L, then points) of the last team that you defeated. Higher is better.
The current ranking of the last team that defeated you. Again, higher is better.


So, this should have been raised earlier, but I was more focused on fleet comps than the fine print of the rules. My concern is with the third tiebreak test. In particular, if you know that you've scored as many points as it's possible for your team to (perhaps you're down to only a few support ships and they have logistics still on field), to properly play into this test, you should suicide your own team in order to elevate the ranking of your opponent, giving you a better chance that they will outrank the opponent of the team you've tied with.

Example:
Team A fights team B, Team C fights Team D.

Team A scores 20 points against team B, and has 10 points of ships remaining. They kite the grid to deny points to team B. Final scores: A 20, B 50.

Team C scores 20 points against team D, and has 10 points of ships reamaining. They suicide into team D. Final scores: C 20, D 62.5.

In their second matches, A and C are paired against a similar pair of teams, E and F. E and F had each scored 6 points in their first match, and both A and C win decisive victories 62.5 to 0. Teams B and D perform likewise.

Team A and C are now tied. They have never fought each other, and both of their victories were against teams who scored evenly, with even points totals. We go to the third tiebreak condition... and find that team B is ranked below team D, because team A worked to deny team B kills, while team C suicided to boost the score of team D.

Team C is declared higher in ranking due to suicide, while team A is ranked lower due to best effort at being competitive.

The Fix: Replace the third test. This should be "Total points scored against each team, lower is better."

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James Arget
Future Corps
Sleeper Social Club
#2 - 2012-07-01 21:21:07 UTC
Tiebreak rule #2 is also making some wonky results after first day of qualifying. Right now, the top ranked teams are there because they managed narrower wins, having lost ships during their match. As a result, their opponents are ranked higher, giving them a higher position compared to teams that managed a perfect match of full kills, no losses.

Points scored against seems like a better metric for ranking than comparative ranking. Even though it "feels" better to say that if you beat a better team than the person you tied with, a weak victor will rank higher than a strong victor.

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Tyrrax Thorrk
Guiding Hand Social Club
#3 - 2012-07-02 03:42:35 UTC
Does it matter ?
Who cares if the best teams are towards the middle of the ranking, they're still going to be facing teams that did about the same.
James Arget
Future Corps
Sleeper Social Club
#4 - 2012-07-02 05:39:29 UTC
After match 1, it doesn't make a huge difference, since we have match 2 to add a lot more point variation. However, it will make a difference in the final qualifier ranking, the one that determines who goes to groups and who is eliminated.

There's a conflict of interest where a team is supposed to fight as competitively as possible, but there are distinct circumstances where losing ships will help them.

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