EVE General Discussion

I wouldn't mind random PvP when I'm missioning, exploring, ect. What I do mind is having a ship that's not setup for PvP being unable to effectively fight back when I get jumped in low sec. Ganking is fine and all, but having a real opponent that's setup to fight back is the way to go for long term enjoyment.

My 2c: Change low sec rats to require PvP fits to fight them and reduce the number of pirates in low sec. When it comes to predatory creatures the ratio of prey to predators needs to be at least 10/1 if not 50/1. I'd suggest pirates not being allowed to use low sec gates (even in pods) when their sec status drops too far.

I honestly do not understand your questions. But Ill try and make a few comments.

Ive lost 2 one billion isk ships to PvE, and readily acknowledged it was my error, and went and got another ship. I almost lost a 3 billion isk ship(10% hull left). Ive also lost a 10 million isk ship to PvP and considered quitting the game (again my errors though). Why? Its not the isk. Its the adrenaline.

Adrenaline leaves me feeling horrid. For days. Hence, I avoid game play activities that trigger it. PvE does not, irrelevant of the isk involved. Its just fake space money. Knowing there is another person on the keyboard does. Adrenaline is a draw for those who get The Rush, its not for the rest of us.

How much isk should I be able to make? Less than the low sec or null sec player who spends all their play time making isk. The PLEX is not the issue here. The PLEX market will always be supported by those who do not like isk making activities, and realize that the money saved by just driving slower on the freeway makes the equivalent of 300 million isk an hour.

Even if there was no ganking in high sec, the high sec player still has risk. Miners can find the belts mined out. Explorers can find their sites already being done by others. Traders can fall victim to market manipulations. Industrialists can find their market saturated, driving profit to zero, or less. Mission runners can make a mistake and lose a pimp-mobile to the stupid NPCs (how I got my 2 big losses).

The idea that risk comes only from PvP space combat is a very narrow view. PvP covers any and all competitive interactions between players. Suicide ganking is a tiny tiny part, and if it went away the game would hardly feel it.

What should a ganker risk? As much time as it will take me to make the isk to replace the ship. Note that for those who try to keep a high sec status there is already some balance as the ganker has to go do "community service". But for those who go -10, there is no additional penalty for an additional gank, other than losing a cheap ship. To me, that is a large imbalance.

P.S. Oddly, after 4+ years of play, Ive never fallen victim to a suicide gank. Not sure how that has happened.

There are still plenty of pirates who honor ransoms. And there have always been those that don't.

No different then from now.

I'm still fairly new to the game. Before I started EVE, I did my homework. I knew from day one I could lose big time ISK and would have to suck it up as it is all part of the game. You can be pirated, swindled and ganked. Im cool with that, with no bitching.

As far as additional risk (which I'm assuming is the point of this thread), I think the current risk for carebears is good as is. Combat players are all about risk and live/die by the sword. ISK makers are all about the mundane. Mining shouldn't be risky on top of being boring. As far as I'm concerned, I put in the boring, like combat players put in the risk.


Well its all player based economy, so I would think it depends on the economy.

I completely +1 you. Specially the part about time to replace the loss as a measure of risk. It is far more dangerous to fly a Hulk than to gank it as it costs 20x more time to lose a Hulk than to gank it.

And yet miners are deemed "cowardly" whereas the gankers are deemed "elite"... guess WHO made upthat yardtstick.

As I think as him, I wil answer too... it's not just "the rush", it's the impossibility to disincentive it within a ruleset aimed at make abuse as easy and amusing as possible for the perpretators and don't give a **** of the victims.

Even gankers have a predator. It can be the market or other gankers. Or the blob. People who perform under the average always resent those who perform better.

The real question is: are the same tools given to everyone? Since the answer is yes, if your choice is sub-optimal you can only blame yourself.

I think i could be labeled as a "carebear" im running LVL 4's ATM.
As someone stated here before, many "carebears" do feel bullied, i mean other people shooting you, and then making fun of you for being angry, thats not very...kind. But dont get me wrong, that is what makes the game so awesome, people can do whatever they want, and all people try to get into conflicts, espeacially when they know they can handle it. And i dont mean only PVP-ers, look at the market, traders compete and even if they are in highsec there is risk for them.
I think there should be an area, something like a "no PVP area". You could be running missions, you could be mining, you could trade, but all these activities would be nerfed (CONCORD tax / debuffs like in incursion systems...). So that people can make enough for a PLEX and some spare change with casual playing (5-7 hours a week).

The term carebear is over done. Any activity were the risk is lower than the reward could be contrived as 'carebearing'. This includes ganking others. The loss of the ship is a known factor, so hardly part of the risk. The only real risk invovled is did you plan enough to ensure the kill.The entire game is risk reward balancing, and at no point does a person have to really think about the reprecussions of their actions. The punishments are rather laughable. Negative status doesn't impede the local pirate. You still get to do what you want where you want. You can always mine in missions with a dscan setup or in a belt aligned to a station. Missions are repetitive. I think taking out drone droppings and meta 0/1 items helped increase mining and industry. Incursions can be tricky for the casual player, but is an isk faucet. FW is even easier. Anyone can join up and rack up the lp, even the newest of players. WHs are all mapped out, and hardly the challenge to the experienced group. However, a great source of isk. The Story Arcs are more tedious than rewarding. Standings have no real meaning other than refining and clones. Building is probably the most challenging part of EVE due to the skill levels to consider and the materials necessary that are spread throughout the universe. Isk isn't hard to make in any part of EVE. People just have to be willing to actually play the game to get it. Everyone wants 50 billion in the bank on day one before they even undock. Play the game.

****I don't play in Null Sec, so I'm not going to comment on it. However, it seems from the forums that it has gotten rather stale, but when anyone suggests a change, everyone whines about it destroying the sandbox. Either you want it to 'get exciting' or you put up with the stale moldness.

too late... you are showing your judgemental attitude in your title; "carebear" is a term coined by combat pvp meta gamers. You clearly have an agenda with this posted wall of text. Since this is a "sand box" there is no incorrect way to play or think about playing. Trying to convince others they are wrong in their play style or even their whining about play is self serving. The bottom line is there are more of these self righteous posted threads than there are any "carebear" tears going on in the forums. I grow more weary of these posts than I do of any of the few posts complaining about ganking.