These forums have been archived and are now read-only.

The new forums are live and can be found at https://forums.eveonline.com/

EVE General Discussion

 
  • Topic is locked indefinitely.
 

Corp hopping. Is it going to be addressed? It's reaching ridiculous levels.
Author
Previous Topic Next Topic
Crunchie Attuxors
Always Another Corporate Venture
#61 - 2012-06-27 17:26:26 UTC
Destiny Corrupted wrote:
They were originally going to implement a "deserted" flag.

They decided to up war declaration costs and give defenders unlimited allies instead.


You are aware that is no longer the case, right?
Eve forums official anthem: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pudOFG5X6uA Real men tank hull. Fake women shield-tank Gallente.
Price Check Aisle3
#62 - 2012-06-27 17:27:07 UTC
Jade Constantine wrote:
Well we're currently playing a game where the largest alliance in space is currently protected from a hisec coalition 1/20th of its size by a 20 Trillion ISK ($300,000 dollar) wardec ally shield. The game designers have told us that war is not supposed to be fair. Compared to that obscenity of game design one might consider that a bit of wardec evasion by individuals slithering through the gaps is pretty small beer in the grand scheme of things.

The best part is that you can just go to Goonswarm's sov area and fight them without paying. If you war-dec them you're only going get a few targets anyway, so what's the point? They have neutral alts for hauling anyway, not like you're going to disrupt their supply chain with a war-dec... Roll
  • Karl Hobb IATS
Price Check Aisle3
#63 - 2012-06-27 17:28:25 UTC
MeBiatch wrote:
jade why dont you just add all those former allies to your alliance? that way they can still fight for you?

For once this guy has an excellent point. Create new alliance, join up, dec for cheap.
  • Karl Hobb IATS
Lin-Young Borovskova
Doomheim
#64 - 2012-06-27 17:29:38 UTC
Alexzandvar Douglass wrote:
Sounds like some one's butthurt with AAA.

Corp hopping is part of the game, encouraged even.



Yep, corp hopping is the most common mechanic exploit thanks to who 90% high sec self proclaimed pvp pussies pave their KB.

Take that away, push them to low/null, make of those real men some day (lolilolzboulz tràlàlà hit)

brb
MeBiatch
GRR GOONS
#65 - 2012-06-27 17:30:21 UTC
Price Check Aisle3 wrote:
MeBiatch wrote:
jade why dont you just add all those former allies to your alliance? that way they can still fight for you?

For once this guy has an excellent point. Create new alliance, join up, dec for cheap.


there must be a blue moon somewhere in the galaxy eh?

There are no stupid Questions... just stupid people... CCP Goliath wrote:

Ugh ti-di pooping makes me sad.
Jade Constantine
Jericho Fraction
The Star Fraction
#66 - 2012-06-27 17:40:02 UTC
MeBiatch wrote:

jade why dont you just add all those former allies to your alliance? that way they can still fight for you?
edit if corp hopping pulls them into the war... just make a bunch of alts have then join star fraction then join the former allies corp to pull them into the war!


Well the alliance issue is always that you need to have as many alt-controlled pretend corps (for executor voting) as you do real corps - (otherwise you'll lose the alliance to a Band of Brothers disband thing) Basically each corp in the alliance gets to declare "support" secretly and you need to ensure you have a majority to keep your alliance. So practically - to maintain our 52 allies we'd need 52 alt corps each of which needs an active subscribing member (or roughly 18 accounts worth of alts) paying for this with plex brings the admin cost of the whole structure to somewhere around 8.2 billion isk per month. Which is still some way in advance of the price the Goons pay for their wardec (50m isk).

As for the corp hopping ally alt fandango - I'm not really sure how all that works.

Surely a better option would just doing something sensible for wardec ally costs in the first place?

The True Knowledge is that nothing matters that does not matter to you, might does make right and power makes freedom
MeBiatch
GRR GOONS
#67 - 2012-06-27 17:45:47 UTC
Jade Constantine wrote:
MeBiatch wrote:

jade why dont you just add all those former allies to your alliance? that way they can still fight for you?
edit if corp hopping pulls them into the war... just make a bunch of alts have then join star fraction then join the former allies corp to pull them into the war!


Well the alliance issue is always that you need to have as many alt-controlled pretend corps (for executor voting) as you do real corps - (otherwise you'll lose the alliance to a Band of Brothers disband thing) Basically each corp in the alliance gets to declare "support" secretly and you need to ensure you have a majority to keep your alliance. So practically - to maintain our 52 allies we'd need 52 alt corps each of which needs an active subscribing member (or roughly 18 accounts worth of alts) paying for this with plex brings the admin cost of the whole structure to somewhere around 8.2 billion isk per month. Which is still some way in advance of the price the Goons pay for their wardec (50m isk).

As for the corp hopping ally alt fandango - I'm not really sure how all that works.

Surely a better option would just doing something sensible for wardec ally costs in the first place?



so what you are saying is that to have a large alliance costs lots of isk and there is lots of risk associated with it like awoxers and such... so should an alliace who has spent the time negotiating and taking risk not have some advantages to it?

you only need one exec corp for the alliance and you can use one of your alts for it... just admit that you can just ask your former allies to join your alliance and it costs you nothing... infact it will cost goond more to dec you as your alliance will be bigger...

There are no stupid Questions... just stupid people... CCP Goliath wrote:

Ugh ti-di pooping makes me sad.
Marconus Orion
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#68 - 2012-06-27 17:52:34 UTC
Petition CCP to refund you the difference in those lost targets. CCP says the high cost to war dec those large alliances is access to tons of targets, but if that is not the case you should get your ISK back.
Jade Constantine
Jericho Fraction
The Star Fraction
#69 - 2012-06-27 17:53:05 UTC
MeBiatch wrote:
so what you are saying is that to have a large alliance costs lots of isk and there is lots of risk associated with it like awoxers and such... so should an alliace who has spent the time negotiating and taking risk not have some advantages to it?


You appear to have completely ignored the point that the goons need to pay 50m isk to declare a war that I'd need to pay 8.2b (per month) to defend with 1/20th the number.

As I said in my initial post - with the mechanics so completely skewed in favour of large alliances I'm honestly not surprised that most people choose corp hopping wardec evasion rather than playing with a fixed deck where the dealer controls all the cards.

The True Knowledge is that nothing matters that does not matter to you, might does make right and power makes freedom
MeBiatch
GRR GOONS
#70 - 2012-06-27 17:55:53 UTC
Jade Constantine wrote:
MeBiatch wrote:
so what you are saying is that to have a large alliance costs lots of isk and there is lots of risk associated with it like awoxers and such... so should an alliace who has spent the time negotiating and taking risk not have some advantages to it?


You appear to have completely ignored the point that the goons need to pay 50m isk to declare a war that I'd need to pay 8.2b (per month) to defend with 1/20th the number.

As I said in my initial post - with the mechanics so completely skewed in favour of large alliances I'm honestly not surprised that most people choose corp hopping wardec evasion rather than playing with a fixed deck where the dealer controls all the cards.



right just like you ignored the fact that you can save 8.2 billion by having those allies join your alliance! i mean thats what alliances are for right?

how about you send me the 8.2 billion isk and i will negotiate with your allies to join the star fraction...

There are no stupid Questions... just stupid people... CCP Goliath wrote:

Ugh ti-di pooping makes me sad.
Lin-Young Borovskova
Doomheim
#71 - 2012-06-27 17:57:53 UTC
Jade Constantine wrote:
MeBiatch wrote:
so what you are saying is that to have a large alliance costs lots of isk and there is lots of risk associated with it like awoxers and such... so should an alliace who has spent the time negotiating and taking risk not have some advantages to it?


You appear to have completely ignored the point that the goons need to pay 50m isk to declare a war that I'd need to pay 8.2b (per month) to defend with 1/20th the number.

As I said in my initial post - with the mechanics so completely skewed in favour of large alliances I'm honestly not surprised that most people choose corp hopping wardec evasion rather than playing with a fixed deck where the dealer controls all the cards.




The good stuff about this is that if you want to kill null sec players all you need to do is go there and shoot. No nee to pay concord fees whatsoever.

brb
Boober Fraggle
#72 - 2012-06-27 18:03:08 UTC  |  Edited by: Boober Fraggle
Alexzandvar Douglass wrote:
Sounds like some one's butthurt with AAA.

Corp hopping is part of the game, encouraged even.


They were supposed to fix that in this patch.

I was preoccupied and didn't read the patch notes much, but I suppose thats just another reason why the server is thinning out again... oh well.

Lol ninja edit, I called inferno a patch.
Marconus Orion
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#73 - 2012-06-27 18:04:08 UTC
So did the war dec change bring the merc world back into the spot light?
Price Check Aisle3
#74 - 2012-06-27 18:05:40 UTC
Marconus Orion wrote:
So did the war dec change bring the merc world back into the spot light?

No, it brought on Jade whining about the costs to defend against the 30 Goons bored enough to go to Empire.
  • Karl Hobb IATS
Katja Faith
Doomheim
#75 - 2012-06-27 18:23:49 UTC
*insert ban-hammer tin-foil-hat rant here*
Jade Constantine
Jericho Fraction
The Star Fraction
#76 - 2012-06-27 19:03:55 UTC
MeBiatch wrote:
Jade Constantine wrote:
MeBiatch wrote:
so what you are saying is that to have a large alliance costs lots of isk and there is lots of risk associated with it like awoxers and such... so should an alliace who has spent the time negotiating and taking risk not have some advantages to it?


You appear to have completely ignored the point that the goons need to pay 50m isk to declare a war that I'd need to pay 8.2b (per month) to defend with 1/20th the number.

As I said in my initial post - with the mechanics so completely skewed in favour of large alliances I'm honestly not surprised that most people choose corp hopping wardec evasion rather than playing with a fixed deck where the dealer controls all the cards.



right just like you ignored the fact that you can save 8.2 billion by having those allies join your alliance! i mean thats what alliances are for right?

how about you send me the 8.2 billion isk and i will negotiate with your allies to join the star fraction...


Read again. (harder this time).

The True Knowledge is that nothing matters that does not matter to you, might does make right and power makes freedom
Zyress
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#77 - 2012-06-27 19:45:27 UTC  |  Edited by: Zyress
Skippermonkey wrote:
Ptraci wrote:
Darius Brinn wrote:
FloppieTheBanjoClown wrote:
Vincent Athena wrote:
I thought there was a new rule: If you drop from a corp at war you could not re-join for awhile, like a week.

This. One of our guys dropped corp and had to wait 7 days to rejoin. It's no longer a trivial matter to drop corp while at war.


Still, he can avoid the consequences of being at war,



He can do that by not logging on, too. Are you going to complain to CCP that you can't force people to log on?


Camping them out of the game is its own reward

Camping and then to have them coast past you after they just left the corp is no reward


They pay for their subscription too, no mechanic in the game should allow you to force them not to play, even for 24 hours. I'm in a one man corp, purely for the purpose of tax evasion. If someone dec'd my corp I would not hesitate to abandon it for an npc corp or for a new player corp I create. I should not have to pay dec fees to someone who decided to dec me and my play time should not be impinged upon by having to dock up to avoid either a larger attacking force or an equal force with nuetral reppers. I'm not afraid of a fair fight but as has been pointed out on these forums many times a fair fight only occurs when the attacker screwed up.
Gogela
Epic Ganking Time
CODE.
#78 - 2012-06-27 21:35:55 UTC
It's obviously bullshit. A 24 hour (at least) exit timer should exist for people dropping corp to avoid a war. Joining and leaving corps isn't a tactical mechanic, though it's apparently being used as one. CCP knows that. They should do something about it.

Signatures should be used responsibly...
Ursula Thrace
Dreamland Augmented Consortium
#79 - 2012-06-27 21:44:46 UTC
i think the OP has a valid argument. why is corp-hopping during wars even allowed? isn't ccp trying to encourage pvp?

eve online original intro
Marconus Orion
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#80 - 2012-06-27 21:51:31 UTC
Price Check Aisle3 wrote:
Marconus Orion wrote:
So did the war dec change bring the merc world back into the spot light?

No, it brought on Jade whining about the costs to defend against the 30 Goons bored enough to go to Empire.

If only players were able to war dec those 30 bored goons without having to dec an entire alliance...