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Where is the CSM? Do they support the sandbox or not?

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Kiteo Hatto
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#41 - 2012-06-23 05:10:34 UTC
Antisocial Malkavian wrote:
Shameless Avenger wrote:
Meh... I've been here long enough to have an idea of what the CSM & CCP are going to do. What I want to know is what Sony is going to do. That's a little more difficult to predict since we don't really know the finals details on how much control can EVE Trillionaires will have over Dust players. Any theories?


What are the CSM and CCP trying to do then?


Coming up with a masterplan of not pissing off too many and pleasing as many as they can ofcourse!



probably will fail though.......gosh,why am i so bitter these days.
Shameless Avenger
Can Preachers of Kador
#42 - 2012-06-23 05:12:04 UTC
Kiteo Hatto wrote:
Shameless Avenger wrote:
Meh... I've been here long enough to have an idea of what the CSM & CCP are going to do. What I want to know is what Sony is going to do. That's a little more difficult to predict since we don't really know the finals details on how much control can EVE Trillionaires will have over Dust players. Any theories?


Probably use hollow shells filled with isk instead of dangerous materials for orbital strikes, if things get bad enough(on the oh so cold and harsh "grief") side then we'll have npc bots firin' off orbital strikes when dust guys command them to.


Yup... that what I was thinking... an NPCfication of dust... if and only if, the grief factor becomes an issue.

"This is the Ninja. He will scan you down; he will salvage your wrecks and there shall be no aggro"
Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe
#43 - 2012-06-23 05:12:45 UTC
Kiteo Hatto wrote:
Shameless Avenger wrote:
Meh... I've been here long enough to have an idea of what the CSM & CCP are going to do. What I want to know is what Sony is going to do. That's a little more difficult to predict since we don't really know the finals details on how much control can EVE Trillionaires will have over Dust players. Any theories?

Probably use hollow shells filled with isk instead of dangerous materials for orbital strikes, if things get bad enough(on the oh so cold and harsh "grief") side then we'll have npc bots firin' off orbital strikes when dust guys command them to.

B-b-bots???

Triggered by: Wars of Sovless Agression, Bending the Knee, Twisting the Knife, Eating Sov Wheaties, Bombless Bombers, Fizzlesov, Interceptor Fleets, Running Away, GhostTime Vuln, Renters, Bombs, Bubbles ?
Linna Excel
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#44 - 2012-06-23 05:12:49 UTC
The sandbox is all good fun until someone melts the sand into a bigger glass cannon then the one you have!



I think a better question is: how does the CSM describe eve's sandbox? I mean they could say they support the sandbox and think that concord/hi sec is stupid because those things are anti-sandbox. From a certain perspective, ie unrestricted PvP everywhere, they would have something of a point.

I can has blogging skills!
EvEa Deva
Doomheim
#45 - 2012-06-23 05:14:20 UTC
Im on the fence with this one, ill just watch and see how it plays out.


On topic.... lol CSM speaking for us
Shameless Avenger
Can Preachers of Kador
#46 - 2012-06-23 05:14:22 UTC
Kiteo Hatto wrote:
Antisocial Malkavian wrote:
Shameless Avenger wrote:
Meh... I've been here long enough to have an idea of what the CSM & CCP are going to do. What I want to know is what Sony is going to do. That's a little more difficult to predict since we don't really know the finals details on how much control can EVE Trillionaires will have over Dust players. Any theories?


What are the CSM and CCP trying to do then?


Coming up with a masterplan of not pissing off too many and pleasing as many as they can ofcourse!



probably will fail though.......gosh,why am i so bitter these days.


Agreed again. The same ole Generic Marriage Counselor procedure... ignore who is right, ignore who is wrong, declare a theoretical happy medium, ?????, profit.

"This is the Ninja. He will scan you down; he will salvage your wrecks and there shall be no aggro"
Kiteo Hatto
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#47 - 2012-06-23 05:15:08 UTC  |  Edited by: Kiteo Hatto
Alavaria Fera wrote:
Kiteo Hatto wrote:
Shameless Avenger wrote:
Meh... I've been here long enough to have an idea of what the CSM & CCP are going to do. What I want to know is what Sony is going to do. That's a little more difficult to predict since we don't really know the finals details on how much control can EVE Trillionaires will have over Dust players. Any theories?

Probably use hollow shells filled with isk instead of dangerous materials for orbital strikes, if things get bad enough(on the oh so cold and harsh "grief") side then we'll have npc bots firin' off orbital strikes when dust guys command them to.

B-b-bots???


Shocking right!? You should start an event where you start ganking concord, they clearly don't belong in your sandbox! God forbid ccp "invites" more carebearing npcs into this game!

/sarcasm <-- just incase i didn't "define" it clearly.
Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe
#48 - 2012-06-23 05:18:59 UTC
Shameless Avenger wrote:
Kiteo Hatto wrote:
Coming up with a masterplan of not pissing off too many and pleasing as many as they can ofcourse!

probably will fail though.......gosh,why am i so bitter these days.

Agreed again. The same ole Generic Marriage Counselor procedure... ignore who is right, ignore who is wrong, declare a theoretical happy medium, ?????, profit.

Hm, with a big Mission Accomplished banner?

Triggered by: Wars of Sovless Agression, Bending the Knee, Twisting the Knife, Eating Sov Wheaties, Bombless Bombers, Fizzlesov, Interceptor Fleets, Running Away, GhostTime Vuln, Renters, Bombs, Bubbles ?
Antisocial Malkavian
Antisocial Malkavians
#49 - 2012-06-23 05:22:08 UTC  |  Edited by: Antisocial Malkavian
Kiteo Hatto wrote:
Antisocial Malkavian wrote:
Shameless Avenger wrote:
Meh... I've been here long enough to have an idea of what the CSM & CCP are going to do. What I want to know is what Sony is going to do. That's a little more difficult to predict since we don't really know the finals details on how much control can EVE Trillionaires will have over Dust players. Any theories?


What are the CSM and CCP trying to do then?


Coming up with a masterplan of not pissing off too many and pleasing as many as they can ofcourse!



probably will fail though.......gosh,why am i so bitter these days.


Well it is well known that when you try to make everyone happy you fail. They should just throw their weight behind Goons, deal with the sub losses and go back to HTFU land

It would be hilarious however if they DID THAT and then Goons left.

I think the bigger question is do the CSM really care?

EvEa Deva wrote:
Im on the fence with this one, ill just watch and see how it plays out.


On topic.... lol CSM speaking for us


lol the Mittani-less CSM mattering

And, isn't sanity really just a one-trick pony anyway? I mean all you get is one trick, rational thinking, but when you're good and crazy, oooh, oooh, oooh, the sky is the limit.

Kiteo Hatto
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#50 - 2012-06-23 05:27:19 UTC
Quote:
Hm, with a big Mission Accomplished banner?

In a sense, i can almost see CCP writing a "big sorry, we didn't test it enough" letter and then mittens takes the heat off by rambling about something(and maybe even stating that he wanted to test the limit of the sandbox for the our greater good or something) irrelevant in the interview and ccp points to it to get some "this is a big sandbox" publicity to attract new, gullible potential players.

The next trailer will probably be about some large alliance manipulating market or something....."I was there and I profited, eve is real".
Antisocial Malkavian
Antisocial Malkavians
#51 - 2012-06-23 05:30:26 UTC  |  Edited by: Antisocial Malkavian
Kiteo Hatto wrote:
Quote:
Hm, with a big Mission Accomplished banner?

In a sense, i can almost see CCP writing a "big sorry, we didn't test it enough" letter and then mittens takes the heat off by rambling about something(and maybe even stating that he wanted to test the limit of the sandbox for the our greater good or something) irrelevant in the interview and ccp points to it to get some "this is a big sandbox" publicity to attract new, gullible potential players.

The next trailer will probably be about some large alliance manipulating market or something....."I was there and I profited, eve is real".


oooh ooh, by saying he wasnt drunk.

That way they can focus the anger on him, ban him a week, have him throw a hissy fit on Twitter again, and we can have burn Jita again and everyone forgets again cause you know, it worked so well the first time

And, isn't sanity really just a one-trick pony anyway? I mean all you get is one trick, rational thinking, but when you're good and crazy, oooh, oooh, oooh, the sky is the limit.

Chokichi Ozuwara
Perkone
Caldari State
#52 - 2012-06-23 05:31:03 UTC  |  Edited by: Chokichi Ozuwara
Kiteo Hatto wrote:
they still proceeded to do it knowing it was the lack of testing/listening on ccp's side.

I reckon since CCP does so little listening and testing, it serves them right.

I appreciate what they did, and will be looking for future opportunities to game the system now that I know the upside.

Tears will be shed and pants will need to be changed all round.
Shameless Avenger
Can Preachers of Kador
#53 - 2012-06-23 05:31:14 UTC
Antisocial Malkavian wrote:


Well it is well known that when you try to make everyone happy you fail. They should just throw their weight behind Goons, deal with the sub losses and go back to HTFU land

It would be hilarious however if they DID THAT and then Goons left.


But if that happens... poor CCP Prism will most likely be the "lucky one" stuck with coding the following:

foreach ($goon) {
$goon->find-goon-alts();
foreach($goon->alts as $alt) {
ban($alt);
}
ban($goon);
}

I can't imagine how long that would take.

"This is the Ninja. He will scan you down; he will salvage your wrecks and there shall be no aggro"
InternetSpaceship
State War Academy
Caldari State
#54 - 2012-06-23 05:31:22 UTC
Merdaneth wrote:

CCP has every right to ban or reverse these transactions, ban the partcipants etc.. If the purpose was to test the game design, they could have done it on the test server. The purpose was obviously to gain an unfair advantage, to profit disproportionately from the design error.


I really don't have any problem with this, but as was said in the OP, CCP stated that no rule was really broken here. If no rule was broken, and they acknowledge that something like this is typical of Eve players, why are the people involved having assets taken away?

All we really want is consistency.

Official Recruiter for GoonSwarm Corporation.

If you paid isk to get into GoonSwarm, you were probably scammed.  If you had the foresight to save the name of your scammer, let me know and I'll do what I can to help you.
Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe
#55 - 2012-06-23 05:31:50 UTC
Chokichi Ozuwara wrote:
Kiteo Hatto wrote:
they still proceeded to do it knowing it was the lack of testing/listening on ccp's side.

I reckon, since CCP does so little listening and testing, it's serves them right.

I appreciate what they did, and will be looking for future opportunities to game the system now that I know the upside.

Having GD scream at you, or all your assets being frozen for investigation?

Triggered by: Wars of Sovless Agression, Bending the Knee, Twisting the Knife, Eating Sov Wheaties, Bombless Bombers, Fizzlesov, Interceptor Fleets, Running Away, GhostTime Vuln, Renters, Bombs, Bubbles ?
Antisocial Malkavian
Antisocial Malkavians
#56 - 2012-06-23 05:33:53 UTC
InternetSpaceship wrote:
Merdaneth wrote:

CCP has every right to ban or reverse these transactions, ban the partcipants etc.. If the purpose was to test the game design, they could have done it on the test server. The purpose was obviously to gain an unfair advantage, to profit disproportionately from the design error.


I really don't have any problem with this, but as was said in the OP, CCP stated that no rule was really broken here. If no rule was broken, and they acknowledge that something like this is typical of Eve players, why are the people involved having assets taken away?

All we really want is consistency.


Wait you ARE having assets seized, hell, they didnt do THAT for BoB lol
You all should have had a dev caught in the scheme -.-

And, isn't sanity really just a one-trick pony anyway? I mean all you get is one trick, rational thinking, but when you're good and crazy, oooh, oooh, oooh, the sky is the limit.

Zagdul
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#57 - 2012-06-23 05:34:02 UTC
CCP Screwed up on this one. The writing was on the wall about the mechanic becoming a potential exploit and CCP ignored it.

They ask for feedback.

They ask for bug reports.

They ignored us. They did it with the unified inventory as well.

CCP knows best, always. It continually bites them in the ass. However, now that someone has used one of their cockups to an advantage, they're probably going to take it out on the player instead of owning up to being the responsible ones. It's CCP, I don't see them admitting blame for their mistake. The Goon pilots who participated in this will most likely be the ones being punished when the developers who didn't catch this and the community team who didn't communicate this are the real people at fault.


Dual Pane idea: Click!

CCP Please Implement
Chokichi Ozuwara
Perkone
Caldari State
#58 - 2012-06-23 05:36:54 UTC
Alavaria Fera wrote:
Chokichi Ozuwara wrote:
Kiteo Hatto wrote:
they still proceeded to do it knowing it was the lack of testing/listening on ccp's side.

I reckon, since CCP does so little listening and testing, it's serves them right.

I appreciate what they did, and will be looking for future opportunities to game the system now that I know the upside.

Having GD scream at you, or all your assets being frozen for investigation?

Who cares? These are small people with small agendas. My spaceship laughs at them and my crokite could care less.

Tears will be shed and pants will need to be changed all round.
Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe
#59 - 2012-06-23 05:36:58 UTC
Zagdul wrote:
CCP Screwed up on this one. The writing was on the wall about the mechanic becoming a potential exploit and CCP ignored it.

They ask for feedback.

They ask for bug reports.

They ignored us. They did it with the unified inventory as well.

CCP knows best, always. It continually bites them in the ass. However, now that someone has used one of their cockups to an advantage, they're probably going to take it out on the player instead of owning up to being the responsible ones. It's CCP, I don't see them admitting blame for their mistake. The Goon pilots who participated in this will most likely be the ones being punished when the developers who didn't catch this and the community team who didn't communicate this are the real people at fault.

*shrug* It's a sandbox, I guess there's enough sand to bury people in...

Triggered by: Wars of Sovless Agression, Bending the Knee, Twisting the Knife, Eating Sov Wheaties, Bombless Bombers, Fizzlesov, Interceptor Fleets, Running Away, GhostTime Vuln, Renters, Bombs, Bubbles ?
Kiteo Hatto
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#60 - 2012-06-23 05:38:12 UTC
If goons somehow leave, ccp will create npc goons. They will be a non playable pirate race that lives in null somewhere.....attacking everything on sight and trash talking in local, i don't know really. I can imagine that npc goons will be the thing that will attract a lot of high sec players to null though. I mean, how tempting will it be to shoot something with a name Goonium Marauder, right ?