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Issues thread for the new font on SiSi

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Spc One
The Chodak
Void Alliance
#321 - 2011-11-18 20:32:12 UTC
I have an idea.

In some cases old font is better than the new font.
I suggest keeping old and new font (both fonts).

By default eve client will load new font, while player can still change font in eve client.
I think this is very nice idea and i think it's doable.
Jodis Talvanen
State War Academy
Caldari State
#322 - 2011-11-18 20:47:03 UTC
Spc One wrote:
I have an idea.

In some cases old font is better than the new font.
I suggest keeping old and new font (both fonts).

By default eve client will load new font, while player can still change font in eve client.
I think this is very nice idea and i think it's doable.

Supported.

I hate it when the NEW is suppoed to be better but it ISNT.
Bemoliph Ashriden
#323 - 2011-11-18 21:19:18 UTC
Thanks for adding some shadow to in-space text so it's not completely invisible against bright backgrounds. It's still a little bit hard to read, though, so can the shadows be made a tiny bit more prominent? Compare shadows on TQ to SiSi's latest build.
Nari Neya
Vhero' Multipurpose Corp
#324 - 2011-11-18 21:25:50 UTC
How could you put this atrocity in front of anyone's eyes?
Bloodpetal
Tir Capital Management Group
#325 - 2011-11-19 16:29:34 UTC
Seeing the '.' in the speedometer is very difficult for values such as : 31.1 m/s

It is also very very small on larger screens and hard to read in general even on smaller screens in stressful situations

SpeedoDOT


This was identified by SMT008 on Visual Little Features

Can we see about getting this resolved?

Thanks! Cool

Where I am.
el alasar
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#326 - 2011-11-19 17:05:15 UTC
Bloodpetal wrote:
Seeing the '.' in the speedometer is very difficult for values such as : 31.1 m/s

It is also very very small on larger screens and hard to read in general even on smaller screens in stressful situations

SpeedoDOT


This was identified by SMT008 on Visual Little Features

Can we see about getting this resolved?

Thanks! Cool

yes, pretty please!

check the moderated 10000 papercuts evelopedia page! http://wiki.eveonline.com/en/wiki/Little_things_and_ideas_-_low_hanging_fruit_-_10000_papercuts comment, bump(!) and like what you like
Jodis Talvanen
State War Academy
Caldari State
#327 - 2011-11-20 00:59:31 UTC
You know what, the new font is so unpolished I'm just going to use the old font.


OH WAIT, WE CAN'T


QQ
Tonto Auri
Vhero' Multipurpose Corp
#328 - 2011-11-21 12:38:44 UTC
Jodis Talvanen wrote:
You know what, the new font is so unpolished I'm just going to use the old font.


OH WAIT, WE CAN'T


QQ

Making proper font is not an one-day task. Not even one month. It takes alot of time to just draw glyphs. And that's only beginning.

Two most common elements in the universe are hydrogen and stupidity. -- Harlan Ellison
Grey Stormshadow
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#329 - 2011-11-22 20:49:46 UTC
If I may ask one more tweak, it would be really nice if you could make "name list" font resize together with chat font.

It looks bit funny when you have small font in chat, but huge font in name list. Name list seem to take awful much space compared to chat area also.

Image to prove the point http://i.imgur.com/IovS4.jpg

Get classic forum style - custom videos to captains quarters screen

Play with the best - die like the rest
Psychophantic
#330 - 2011-11-23 03:31:27 UTC  |  Edited by: Psychophantic
Any word on being able to keep the old good looking font?

Can someone post a pic of the angluar , radial and velocity columns in a crowded envrironment. Curious to see how the non-fixed width numbers look.
Grey Stormshadow
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#331 - 2011-11-23 05:32:55 UTC  |  Edited by: Grey Stormshadow
Took a peek to the latest RC version in SiSi and in my mind the new font is usable with 90% scaling now, but...

Cry It still has very much uniformity issues what comes to font sizes in different places(Fixed now)
Big smile Numbers are not fixed width. (Fixed now)
What?Letter spacing seems to be way too big while using some of the smallest font sizes in chat. (Fixed now)
SmileName list font size doesn't scale down with the chat font and that looks bit odd as the default name list font is such big. (Fixed now)
StraightIt becomes bit grainy on some tool tips (check wallet, balance for example). (Fixed now)
ShockedFeature to lock down windows to their places has been removed due to technical reasons (= new font or scaling killed it). (Fixed now)

However there has been plenty of improvement from the "1st version" and the scaling in general has been really welcome.
I find current status of UI acceptable with the given time and modifications they had to do in such short time, but looking forward
to some finishing touches in the future Roll.

Get classic forum style - custom videos to captains quarters screen

Play with the best - die like the rest
Pinky Denmark
The Cursed Navy
#332 - 2011-11-24 13:16:57 UTC
The font isn't too large - it's too fat...
Besides that my 21" 4:3 screen is too small Lol

Seriously I like the new font. I like it BECAUSE it feels oldskool. My only problem is that my head starts hurting when I try to read an in-game description of something. Im not kidding and maybe I need glasses but I'm 100% honest about this...

Also I have trouble seeing dots and commas...

ALSO: When using calculators and numbers many of us euros are using commas before decimals instead of dots.
like 1.000.000,00 instead of 1,000,000.00 -> could we plz have commas working like dots for calculator/number entries? Our keyboards are designed for it and it's annoying to pay 100x the price of something because we were supposed to use a DOT instead of a comma.

Pinky
Ris Dnalor
Tribal Liberation Force
Minmatar Republic
#333 - 2011-11-25 01:59:59 UTC
I want the old font, I like the UI having things in all caps. I don't like this change at all.

for me it wasn't broken, but now it's being 'fixed' and I can't opt out of this and use the old.

I don't really care about technical issues, it makes me unhappy.

https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=118961

EvE = Everybody Vs. Everybody

  • Qolde
Endymi Typhirr
#334 - 2011-11-25 07:31:00 UTC  |  Edited by: Endymi Typhirr
Chief issue? The new font is TOO FREAKING BIG at 100% scaling, while the 90% scaling isn't polished enough (for those on the usual 96-110 PPI screens) and makes the "smaller font sizes at 100%" (such as small labels) horrifically uncomfortable to read. Additionally, the larger fonts in the small text areas under things such as module icons in the hanger makes the longer names of modules/ships nearly impossible to differentiate without hovering them. For example, in icon view, I now have to hover several rigs until the full name tooltip is displayed just to tell them apart, or switch my view to list or details views, which affects workflow greatly and makes icon view a very tedious method of navigating the UI. This hurts user experience.

Note: I have better than "perfect" (aka 20:20) eyesight. I'm big on typography. I do design work and dabble in UX. What has been done so far is incomplete and not ready for release.

If people have bigger screens and want to see things from further away, the larger scaling is perfect. The scaling over 100% looks and works wonderfully for these folks. However, for everyone else, you're not merely robbing us of what was a workable font size (given the UI that we must work with), but actually hurting usability. Does anyone at CCP do these kinds of studies? Merely examining the consequences of the font size change for a few minutes could get you plenty of this feedback--which is scattered around the forum and the input from players in-game.

I'd love to see this new font in-game and done right, but just giving us little things like being able to change the font to a reasonable size only on the overview is not enough. There are underlying issues with the current UI that simply were not designed for the larger size and you cannot simply shoehorn the larger default font size into it. There's many places where the larger font size does not work.

I know that this is only the first step, and I won't harp on further about the problems here, however, the short-term solution is reasonably simple:

Make the default/reference font size (the one used at 100% scaling) approximately one point size smaller. The difference brings it much closer to the old (current) font size and would solve all these problems. This is roughly the equivalent of pressing the "a-" button in the chat windows. Do this.

Of course, I'd be surprised if you would/could do this in the last few days before rollout. The answer? DELAY THE PATCH! Nobody is going to blame you for delaying the patch for a bit of essential tweaking. I can almost guarantee that you will tick off many people after the expansion is launched and it will be your primary focus after the rollout. Why unnecessarily hassle the players and risk a ruckus with a lack of due diligence? Please give this serious thought.

Other than that, I like it. Good job on such short notice. Cool

[Edit: I should mention there are still issues with the font in general, but I want to focus on this issue in this post.]

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Jodis Talvanen
State War Academy
Caldari State
#335 - 2011-11-26 13:47:39 UTC
I agree on the font being incomplete and not ready for release. CCP please really don't released unfinished rubbish you really need to stop doing this.



Also, please see the following two screenshots. There seems to be a polished smaller font used in chat (which is good) but it is not used anywhere else in the UI.

@UI scale 90%, the smallest and the second smallest font in chat looks very polished unlike the other areas in the UI.
Please use this polished font to replace the scambled text.

smallest font in chat is very nice:
http://img220.imageshack.us/img220/1622/20111126133434.png

second smallest font in chat as well:
http://img39.imageshack.us/img39/4994/20111126133511.png
Sutha Moliko
Giza'Msafara
#336 - 2011-11-26 16:43:45 UTC  |  Edited by: Sutha Moliko
Latest build 320935 on Sisi

1) All digit separators are wrong (a hypen instead of a comma)
http://dl.eve-files.com/media/1111/digit_pb.jpg

2) All ship names or cargo container names with special caracters (using alt+#) are not displayed. However, theses special caracters are correctly displayed in any chat windows.

Edit
Everything is back to normal with the actual build 321088
Onyx Mamba
F.A.M.I.L.Y
DarkSide.
#337 - 2011-11-27 18:18:13 UTC  |  Edited by: Onyx Mamba
CCP don't kill the game! The font is sh...t! I've seen it for the first time today in Singularity and my eyes and head gone dizzy in 30 secs. If this font was so expensive for the company just not to use it, so MAKE IT OPTIONAL! Give us the right to choose! I don't want to play in my favourite game with this [censored].

So [censored] PLEASE.

I just have to speak this way cause i feel you're going to deploy this patch as is with the smile on the face and like it's everythings fine
Jodis Talvanen
State War Academy
Caldari State
#338 - 2011-11-27 18:55:26 UTC
CCP please do not release this font because it is incomplete and unfinished.

PLEASE DELAY THE RELEASE or MAKE IT OPTIONAL (and make future updates)
Jodis Talvanen
State War Academy
Caldari State
#339 - 2011-11-27 23:33:49 UTC
Because what will happen is that people will rage again because of this font, you dont want to have incursion 2.0 happening again
Sturmwolke
#340 - 2011-11-28 04:06:48 UTC  |  Edited by: Sturmwolke
Late to the SISI scene (bld 321215), didn't read whole thread.
If anyone's still monitoring this thread, 2 quick things :

- New fonts are "jaggy" and it scrapes your eyes when looking at it. Headache inducing. Needs to be smoothed.
- Eastern characters aka Chinese/Japanese kanji don't show up well. Infact, they're blurred (when compared to the old font) making it hard to read.

Update:
Ok, running it back to default 100% scale and 10pts (on a 1680x1050 screen) makes it somewhat acceptable.
Eastern characters are still blurred and if that carries over into the Japanese/Chinese localization, you're going to get an uproar.
"Scraping eyes" effect is still there however - the word spacing are horrendous. Probably the major contributor to those headaches that people are experiencing when reading.