EVE General Discussion

Why when I can stuff all the carebears in the noobzone (highsec) where they all have to undercut each other endlessly to make money because of the anti-PVP environment that doesn't let them fight over access to resources, and just roll in once in a while and buy their bargain-basement priced goods? I save time and money with the current system. There is zero incentive for me to throw carebear chum in the ocean for the sharks to get a whiff of.

I know you don't care what happens with null, it shows with your inability to follow this thread and lack of knowledge of 0.0 gameplay and mechanics. You don't need to state those sort of things, they come out loud and clear in the subtext.
But this is a thread about how to make the space more vibrant and active, so I'm going to throw out some facts based on experience to counter the baseless opinions of people with limited to no experience of what they're talking about.

"hiseccers are entitled to 120m/hr vanguards to fund all of the huge undertakings that hiseccers usually run, like"

Following the thread fine, thanks.

Been listening to 0.0 entities whining for 4+ years about hi-sec. Far as I can tell - null sec residents are still the best argument against living (full time) in null sec.

Since when do renters have to PvP? Our damn sure don't. We don't shoot them if they pay the rent.....that is pretty much the beginning and end of that interface. Unless they WANT to PvP, and there are other avenues available there.



That's easy, don't play politics. I don't I don't have to, I have to have all of the ships to cover prescribed doctrines and show up when there is a fight. Politics is easy, "Not Blue Shoot It " the end. Protection for carebears? magic 8 ball says odds are not good. Why?

Simple, you can't. As it stands the industrial ships can't be defended, if I spy lights a cyno and dropped 85 drakes and a few dictors on a mining fleet....its dead. This isn't a mystery, the crap happens, frequently http://www.evenews24.com/2012/06/14/providence-alliance-gets-schooled-by-a-spy-in-0-y5jq/

Not to mention the added joy of "What the **** do I do with it" Remember Legion of xXDeathXx they held a LOT of space and rented to anyone that could pay. RMT'd the profits and supplied the infrastructure to get the material out. Simple fact was that drone poo was unless in null sec, and a HELL of a lot easier to haul than minerals. So all of the market and refining work happened in empire.




Wrong, its simply easier haul things back and forth as ships and modules then it is to make it here, other than super cap production, its more efficient to just go to empire. ......and you don't even have to worry about someone coming by and taking the station. Null stations don't have as much slots for research or production, the refining rates kind of suck ect ect. The best you are going to get is one of the 5-8(is it I forget) seeded stations that CCP put in when they introduced player outposts.

The idea of moving a non-cloaky hauler from one end of -A- space to the other is suicidal, even scouted you would be DAMN lucky to make it since pretty much any 3 month old pilot with a saber is going to slaughter you, and lets face it, I don't know many real industrialists that are going to turn a profit moving 10,000m3 viators back and forth.


....and the "lack of content" thing is easy to figure out by certain parties, they are blue 3/4s of the way around the map, everyone doesn't have that luxury.

I am going to top-post on this quote for readability.

You said it is impossible to defend carebears doing mining ops.

If this is true, then the game mechanics that make it impossible should be looked at.

Perhaps easily deployable cyno jammers (only works for 1 day out of a week because the mobile jammer damages subspace?)? Perhaps changes to the jump gate mechanics (not possible considering the capabilities of the dev team (which is why my accounts are cancelled))?

Looking at this area would seem to be very productive. Wolves need sheep. Sheep will not go into a den of wolves unless some of the wolves promise protection. The protection does not have to be perfect, but it does have to be possible and likely.

Even if these problems were solved, would any of you wolves want to do police patrol? Probably not.

Which brings me back to my first post in this thread: Get rid of the choke points into null. There should be so many entrances to null that it will not be possible guard even a 1/100 of them. Then the more aggressive sheep will at least take chances. As it is, if any sheep go into null, they are absolutely guaranteed NO benefits and a 100% chance of death. (yes, I know it is possible to run around with a T3 or a small cloaky ship but what can you do with one of those?)

Yea, except mining in highsec is actually riskier lol
at least in 0.0 you know who WANTS to shoot at you.

Bringing in outsiders to mine nullsec systems as renters or whatever isn't much of an improvement.

You can make tons of isk (for a miner) cherry picking the highends. Then they will jump back to highsec to sell it and do what ever, because there isn't much else to do in nullsec besides pvp and fleet battles.

So instead of an empty system, you'll have a system that is used for a few hours for hulks with rorq bonuses to pick out the ABC. Then it goes back to being empty because there isn't any other reason to stay there. Probably no station, and living out of a POS is lame. Even if there was a station, the services aren't as good as highsec.

Inviting miners to nullsec means they'll pullout the high ends, pay what ever usage fee, and then go back to highsec to build stuff, or just sell it, and what ever it is miners do when they aren't mining.


Letting the carebears in provides more targets for roaming gangs, but only when the carebears are active in nullsec. Mining alone doesn't really provide that, especially once the carebears wise up to running a safer miner op.

Nicolo makes an excellent point about nullsec being stuck as a raw material exporter. Until that changes, adding carebears just means a few more players hangout just long enough to make some isk and then the systems goes back to being empty.

I advise you to realize that this type of activity is not limited to JUST ONE PERSON. Love how you guys go on and on about, "Damn those carebears thinking this is a solo game when it is a multi-player game! MAKE FRIENDS!!!" Then shout that moon probing entire areas HAS to be done by one guy.

Please explain.

I disagree. First, you guys have the guns. If the miners think they can just cherry-pick the best minerals and run, your guns would show them it is not possible. Even if they do just cherry-pick, what difference does it make to you since the minerals would just sit there and never get mined. At least this way, you have money coming in and...

And, you would have targets. No, not the ones mining in YOUR space. You would have targets in your enemy's space. Other than the empire-building, THIS is what you guys are after. The hunt.

There is nothing to hunt in nullsec right now. Everything there is either too risky to attack or requires huge fleets. Go ahead and say it is not like this and then I will point out that this whole thread started because it IS like this.

You want good hunting? You need to provide it.