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@CCP : Do not cave in to Goons on Inferno 1.1

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David Cedarbridge
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#121 - 2012-06-18 03:53:55 UTC
Marconus Orion wrote:
Alia Gon'die wrote:
Caliph Muhammed wrote:


You're welcome. DevSwarm wins you the game. You can't beat the man with the pencil.


Look at that one post. Who is im mrmessy?

I will further challenge you, can you find more than one post of Goons asking for this change? Maybe one that people have heard of?


How many times are you going to move the goal post?

Drawing attention to a yet-to-be-met standard is not moving goalposts. Good attempt though.
Richard Desturned
Royal Amarr Institute
Amarr Empire
#122 - 2012-06-18 04:03:04 UTC  |  Edited by: Richard Desturned
Caliph Muhammed wrote:
You're welcome. DevSwarm wins you the game.


so im mrmessy, some membercorp dude I've never heard of, apparently dictates GSF's policy on these things

lol

also fyi that post was /after/ Goliath made the announcement, it's even in the same thread

try again!

npc alts have no opinions worth consideration
Richard Desturned
Royal Amarr Institute
Amarr Empire
#123 - 2012-06-18 04:06:22 UTC
Marconus Orion wrote:
How many times are you going to move the goal post?


You should feel bad for getting on the "hurr goonswarm cares about wardecs" bandwagon

npc alts have no opinions worth consideration
Eternal Error
Doomheim
#124 - 2012-06-18 04:32:49 UTC
I haven't read this thread (I have read the OP as well as similar posts in the dev blog thread).

This change has nothing to do with goonswarm. Anyone who even remotely understands the wardec system could tell (even before the inferno changes went live) that the ally system in its current state is broken. Is the 1.1 solution perfect? No. Does the cost escalate too quickly? Yea.

But it has nothing to do with goonswarm, so quit your bitching and ****** posts. It's a step in the right direction.
Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe
#125 - 2012-06-18 04:47:45 UTC
Richard Desturned wrote:
Caliph Muhammed wrote:
You're welcome. DevSwarm wins you the game.

so im mrmessy, some membercorp dude I've never heard of, apparently dictates GSF's policy on these things

lol

also fyi that post was /after/ Goliath made the announcement, it's even in the same thread

try again!

We can go back in time.... tat's how good we are apparently.

Triggered by: Wars of Sovless Agression, Bending the Knee, Twisting the Knife, Eating Sov Wheaties, Bombless Bombers, Fizzlesov, Interceptor Fleets, Running Away, GhostTime Vuln, Renters, Bombs, Bubbles ?
MotherMoon
Tribal Liberation Force
Minmatar Republic
#126 - 2012-06-18 05:10:05 UTC
Alavaria Fera wrote:
MotherMoon wrote:
also if your fighting a null sec allaince why do you even need a declared war in the 1st place? you do know war decs have no meaning in 0.0 right?

Camping Jita is a war unto itself.


exactly. When has goonswarm needed a wardec to troll in high sec before? whats that? never? oh right.

http://dl.eve-files.com/media/1206/scimi.jpg
Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe
#127 - 2012-06-18 05:37:18 UTC
MotherMoon wrote:
Alavaria Fera wrote:
MotherMoon wrote:
also if your fighting a null sec allaince why do you even need a declared war in the 1st place? you do know war decs have no meaning in 0.0 right?

Camping Jita is a war unto itself.


exactly. When has goonswarm needed a wardec to troll in high sec before? whats that? never? oh right.

We were talking about Jade's Jita/Hek/Rens camping coalition and why they need 40+ or something allies.

Triggered by: Wars of Sovless Agression, Bending the Knee, Twisting the Knife, Eating Sov Wheaties, Bombless Bombers, Fizzlesov, Interceptor Fleets, Running Away, GhostTime Vuln, Renters, Bombs, Bubbles ?
Commit Sudoku
Perkone
Caldari State
#128 - 2012-06-18 05:44:53 UTC
EternalFlow
Hedion University
Amarr Empire
#129 - 2012-06-18 09:13:36 UTC
I want to be at war with everyone in high sec all of the time, why hasn't ccp made this happen?
TheGunslinger42
All Web Investigations
#130 - 2012-06-18 10:02:36 UTC
I find soundwaves statements lolworthy. Eve isn't far, war shouldn't be! Oh what, the mechanics are such that a small corporation managed to dogpile allies and retalliate against a 9000 man alliance? That's not fair! FIX IT NOW!

Here's what we should do:
Take the 1.0 mechanics, except change it so mutual wars can't have allies.

No exponential costs for having allies, no other bs that makes it ridiculously skewed in favour of bigger alliances / aggressors.
Maraner
The Executioners
Capital Punishment.
#131 - 2012-06-18 11:09:49 UTC
Agree with Jade, this smells like goons or their friends have manipulated or pulled strings to get 1.1 to the state it is. If goons dont have a problem with 1.0 as it stands then come out and support it and rail against the new changes.

This is a BS change, let the server run as it is, it's player led. This 'rebalance' benefits the big alliances yet again.
Alia Gon'die
Outer Ring Applied Logistics
#132 - 2012-06-18 11:16:28 UTC  |  Edited by: Alia Gon'die
Maraner wrote:
Agree with Jade, this smells like goons or their friends have manipulated or pulled strings to get 1.1 to the state it is. If goons dont have a problem with 1.0 as it stands then come out and support it and rail against the new changes.

This is a BS change, let the server run as it is, it's player led. This 'rebalance' benefits the big alliances yet again.



It's funny because we would rather have the hilariously broken old system in place so we can be paying for two wardecs, yet be able to shoot anybody in highsec without repercussions.

The rebalance actually favors the high-sec corporations by keeping them from getting themselves into trouble.

Self-appointed forums hallway monitor Ask me about La Maison and what it means for you! http://bit.ly/LTW5gW These wardec rules are not in place for our protection. They're in place for yours.
Frying Doom
#133 - 2012-06-18 12:22:07 UTC
The funniest thing in these posts is the members of Goonswarm arguing that they didn't whine or complain about the allies system in 1.0

But then going on to say how much better the new way is.

Well I suppose they should, it does favour them.

Any spelling, grammatical and punctuation errors are because frankly, I don't care!!
Cutter Isaacson
DEDSEC SAN FRANCISCO
#134 - 2012-06-18 12:28:02 UTC
Frying Doom wrote:
The funniest thing in these posts is the members of Goonswarm arguing that they didn't whine or complain about the allies system in 1.0

But then going on to say how much better the new way is.

Well I suppose they should, it does favour them.



What's even funnier is the sheer number of morons trying desperately to accuse Goonswarm of crying for this ally system to be changed in their favour. Page after page of whine, whine, whine and not a single shred of proof that the Goons had anything to do with it.

"The truth is usually just an excuse for a lack of imagination." Elim Garak.
knobber Jobbler
State War Academy
Caldari State
#135 - 2012-06-18 12:30:43 UTC
Frying Doom wrote:
The funniest thing in these posts is the members of Goonswarm arguing that they didn't whine or complain about the allies system in 1.0

But then going on to say how much better the new way is.

Well I suppose they should, it does favour them.


Why would they whine? Two things:

1. The current mechanic is horribly broken - The ally system really doesn't work at all and can be easily abused, it is being abused. You have to be a proper tin foil[ass]hat to think otherwise or just plain stupid.
2. If you had the slighted idea about the Goons, this current broken mechanic is suites them down to the ground. They can go to high sec and kill a bunch of people without concorde blowing them up. It makes high sec allot more like 0.0 if everyone you meet is flashy red. If I was Goons leadership right now I'd be on these forums goading you high sec pub tards to ally up even more than right now because it means more cheap kills in high sec than normal.
Tanya Powers
Doomheim
#136 - 2012-06-18 12:33:18 UTC
Cutter Isaacson wrote:
Frying Doom wrote:
The funniest thing in these posts is the members of Goonswarm arguing that they didn't whine or complain about the allies system in 1.0

But then going on to say how much better the new way is.

Well I suppose they should, it does favour them.



What's even funnier is the sheer number of morons trying desperately to accuse Goonswarm of crying for this ally system to be changed in their favour. Page after page of whine, whine, whine and not a single shred of proof that the Goons had anything to do with it.



This.
Polly Oxford
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#137 - 2012-06-18 12:43:13 UTC
Frying Doom wrote:
The funniest thing in these posts is the members of Goonswarm arguing that they didn't whine or complain about the allies system in 1.0

But then going on to say how much better the new way is.

Well I suppose they should, it does favour them.


Yes, the change is great. Finally my inbox will not be flooded with completely inconsequential WarDecs by people that I will never see anywhere, because they hang out in highsec, a place where most of Goonswarm never sets foot besides with a trading alt.

That is literally the only way it benefits us, but that doesn't mean that the old system isn't incredibly stupid.
David Cedarbridge
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#138 - 2012-06-18 14:02:02 UTC
So wait, changing a mechanic that functionally makes declaring war for any alliance smaller than GSF impossible to win is a sign that the devs favor GSF?

Are you guys really that dense? As it stands now, any 5 man corp declaring war on another 5 man corp is instantly blobbed by "allies" (read: people who just want more things to shoot and have no stake with their other "allies."

I thought you pubbies were against blobbing?
Jade Constantine
Jericho Fraction
The Star Fraction
#139 - 2012-06-18 14:07:22 UTC  |  Edited by: Jade Constantine
Shepard Wong Ogeko wrote:
Jade Constantine wrote:

And lets remember another reality here. This is not hisec wardec people asking for a change in the in game to their benefit.



No, that is not a reality. That is just made up, and possibly a "rumor". The reality is that wardecs have never been a nullsec issue. At best they are a joke, at worst they are irrelevant. The only people that are going to have their game effected by wardecs, and would have any reason to complain, are highsec people.


And yet nobody in the hisec war coalitions has been complaining AT ALL.

Here's the thing.

The CSM (apart from Keldun of Eve Uni) opposed these changes. There is a good overview of their response in the Crossing Zebra's podcast where the Noir guy expresses his frustration at the way he felt the CSM had been ignored and the Wardec team was not really listening to feedback.

Crossing Zebra's podcast ep 6 listen from 44mins

Keldun btw has negotiated access to Test alliance space previously, so maybe that has something to do with his views who knows (test alliance being the other really big loser from the Inferno 1.0 wardec changes and getting literally FARMED by pretty much everyone in Hisec on the Honda Accord war).

And since the reveal on the 1.1 changes.
Nobody really except nullsec poeple have celebrated the detail uncritically.

You are being pretty deceitful to move the goalposts again and use the phrase "The only people that are going to have their game effected by wardecs, and would have any reason to complain, are highsec people" because the only hisec people who were getting involved in these wars were people who voluntarily joined allied coalitions (which they obviously enjoyed) or the objects of the "griefing wardecs" themselves who obviously have no choice about it either in 1.0 or 1.1

Your arguement kind of falls flat on its face.

The True Knowledge is that nothing matters that does not matter to you, might does make right and power makes freedom
Cutter Isaacson
DEDSEC SAN FRANCISCO
#140 - 2012-06-18 14:15:01 UTC
David Cedarbridge wrote:
So wait, changing a mechanic that functionally makes declaring war for any alliance smaller than GSF impossible to win is a sign that the devs favor GSF?

Are you guys really that dense? As it stands now, any 5 man corp declaring war on another 5 man corp is instantly blobbed by "allies" (read: people who just want more things to shoot and have no stake with their other "allies."

I thought you pubbies were against blobbing?



Interestingly I have personal experience of this. I got war dec'd last week by a 50 man alliance, and within 3 days I had amassed 243 people spread over 8 corps as allies, most of whom joined for zero cost. While I am obviously happy to have a large amount of allies, this does seem stupidly unbalanced and is a perfect example of why it needs changing.

"The truth is usually just an excuse for a lack of imagination." Elim Garak.