EVE General Discussion

So your entire OP is basically a big strawman.

Then you need to check your definition of “carebear” because it doesn't make much sense. You also need to dump those assumptions, because that's what's tripping you up.

…and the question remains: does anyone actually claim this, or are you just employing the same fallacy as the OP?


Oh, and Kijo, you need to look up the word “right”. It doesn't mean what you think it means.

Tripping me up?! I'm just asking if people would agree if suicide gankers would be the new carebears or not if miners adapt and gankers don't and keep looking for the easy poppings to be made instead of actually rising to a challenge set by adapting miners.

Up untill now they've been more inclined to stay on the easy peasy road carebaring along.

Not saying they carebares now but they might soon be the new carebears. Even if their mains live in tough old null sec.

Lets just agree to disagree and quit the analytical on this.

It's the opposite of left, right?

I'm assuming we're talking about my analogy and I feel I'm being misunderstood. My opinion on the matter was not actually stated and anyone's opinion on the matter is irrelevant. It's not about what's right in this example, it's about the reality of the situaiton.

EDIT: or it could be my wording, but I think that's what I meant. In a vaguely general fashion when this subject is brought up there are always those who insist that a woman shouldn't have to worry about what they wear, they should be free to do as they please and not be a victim. Pretty much 'I should have the right to do what i please without consequence.'

Yes. You're making assumptions about the motivations, reasons, arguments, justifications, “resolve”, and attitudes of gankers without much to back those assumptions up, and then you're making sweeping conclusions about what they're doing and why, and about how their actions should be interpreted, all based on those unfounded assumptions.

Your interpretation is based on stuff you just made up. It has no substance. It's a stonking big strawman. Drop the assumptions and start over.

No, let's not quit it. Let's take a closer look at those assumptions and see whether they hold up in reality or not…

I don't consider trolls arguments, so the question remains.
At best, I'd consider it a caricature of the kind of self-righteously indignant tirades carebear miners tend to vomit out when you explain to them that they aren't particularly necessary for EVE. If they read his post and realise the silliness of the whole concept, then he's done a good job.

No. Don't try to be cute. IRL, everyone has the right not to be a victim. The clothing is utterly and completely irrelevant to the existence of this right.

The problem with your comparison is that it, in turn, is completely irrelevant to the virtual world of EVE. The right that exists in real life does not exist in EVE. The only universal right you have in this game is to undock and log out. It's an idiotic comparison and you should not use it. I know miners are very fond of trying to claim that rape as innocent an activity as playing a game, but that just means you shouldn't lower yourself to their level of idiocy and employ their braindead and despicable logic.

Instead, you should explain to them that they are playing a game and that they have different rights in this world than they have in the real one. You should then report them for hate-mongering.

Making your point by dehumanizing your enemy is nothing new, but doesnt make it right.

http://static.howstuffworks.com/gif/start-world-war-2-18.jpg

http://www.animationresources.org/pics/propaganda2teaser-big.jpg

Suicide gankering is pvp for fat kids.

By proclaiming it a right. That is really all that is needed.

…aside from the right not to be a victim existing in real life and not in EVE.

This doesn't change the fact that the miners need to stop making themselves victims by actively choosing to make themselves the easiest targets imaginable (in close competition with the rocks they're trageting, but given the “onoz, it's crowded”-whines that pop up every now and then, the rocks sure seem more difficult). But that's just it: there's a difference between the game — where making that choice, actively or passively, is just yet another decision in how you want to approach the world — and real life — where the passive right not to be victim exists.

…the comparison is even more flawed since you don't have the right to walk down the street dressed however you like, but this is a completely separate issue to your right not to be a victim of crime.

Oh, and your updated example doesn't really change this fundamental problem. Instead, compare it to willingly moving to a stolen house Thieves' Lane, on the outskirts of Robbersville in the Republic of Nick-your-stuff-istan, where “borrowing” your neighbours morning newspaper (and car (and cable (and wife))) isn't just common, but near-mandatory to the point where said neighbour will report you to the authorities if he finds said newspaper untouched in the morning… and then complaining that someone stole “your” unlocked posh car from your driveway.

Well then I guess this entire argument between us boils down to



So let's take rights out of it. Whether or not we have the right to not be a victim, the criminals amongst us do not care either way. Use your head....Fly safe.

I'd amend this to say that they don't fear losing their ship in controlled circumstances. Not all suicide gankers are risk-averse, but some of them are putting up a destroyer to get a pile of loot in return. It's not risky PVP, it's buy low, sell high.

Now there is an assumption if I ever saw one. I wonder, what do you think I actually think on this subject?
And why don't you elaborate on your own "assumptions". Actually, why can't you give a straight awnser and
elaborate on that instead of trying to debunk my reasoning which is based on my own observations and experience.
Not to mention those of other players aswell. Ultimately it's a point of view you either share or don't. But it's hardly
unsubstantiated.

I can assume you disagree with it gankers becoming the new carebears but you haven't actually stated it anywhere?
Just a lot of talk mostly about other peoples posts.

Is my assumption of you disagreing right or wrong?

Something funny happened to me today....

One of my friends who was a miner was afk mining in system. I'd already told him about tanking up the hulk and so he did. 6 cats warped in and had a go at him. I think they were noobs because they never scanned his hulk which had no mining upgrades, cargo mods or nothing. The attack whiffed and concord cleaned up the belt. He had his drones out to kill rats. When he got back,he had 83% of hull remaining and got himself 2 of his first KMs. He was ecstatic. We lol'ed a bit in local.

That's it. Carry on.