Player Features and Ideas Discussion

First off, I want to say two things:

1) I have no idea if these changes were in before Inferno, as I didn't play much after I last quit in 2010. I also knew nothing about FW when I quit in 2010.

2) I apologize if there is already a thread up on this topic.

As it stands, it is too easy to make ISK via Minmatar FW. I made 600 mil with little to no effort in the last two days (Friday/Saturday) and if I care enough I'll make another 100 or 200 mil today. I am a 8-day old character, I should not be able to make that kind of ISK in so little time with the exception of intelligently playing the market. I know nothing about playing the market so I have to "work" for my ISK, but with FW I barely have to work at all for a lot of ISK.

Major complexes give 25000 LP.
Medium complexes give 15000 LP.
Minor complexes give 10000 LP.

For my horrible navigation skills, I can't speedtank a minor complex in a Vigil, nor can I really "do them" because my speedtanking Vigil fit with 200mm ACs can't even track them fast enough as I orbit them. This is still nice because I prefer to do Medium/Major complexes. Ultimately, I prefer doing major complexes as I can pretty much AFK in them as the orbital is so wide that they never get a lucky hit on me. In mediums I can't AFK too much because I'll get a hit here and there, so I have to pulse my SSB once in a while.

I made 188k LP in the last 2 days doing mostly majors, but some medium and minors (with partners) here and there. I didn't bother doing any plexes for the majority of yesterday as I made like 100k LP and I got bored of making more LP. On Friday night I made 80-90k LP. With what I'm trading in (which is slowly crashing in the market compared to the other Minmatar faction stuff that's crashing really fast) I get 3000 ISK per LP.

188k LP took me from 85 mil to 691 mil ISK.

There are a number of reasons how I am able to get this much LP and how I have a high ISK per LP ratio:

1) I can speedtank their complexes.

2) Amarr cannot speedtank Minmatar complexes.

Combine these reasons together and you will understand why Amarr is losing the Amarr vs Minmatar war heavily as Minmatar complexes cannot be speedtanked due to TPing and webbing NPCS. This means Amarr has very little progress in T1 while Minmatar is always T3 but fluctuates up to T4 daily.

The Gallente vs Caldari war do not have this problem because both sides can speedtank both factions. This means both Caldari and Gallente fluctate between T1 and T2.

The T3/T4 fluctuation is a huge advantage to my success. At T3, we pay normal price as other corporations for anything in the LP store. At T4, we pay 50% of the price! (just a note: T1 means you pay 4x the price, T2 you pay 2x, so as the tiers go you divide by two, this means T5 will be absolute insanity as it'd be 25% of normal price). This is for both ISK and LP, so something that costs 10000 LP and 10 million ISK to buy is 5000 LP and 5 million ISK to buy at T4.

So let's take a step back and see what this means. With T4, we get more from the LP store for cheaper. Factor in the fact that speedtanking Amarr plexes is effortless, resulting in a massive pseudo-free LP income, we have brand-new characters with crappy navigation skills making 200-300 mil per day with no effort and a couple of Vigil losses to retardation.

However, this can be fixed.

There are two solutions. One is easy, but detrimental to the whole point of FW. The other is good and solves the basic problem behind FW at the moment.

1) Let Amarr speedtank Minmatar complexes so everyone is "equal" in our ability to speedtank. But this is a bad suggestion because the ability to speedtank each others' complexes is a bad design implementation. Let's move on to the better suggestion.

2) Have all NPCs that spawn in all 4 faction complexes be able to web you. This will solve the problem behind speedtanking and force intelligent fleet composition and gameplay to actually conquer complexes.

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UPDATE:

I am at 14 days played and I have acquired 1.5b ISK off LP transactions alone. I honestly do not feel like I did anything to get that 1.5b. All I can remember is orbiting a button on a couple days and acquiring massive amounts of LP. I've only plexed for 4 days or so, all of the others were just me logging in a little bit and not doing anything. Based on how much ISK a player can make with no effort in his first two weeks (basically my point is a trial player can do this), I do not think FW is balanced in terms of risk/reward - zero risk, great reward.

And that's not even the worst of it. If someone played like me for 16 hours a day he could make 5 billion in 5 days easily. Probably more closer to 10-15 billion in 2 weeks. How is this balanced? You can put in so much effort into FW and get massive rewards for essentially zero risk. This is beyond ridiculous and it's boggles me that I know when I link this update into Militia channel, people are going to go "stfu pineapple FW is balanced go get a new haircut".

Complexs in general need a change. It has to be an active fight. Obviously this means the FW NPCs should be using the New AI code for wormholes and incursions where each NPC ship is as strong as a real player ship.

For some Reason, a blue post stated this would make the game too much about NPCs and said "we will never put NPCs as strong as players into eve online ever, wait a few months and we will do something to fix FW sites" -2010

This was before said NPC were brought into the game for incursions. Could you solo an incursion site? no? then CCP should fix FW with that simple fix. will they? It's been 3 years I am losing hope.

I'll say it again. Minor FW sites should have 3 frigates in them. it should be as hard as fighting 3 player frigates. so you should have to bring 3 people with you to take it out. The fact that FW is set up as a single player WvW is just plain fail. And I did FW for 3 years. it was stupid it was never about playing in groups, it's about going around in groups of 1-2, having one person go in and get arrgo, then the next person goes in and sits on the beacon.

IT"S NOT FUN ITS STUPID

This should prove interesting for the economy since LP is an ISK sink.
With Incursion sites intro the Concord LP in 3-4 months bottomed out to ~800 ISK per LP. Main difference though with Incursions versus FW is that Incursioners didn't have any way to get Tags( besides the market whose prices EXPLODED) which hurt thier standings and would prevent them from running Incursions in HI SEC. As a consequence most hardcore Incursion runners after awhile just let thier LP stockpile ( I think I have around 4 million Concord LP )

And they said incursions were easy ISK. FW, here I come!

I know I made a good thread when people are angry with my suggestions to improve FW mechanics.

Ninlarra teamkiller \o/ http://eve-kill.net/?a=kill_detail&kll_id=13627635

Quality post. I like your suggestion.

Your corp. CEO disagrees with you. Your CEO is actually the reason why I wrote that "apology". I can provide chatlogs if you would like, contact me in game for them as I am not allowed to post chatlogs on the forum.

WTs coming into the plex to get you doesn't do anything. Half of my complexes involve me spamming D-scan and warping to a safe as soon as I see a WT enter and I'll just AFK and wait until they leave the system and then I come back to it and complete the complex. I admit they could just defensive-plex it, but not everyone does that. Only one person has done that to me and I still finished that major plex anyway (38 minutes on the timer, still worth it)

The friendlies usually leave when I respectfully ask them to leave. If they don't, I deal with it and say "eh, it's okay if we share it!". Around 1 in 5 plexes involve me sharing it with a friendly, and even then it's not that big of a loss anyway.

Ewar will (meaning the change has not been done yet) be removed from plexes, which satisfies this suggestion:



But...




And thus I greatly prefer...



...would at least enhance teamwork and not detract from it.

All of that takes time. I don't know how long you played over two days to get that LP. I have been able to hop on for about an hour and a half the past couple of days. In that time I plexed four majors in the backend upgraded Minmatar systems. 160k LP in 90 minutes. Three days in a row. And note the upgraded part. Minmatar pilots put LP into those systems to get a better LP store. I essentially took their LP and put it into my pocket. I made them put more LP into those systems to get their tier 4 store back. And I've seen only a couple of WT during that time. Judging from the number of blinking systems in the Minmatar rear I'm not the only one with that idea.

I really like the new system. It involves alot more strategy. Hit the rear systems. Make the enemy do security sweeps. Peel pilots off of the front or eat a worse store. Make them spend LP on upgrades rather then SFI. You don't get a discount on upgrades. And save up your LP for a time that your own store is better.