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HiSec Miners - Sponsoring Risk Aversion
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EVE Roy Mustang
Doomheim
#121 - 2012-06-09 20:37:57 UTC
baltec1 wrote:
Indahmawar Fazmarai wrote:

You missed a point:

Gankers are
- Ganking with help from alts in throwaway trial accounts... NO RISK.


Thats bannable.


IF you can prove it
Otherwise there are too many recycles and not enough CCP to handle them
IE "the logs, they show nothing"
baltec1
Bat Country
Pandemic Horde
#122 - 2012-06-09 20:40:43 UTC
EVE Roy Mustang wrote:
baltec1 wrote:
Indahmawar Fazmarai wrote:

You missed a point:

Gankers are
- Ganking with help from alts in throwaway trial accounts... NO RISK.


Thats bannable.


IF you can prove it
Otherwise there are too many recycles and not enough CCP to handle them
IE "the logs, they show nothing"


The logs do show stuff in this caseBlink
ashley Eoner
#123 - 2012-06-09 20:42:27 UTC  |  Edited by: ashley Eoner
Disregard That wrote:
One of these days when your brain cells recover from the apparent dehydration, take your Hulk out to an asteroid belt and align it to the station of your choice. Activate your lasers and watch them work.

As you begin to move out of range of your first rock (this should take some time as the Hulk is not a speed machine) you can lock another rock and begin harvesting that one. Rinse and repeat as you align.

Now pretend for a moment that a nasty fleet of gankers warps in and lands on you. Press the warp button.

See how long it takes you to get into warp? You are also not targetable during that time.

So no, I am not advocating WCS. I'm asking you and your kind to learn to play Eve.

Play Eve your way. But still, learn how to play.
That is simply stupid. EVen assuming you start mining a rock at 23.7KM you'll be past the rock and out another 23.7km well before you're done mining it. Unless you're mining 20k veld rocks in which case you're just a failure. I guess if you can find a field where you can go from aligned target to aligned target it might work decently. Frankly you might as well just buy plex and give up mining because your isk per hour might even be as bad as running level 2 missions.

Even moving at max speed and assuming I can keep the hulk aligned properly there's still a good 5 or so second delay between pushing the button and the actual warp. Add in the delays associated with an unexpected ganker popping in right under you and your fat fingering there's actually plenty of time to web your ass.

I seriously had better expectations of you. Something along the lines of using a webing alt to keep your hulk in place for a quicker warp. But nooo I get what has to be one of the dumbest responses possible . DRIVE BY MINE HUERPDURP...
Disregard That
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#124 - 2012-06-09 20:44:14 UTC  |  Edited by: Disregard That
ashley Eoner wrote:
Disregard That wrote:
One of these days when your brain cells recover from the apparent dehydration, take your Hulk out to an asteroid belt and align it to the station of your choice. Activate your lasers and watch them work.

As you begin to move out of range of your first rock (this should take some time as the Hulk is not a speed machine) you can lock another rock and begin harvesting that one. Rinse and repeat as you align.

Now pretend for a moment that a nasty fleet of gankers warps in and lands on you. Press the warp button.

See how long it takes you to get into warp? You are also not targetable during that time.

So no, I am not advocating WCS. I'm asking you and your kind to learn to play Eve.

Play Eve your way. But still, learn how to play.
That is simply stupid. EVen assuming you start mining a rock at 19KM you'll be past the rock and out another 19km well before you're done mining it. Unless you're mining 20k veld rocks in which case you're just a failure. I guess if you can find a field where you can go from aligned target to aligned target it might work decently. Frankly you might as well just buy plex and give up mining because your isk per hour might even be as bad as running level 2 missions.

Even moving at max speed and assuming I can keep the hulk aligned properly there's still a good 5 or so second delay between pushing the button and the actual warp.

I seriously had better expectations of you. Something along the lines of using a webing alt to keep your hulk in place for a quicker warp. But nooo I get what has to be one of the dumbest responses possible . DRIVE BY MINE HUERPDURP...

It's much easier than that, really.

You can make bookmarks in-line but off-grid with the arc of the asteroid belt and align to the bookmarks instead.

Then you're in-line for the whole belt.

But miners won't do this. Because, as you say, it's stupid. Stupider, apparently, than losing a Hulk to gankers.

And much stupider than whining on a forum about things you can counteract yourself.

Edit: I liked your post for its entertainment value.

Enjoy losing those Hulks, then.
ashley Eoner
#125 - 2012-06-09 20:53:19 UTC  |  Edited by: ashley Eoner
Disregard That wrote:
ashley Eoner wrote:
Disregard That wrote:
One of these days when your brain cells recover from the apparent dehydration, take your Hulk out to an asteroid belt and align it to the station of your choice. Activate your lasers and watch them work.

As you begin to move out of range of your first rock (this should take some time as the Hulk is not a speed machine) you can lock another rock and begin harvesting that one. Rinse and repeat as you align.

Now pretend for a moment that a nasty fleet of gankers warps in and lands on you. Press the warp button.

See how long it takes you to get into warp? You are also not targetable during that time.

So no, I am not advocating WCS. I'm asking you and your kind to learn to play Eve.

Play Eve your way. But still, learn how to play.
That is simply stupid. EVen assuming you start mining a rock at 19KM you'll be past the rock and out another 19km well before you're done mining it. Unless you're mining 20k veld rocks in which case you're just a failure. I guess if you can find a field where you can go from aligned target to aligned target it might work decently. Frankly you might as well just buy plex and give up mining because your isk per hour might even be as bad as running level 2 missions.

Even moving at max speed and assuming I can keep the hulk aligned properly there's still a good 5 or so second delay between pushing the button and the actual warp.

I seriously had better expectations of you. Something along the lines of using a webing alt to keep your hulk in place for a quicker warp. But nooo I get what has to be one of the dumbest responses possible . DRIVE BY MINE HUERPDURP...

It's much easier than that, really.

You can make bookmarks in-line but off-grid with the arc of the asteroid belt and align to the bookmarks instead.

Then you're in-line for the whole belt.

But miners won't do this. Because, as you say, it's stupid. Stupider, apparently, than losing a Hulk to gankers.

And much stupider than whining on a forum about things you can counteract yourself.

Edit: I liked your post for its entertainment value.

Enjoy losing those Hulks, then.
HERPDERP reading comprehension is difficult.

It was painfully obvious that you don't mine as only someone without actual experience in the game would suggest what you're suggesting. So you spend all that time getting your bookmarks and your mining pattern down. Guess what? All that work is only going to save you once (oh and space drift). So you basically are wasting WAAAAy to much time maping stuff out when you should just buy a plex and call it a day.


Reading is difficult I realize but I'll try to inform you one more time. I've never been successfully suicide ganked. My hulks have tanks RR Buffs and ECM drones as defense. I also keep DSCAN up set for max range on the orca and one of the hulks set for a shorter range so I can better tell where people are going. I have been entertained by some really spectacularly bad gank attempts though. If it didn't take so much time and effort I'd actually intentional bait gankers just to kill them. I've got better things to do with my time though.


EDIT : Basically you're wasting your time on inefficient countermeasures..
Sara XIII
The Carnifex Corp
#126 - 2012-06-09 20:53:42 UTC
ashley Eoner wrote:
Disregard That wrote:
One of these days when your brain cells recover from the apparent dehydration, take your Hulk out to an asteroid belt and align it to the station of your choice. Activate your lasers and watch them work.

As you begin to move out of range of your first rock (this should take some time as the Hulk is not a speed machine) you can lock another rock and begin harvesting that one. Rinse and repeat as you align.

Now pretend for a moment that a nasty fleet of gankers warps in and lands on you. Press the warp button.

See how long it takes you to get into warp? You are also not targetable during that time.

So no, I am not advocating WCS. I'm asking you and your kind to learn to play Eve.

Play Eve your way. But still, learn how to play.
That is simply stupid. EVen assuming you start mining a rock at 23.7KM you'll be past the rock and out another 23.7km well before you're done mining it. Unless you're mining 20k veld rocks in which case you're just a failure. I guess if you can find a field where you can go from aligned target to aligned target it might work decently. Frankly you might as well just buy plex and give up mining because your isk per hour might even be as bad as running level 2 missions.

Even moving at max speed and assuming I can keep the hulk aligned properly there's still a good 5 or so second delay between pushing the button and the actual warp. Add in the delays associated with an unexpected ganker popping in right under you and your fat fingering there's actually plenty of time to web your ass.

I seriously had better expectations of you. Something along the lines of using a webing alt to keep your hulk in place for a quicker warp. But nooo I get what has to be one of the dumbest responses possible . DRIVE BY MINE HUERPDURP...


Stop posting. You are destroying your cause.

Between Ignorance and Wisdom
baltec1
Bat Country
Pandemic Horde
#127 - 2012-06-09 20:56:41 UTC
ashley Eoner wrote:
HERPDERP reading comprehension is difficult.

It was painfully obvious that you don't mine as only someone without actual experience in the game would suggest what you're suggesting. So you spend all that time getting your bookmarks and your mining pattern down. Guess what? All that work is only going to save you once (oh and space drift). So you basically are wasting WAAAAy to much time maping stuff out when you should just buy a plex and call it a day.


Reading is difficult I realize but I'll try to inform you one more time. I've never been successfully suicide ganked. My hulks have tanks RR Buffs and ECM drones as defense. I have been entertained by some really spectacularly bad gank attempts though. If it didn't take so much time and effort I'd actually intentional bait gankers just to kill them. I've got better things to do with my time though.





Please...

These things take seconds to set up.
Disregard That
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#128 - 2012-06-09 20:57:56 UTC
baltec1 wrote:
ashley Eoner wrote:
HERPDERP reading comprehension is difficult.

It was painfully obvious that you don't mine as only someone without actual experience in the game would suggest what you're suggesting. So you spend all that time getting your bookmarks and your mining pattern down. Guess what? All that work is only going to save you once (oh and space drift). So you basically are wasting WAAAAy to much time maping stuff out when you should just buy a plex and call it a day.


Reading is difficult I realize but I'll try to inform you one more time. I've never been successfully suicide ganked. My hulks have tanks RR Buffs and ECM drones as defense. I have been entertained by some really spectacularly bad gank attempts though. If it didn't take so much time and effort I'd actually intentional bait gankers just to kill them. I've got better things to do with my time though.





Please...

These things take seconds to set up.

WTF is space drift?

My bookmarks always work.

Mining aligned is not a problem. Unless you mine AFK and want total immunity to attacks while in that state.

In which case - *****, I give none.
Greyscale Dash
Doomheim
#129 - 2012-06-09 20:59:52 UTC
ashley Eoner wrote:
HERPDERP reading comprehension is difficult.

It was painfully obvious that you don't mine as only someone without actual experience in the game would suggest what you're suggesting. So you spend all that time getting your bookmarks and your mining pattern down. Guess what? All that work is only going to save you once (oh and space drift). So you basically are wasting WAAAAy to much time maping stuff out when you should just buy a plex and call it a day.


Reading is difficult I realize but I'll try to inform you one more time. I've never been successfully suicide ganked. My hulks have tanks RR Buffs and ECM drones as defense. I have been entertained by some really spectacularly bad gank attempts though. If it didn't take so much time and effort I'd actually intentional bait gankers just to kill them. I've got better things to do with my time though.





Space drift?

So not only do you fail at mining, you have no idea how EVE space is actually configured.
EVE Roy Mustang
Doomheim
#130 - 2012-06-09 21:08:15 UTC
baltec1 wrote:
EVE Roy Mustang wrote:
baltec1 wrote:
Indahmawar Fazmarai wrote:

You missed a point:

Gankers are
- Ganking with help from alts in throwaway trial accounts... NO RISK.


Thats bannable.


IF you can prove it
Otherwise there are too many recycles and not enough CCP to handle them
IE "the logs, they show nothing"


The logs do show stuff in this caseBlink


Every time Ive asked them, I get a "we dont have enough people to monitor every recycle" type answer (Im paraphrasing rather than quoting a GM)
So thats kinda why I say "the logs, they show nothing"
baltec1
Bat Country
Pandemic Horde
#131 - 2012-06-09 21:10:47 UTC
EVE Roy Mustang wrote:


Every time Ive asked them, I get a "we dont have enough people to monitor every recycle" type answer (Im paraphrasing rather than quoting a GM)
So thats kinda why I say "the logs, they show nothing"


Its all down to how much info you give and the way you say it.
RubyPorto
RubysRhymes
#132 - 2012-06-09 22:21:39 UTC
EVE Roy Mustang wrote:
baltec1 wrote:
Indahmawar Fazmarai wrote:

You missed a point:

Gankers are
- Ganking with help from alts in throwaway trial accounts... NO RISK.


Thats bannable.


IF you can prove it
Otherwise there are too many recycles and not enough CCP to handle them
IE "the logs, they show nothing"


From what I've heard from people trying it, the bans come pretty damn quick if you start recycling gank alts with negative sec.

But since they don't discuss actions taken as a result of petitions, they're not going to tell you about that.

"It's easy to speak for the silent majority. They rarely object to what you put into their mouths." -Abrazzar "the risk of having your day ruined by other people is the cornerstone with which EVE was built" -CCP Solomon
RubyPorto
RubysRhymes
#133 - 2012-06-09 22:29:01 UTC
ashley Eoner wrote:
RubyPorto wrote:
Morganta wrote:


apparently you don't read so well
nobody said its impossible to tank against one guy in highsec, I said quite the opposite
"a tanked hulk is about as good as nothing to anything more then a single ganker"

what I said is anything more than that is impossible due to restricted CPU and grid and the notion expressed by people who gank in groups, that tank will help, is very misleading.

I'll forget your slip up since you are apparently one of the new recruits and don't know when your calling one of your own allies a bear Roll


Tanking your Hulk will make it a breakeven (at best) proposition to gank you. Especially in the higher security bands.
30k EHP vs ~600dps*20s(CONCORD response in .5) per 5m ISK Catalyst means 3 Catalysts are needed to gank you (4 if you use ECM drones).
Your Hulk is likely to drop 10m in loot and 10m in salvage. Without the GSF bounty, that's a breakeven gank. With it, it's 2.5m Isk per pilot.

An untanked Hulk only costs 2 catalysts worth 10m to guarantee a gank and the gang can be hitting 2 targets per 15min gcc cycle instead of 1.

Flying your mining ship actively and avoiding gankers all together is an even better option.
catalyst should be doing over 700 DPS hot and you can force extend the response time of concord to well beyond 20 seconds in .5 space. Come on people learn a little or at least do a little testing before making comments about stuff.

An untanked hulk is easy prey for a well setup catalyst even in .9 space (1.0 space should be easy too but it's no guarantee).


Find me a 5m Isk Catalyst that does 700dps. T2 fit catalysts do 700dps and cost 15m to fit. Meta mod Catalysts cost 5m and do ~600 dps. Officer mod Catalysts cost 10b and do 800dps.

See, when I picked 600dps per 5m ISK catalyst, I had a specific fit in mind that's commonly used for group ganks because it's the most isk efficient dps.

If you're still mining after somebody in local has gone GCC (which you have to do to pull CONCORD), you're an idiot.

2 catalysts worth 10m or one worth 15m. I was comparing the most Isk efficient ganks of each hulk. If you want to compare the most pilot efficient ganks, those are different numbers.

Come on people, learn a little or at least read the post before making comments about stuff.

"It's easy to speak for the silent majority. They rarely object to what you put into their mouths." -Abrazzar "the risk of having your day ruined by other people is the cornerstone with which EVE was built" -CCP Solomon
Disregard That
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#134 - 2012-06-09 22:31:05 UTC
I'm still laughing about "space drift" tbh.
RubyPorto
RubysRhymes
#135 - 2012-06-09 22:31:55 UTC
ashley Eoner wrote:
Disregard That wrote:
ashley Eoner wrote:
Disregard That wrote:
One of these days when your brain cells recover from the apparent dehydration, take your Hulk out to an asteroid belt and align it to the station of your choice. Activate your lasers and watch them work.

As you begin to move out of range of your first rock (this should take some time as the Hulk is not a speed machine) you can lock another rock and begin harvesting that one. Rinse and repeat as you align.

Now pretend for a moment that a nasty fleet of gankers warps in and lands on you. Press the warp button.

See how long it takes you to get into warp? You are also not targetable during that time.

So no, I am not advocating WCS. I'm asking you and your kind to learn to play Eve.

Play Eve your way. But still, learn how to play.
That is simply stupid. EVen assuming you start mining a rock at 19KM you'll be past the rock and out another 19km well before you're done mining it. Unless you're mining 20k veld rocks in which case you're just a failure. I guess if you can find a field where you can go from aligned target to aligned target it might work decently. Frankly you might as well just buy plex and give up mining because your isk per hour might even be as bad as running level 2 missions.

Even moving at max speed and assuming I can keep the hulk aligned properly there's still a good 5 or so second delay between pushing the button and the actual warp.

I seriously had better expectations of you. Something along the lines of using a webing alt to keep your hulk in place for a quicker warp. But nooo I get what has to be one of the dumbest responses possible . DRIVE BY MINE HUERPDURP...

It's much easier than that, really.

You can make bookmarks in-line but off-grid with the arc of the asteroid belt and align to the bookmarks instead.

Then you're in-line for the whole belt.

But miners won't do this. Because, as you say, it's stupid. Stupider, apparently, than losing a Hulk to gankers.

And much stupider than whining on a forum about things you can counteract yourself.

Edit: I liked your post for its entertainment value.

Enjoy losing those Hulks, then.
HERPDERP reading comprehension is difficult.

It was painfully obvious that you don't mine as only someone without actual experience in the game would suggest what you're suggesting. So you spend all that time getting your bookmarks and your mining pattern down. Guess what? All that work is only going to save you once (oh and space drift). So you basically are wasting WAAAAy to much time maping stuff out when you should just buy a plex and call it a day.


Reading is difficult I realize but I'll try to inform you one more time. I've never been successfully suicide ganked. My hulks have tanks RR Buffs and ECM drones as defense. I also keep DSCAN up set for max range on the orca and one of the hulks set for a shorter range so I can better tell where people are going. I have been entertained by some really spectacularly bad gank attempts though. If it didn't take so much time and effort I'd actually intentional bait gankers just to kill them. I've got better things to do with my time though.


EDIT : Basically you're wasting your time on inefficient countermeasures..


You've got multiple Hulks. Slap 3 webs on each, spider webbing each other and align to a safe. You'll be moving at 75% of 11m/s. That shouldn't cause too much in the way of range issues. Then fleetwarp as the gank lands.

Your idea that it takes 5s for an aligned ship to enter warp is simply idiotic.

"It's easy to speak for the silent majority. They rarely object to what you put into their mouths." -Abrazzar "the risk of having your day ruined by other people is the cornerstone with which EVE was built" -CCP Solomon
Disregard That
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#136 - 2012-06-09 22:40:00 UTC  |  Edited by: Disregard That
Anything anybody suggests that doesn't involve sitting AFK around a jet can or an Orce is stupid, though.

Even if it means the miner can mine with no risk, it appears as though the average miner will avoid any strategy that does not permit them to mine AFK risk-free.

Edit: Further, if you always use my technique, there is no real reason to fit a tank. Meaning stupid miners could be fitting for max-yield and still mine in absolute safety.

But mining while aligned? That's absurd... Roll
RubyPorto
RubysRhymes
#137 - 2012-06-09 22:57:22 UTC
Disregard That wrote:
Anything anybody suggests that doesn't involve sitting AFK around a jet can or an Orce is stupid, though.

Even if it means the miner can mine with no risk, it appears as though the average miner will avoid any strategy that does not permit them to mine AFK risk-free.

Edit: Further, if you always use my technique, there is no real reason to fit a tank. Meaning stupid miners could be fitting for max-yield and still mine in absolute safety.

But mining while aligned? That's absurd... Roll


Three webs fits easily on a max yield Hulk. 4 requires One Aeode, dropping one MLUII, or putting a CPU rig on, but drops your align speed to 75% of 9.1m/s vs 75% of 11m/s.

Brain tank your Hulks people. I understand that it's out of some people's price range, but the rest of you have no excuse.

"It's easy to speak for the silent majority. They rarely object to what you put into their mouths." -Abrazzar "the risk of having your day ruined by other people is the cornerstone with which EVE was built" -CCP Solomon
Vaerah Vahrokha
Vahrokh Consulting
#138 - 2012-06-09 23:18:21 UTC
Disregard That wrote:
Anything anybody suggests that doesn't involve sitting AFK around a jet can or an Orce is stupid, though.

Even if it means the miner can mine with no risk, it appears as though the average miner will avoid any strategy that does not permit them to mine AFK risk-free.


They don't do what you say because doing it AFK is the PREMISE for them doing it.
No AFK => Don't bother.

See you and others try teach how to go 10 hops to do a certain lowest reward, boring, outdated game mechanic.

I think it's clear enough how you get it the opposite it goes. You talk to people like they need to mine and will overcome discomfort or other factors.

The reality is, they do it exclusively, ONLY for the AFK factor.

Keep creating 100000000000 more threads pretending to tell people how to do stuff they do not WANT to do, it will be as useless.

ANY variation to the max expanded (notice: not even max yield, because max expanded has 0 MLU) will be rejected because they don't mine because it's fun or is lucrative.

They mine because they can do anything else while the AFK ship makes them a very low but fully AFK income.
Like it or hate it, this is how things go. They AFK mine for hours to get some ISK then later in the day they actually log in with their main to actually play and lose those ISK.

You and Rubyporto can grow white hairs pretending to tell the that NOT AFKing is the way to go, but they do it only because it can be done AFK.

Also, the tanky fits are anti-AFK, that's why they prefer to see ships blown than tanking them using the lows.


You CAN make AFK mining a thing of the past. This just means they will close the AFK accounts and find the next most AFK thing to do during those hours they are not playing with their main.

Not saying you are doing wrong or anything, just saying how reality works, which is well different than how you talk about.

EvE Online portal | EvE markets tutorials
masternerdguy
Doomheim
#139 - 2012-06-09 23:20:42 UTC
Vaerah Vahrokha wrote:
Disregard That wrote:
Anything anybody suggests that doesn't involve sitting AFK around a jet can or an Orce is stupid, though.

Even if it means the miner can mine with no risk, it appears as though the average miner will avoid any strategy that does not permit them to mine AFK risk-free.


They don't do what you say because doing it AFK is the PREMISE for them doing it.
No AFK => Don't bother.

See you and others try teach how to go 10 hops to do a certain lowest reward, boring, outdated game mechanic.

I think it's clear enough how you get it the opposite it goes. You talk to people like they need to mine and will overcome discomfort or other factors.

The reality is, they do it exclusively, ONLY for the AFK factor.

Keep creating 100000000000 more threads pretending to tell people how to do stuff they do not WANT to do, it will be as useless.

ANY variation to the max expanded (notice: not even max yield, because max expanded has 0 MLU) will be rejected because they don't mine because it's fun or is lucrative.

They mine because they can do anything else while the AFK ship makes them a very low but fully AFK income.
Like it or hate it, this is how things go. They AFK mine for hours to get some ISK then later in the day they actually log in with their main to actually play and lose those ISK.

You and Rubyporto can grow white hairs pretending to tell the that NOT AFKing is the way to go, but they do it only because it can be done AFK.

Also, the tanky fits are anti-AFK, that's why they prefer to see ships blown than tanking them using the lows.


You CAN make AFK mining a thing of the past. This just means they will close the AFK accounts and find the next most AFK thing to do during those hours they are not playing with their main.

Not saying you are doing wrong or anything, just saying how reality works, which is well different than how you talk about.


I think someone might be mad.

Things are only impossible until they are not.
Disregard That
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#140 - 2012-06-09 23:23:13 UTC
Vaerah Vahrokha wrote:
Disregard That wrote:
Anything anybody suggests that doesn't involve sitting AFK around a jet can or an Orce is stupid, though.

Even if it means the miner can mine with no risk, it appears as though the average miner will avoid any strategy that does not permit them to mine AFK risk-free.


They don't do what you say because doing it AFK is the PREMISE for them doing it.
No AFK => Don't bother.

See you and others try teach how to go 10 hops to do a certain lowest reward, boring, outdated game mechanic.

I think it's clear enough how you get it the opposite it goes. You talk to people like they need to mine and will overcome discomfort or other factors.

The reality is, they do it exclusively, ONLY for the AFK factor.

Keep creating 100000000000 more threads pretending to tell people how to do stuff they do not WANT to do, it will be as useless.

ANY variation to the max expanded (notice: not even max yield, because max expanded has 0 MLU) will be rejected because they don't mine because it's fun or is lucrative.

They mine because they can do anything else while the AFK ship makes them a very low but fully AFK income.
Like it or hate it, this is how things go. They AFK mine for hours to get some ISK then later in the day they actually log in with their main to actually play and lose those ISK.

You and Rubyporto can grow white hairs pretending to tell the that NOT AFKing is the way to go, but they do it only because it can be done AFK.

Also, the tanky fits are anti-AFK, that's why they prefer to see ships blown than tanking them using the lows.


You CAN make AFK mining a thing of the past. This just means they will close the AFK accounts and find the next most AFK thing to do during those hours they are not playing with their main.

Not saying you are doing wrong or anything, just saying how reality works, which is well different than how you talk about.

Then they operate under a faulty premise. There should be no way in High Sec to gather significant resources without any risk. AFK mining violates this very principle.

If you're telling me how things work in reality, I wonder what these miners who want to earn income AFK think about the same subject.

Do they have any basis in reality whatsoever to think that they could perpetrate such an obviously unbalanced activity in naked space?

Do we have a lot of ships in Eve that can hold up to an offensive while the pilot is AFK?

Do supercarrier and titan pilots get such considerations too?

Jesus, this post is a total nightmare for the positions of high-sec miners everywhere.

You basically concede that they want to mine AFK risk-free.

How could you do such a disservice to the community?