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Does the 'PvPers are Sociopaths' argument bother anyone else?

Author
Makkal Hanaya
Revenent Defence Corperation
#21 - 2012-06-06 07:29:45 UTC
Marlona Sky wrote:


You have a link where someone who was ganked (NPC alt's don't count) saying flat out that anyone who ganks or does PvP is a sociopath?


I can't tell if he was ganked or is an alt, but from here.

MatrixSkye Mk2 wrote:
Kimmi Chan wrote:
If a player is happy mining scordite in 1.0 space why is that a problem? It isn't a problem
If a player like to sit in Jita making trades why is that a problem? It isn't a problem
If a player prefers to do hi-sec missions what is the problem? There isn't a problem.

As a response to part 2 of your question look at these forums and count the number of high sec residents screaming bloody murder that they should be 100% safe in high sec, lobbying CCP for a 100% safe high sec, and making ludicrous claims about other players violating the EULA.

If mining and missioning in hi sec aren't problems to these sociopaths, then why the incessant call to arms from the "hardcore PVPer" community to attack and kill them? Why the constant belligerence and belittling against them? Why the unfounded and deliberate accusations that carebears are greedy and stupid? Why the constant whining and crying about moving missions and anything remotely fun to them into lo/null sec? Why the constant whining that carebears should be kicked out of NPC corps and hi sec altogether?

Render unto Khanid the things which are Khanid's; and unto God the things that are God's.

Ten Bulls
Sons of Olsagard
#22 - 2012-06-06 07:36:03 UTC
Knus'lar wrote:
I see this quite a bit in the rage threads lately. From my perspective, i see a lot of carebears mud flinging, and calling anyone who ganks or does pvp a sociopath. Because apparently only a sociopath would do such a thing. But really, it just seems like a vain attempt at taking the moral high ground.

For real, do some people honestly believe people act the same in game as they do in real life?


Pixels dont cry, if you PvP for the 'tears' you have serious RL issues.
Marlona Sky
State War Academy
Caldari State
#23 - 2012-06-06 07:40:08 UTC
Even though he does have a point, he is in an NPC corp. So it doesn't count.

I do find Kimmi Chan's post amusing because he groups ALL high sec residents as wanting high sec to be 100% safe. Which of course is a flat out lie. There has only be a very tiny amount (like 7 last I counted and not in NPC corps) posts where they specifically said they wanted high sec to be 100% safe. This game has over 300,000 subscribers. Do you honestly think 7 people represent all of high sec?
Bernie Nator
Wildcard.
Boundary Experts
#24 - 2012-06-06 07:40:58 UTC
Ten Bulls wrote:
Knus'lar wrote:
I see this quite a bit in the rage threads lately. From my perspective, i see a lot of carebears mud flinging, and calling anyone who ganks or does pvp a sociopath. Because apparently only a sociopath would do such a thing. But really, it just seems like a vain attempt at taking the moral high ground.

For real, do some people honestly believe people act the same in game as they do in real life?


Pixels dont cry, if you PvP for the 'tears' you have serious RL issues.

What if I just pvp because I know they want to pvp? Or what if I want to make their day crap?
Virgil Travis
Non Constructive Self Management
#25 - 2012-06-06 07:46:05 UTC  |  Edited by: Virgil Travis
The term sociopath has become quite popular for those that take the game a bit too seriously. Perhaps they should learn the word catharsis.

Unified Church of the Unobligated - madness in the method Mamma didn't raise no victims.

Ten Bulls
Sons of Olsagard
#26 - 2012-06-06 07:47:47 UTC
Bernie Nator wrote:
Ten Bulls wrote:

Pixels dont cry, if you PvP for the 'tears' you have serious RL issues.

What if I just pvp because I know they want to pvp? Or what if I want to make their day crap?


If you have ingame reason to PvP then your fine, for example if you PvP to defend territory, or to demonstrate your a better pilot, or for a challenge, whatever, as long as its about ingame issues.

If your doing it to make the player suffer in RL, and you dont know them in RL, then that’s obviously a sign of a sociopath and/or narcissistic personality IMO (but im not a shrink).


pussnheels
Viziam
#27 - 2012-06-06 07:49:32 UTC  |  Edited by: pussnheels
Knus'lar wrote:
I see this quite a bit in the rage threads lately. From my perspective, i see a lot of carebears mud flinging, and calling anyone who ganks or does pvp a sociopath. Because apparently only a sociopath would do such a thing. But really, it just seems like a vain attempt at taking the moral high ground.

For real, do some people honestly believe people act the same in game as they do in real life?


if you are talking about the majority of players who engage in actual pvp as their major profesion in EVE the answer is no
If you talking about that small minority with a instant gratification complex ,that is convinced that this game should be turned into a arcade MMO and who think that ganking unarmed ships jwith th sole purpose of griefing is PVP , the I MUST WIN generation like i call them , then yes you are right

I do not agree with what you are saying , but i will defend to the death your right to say it...... Voltaire

Degren
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#28 - 2012-06-06 07:51:09 UTC  |  Edited by: Degren
Diablo Ex wrote:
To be frankly honest here, a person's "Integrity" is measured by how they conduct themselves when nobody is looking. This game, and many aspects of the internet, are anonymous. This allows folks to act out as they want, without fear of consequences. You are as you imagine you are... Those who find enjoyment in ruining the day for others, and generally being a "sociopath" in game, is simply revealing their true inner nature. If they were to find themselves in an equally unconsequential situation, I expect that they would act out in real life as they do in game. Their only "restraint" if they are honest, is self-preservation. If they saw that they could gank and kill, without a danger of being caught, or permanently killed, they would not only do it, they would enjoy the thrill of it.

I speak from real world experience from being in the military and observing human nature. If we remove that thin veneer of civilization, we quickly find out who the animals are...

We also find out quickly who the whiny care bears are when a suicide bomber walks into your local restaurant...
I don't expect to see many folks in the neighborhood making excuses for the bomber, or referring to a sandbox.


This might be accurate if there were real world consequences for blowing up someone's ship.

Edit: Also, the term sociopath applies to someone who suffers from a one (or more) of a conditions from a large collection of semi-related psychological issues, most of which are highly, highly debatable as to whether they are a condition or an amalgamation of various unrelated symptoms.

IE: With the "right" doctor, anyone could be considered a sociopath, hence why psychology/psychiatry are still considered in a very, very early stage.

For a fairly brief summary

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sociopath

One very core part of it, though, is basically being unable to relate to society. Anti-social. A group, by definition, is a social construct.

Lookin at you, solo miners.

Hello, hello again.

Aramatheia
Tiffany and Co.
#29 - 2012-06-06 07:54:07 UTC
pvper's are evil child bashing aberrant freaks

miners/any high sec dwellers are plagues, burdens diseases

which one is correct? or are they both done to death, dead ended shallow minded "insults" hurled back and forth on an internet forum
Spikeflach
Perkone
Caldari State
#30 - 2012-06-06 08:18:34 UTC  |  Edited by: Spikeflach
Quote:
This might be accurate if there were real world consequences for blowing up someone's ship.

Edit: Also, the term sociopath applies to someone who suffers from a one (or more) of a conditions from a large collection of semi-related psychological issues, most of which are highly, highly debatable as to whether they are a condition or an amalgamation of various unrelated symptoms.

IE: With the "right" doctor, anyone could be considered a sociopath, hence why psychology/psychiatry are still considered in a very, very early stage.

For a fairly brief summary

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sociopath

One very core part of it, though, is basically being unable to relate to society. Anti-social. A group, by definition, is a social construct.

Lookin at you, solo miners.


He isn't talking about consequences of actions, he is talking about people's behaviors in an "anonymous" world in how it actually is showing your true nature.
Ten Bulls
Sons of Olsagard
#31 - 2012-06-06 08:18:54 UTC
Degren wrote:

One very core part of it, though, is basically being unable to relate to society. Anti-social. A group, by definition, is a social construct.

Lookin at you, solo miners.


Hmm, so your sayin its the solo miners that are mining the minerals that almost every item in eve is constructed from are the ones that are unable to relate to EVE society.
That the players that shoot those defenseless mining ships are actually helping EVE as a group by making those naughty miners stop with their selfish activities...

I cant possibly think think of any flaws in that argument, no sir no flaws in that logic, we just get rid of the selfish primary producers and the rest of society will be just fine. Or your making excuses to justify your previous beliefs, one or the other.
hedge betts Shiyurida
State Protectorate
Caldari State
#32 - 2012-06-06 08:22:55 UTC
Tallian Saotome wrote:
Accusing strangers of moral or psychological deviancy based on behavior in a video game only shows your own shortcomings to the world.
downer

Pog mo thoin

Cannibal Kane
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#33 - 2012-06-06 08:26:29 UTC
Herzog Wolfhammer wrote:
Cannibal Kane wrote:
In the RW...

I am actually a very calm and collected person... although still a geek.

When people bug me at work I simple tell them, because of what you did or did not do, somebody in EVE online is going hate me today.

Does that make a sociopath? I would rather vent by blowing things up in make believe than show up at the office with a shotgun.

Funny Story... I told my co-workers the only thing keeping me from showing up at work with a Shotgun and blowing all you away is my ability to go online and shoot people. I got nervous laughter which i found extremely funny.

They pay for my internet connection.



Oh dear.

DO NOT joke like that. It's bad enough being known to be a firearms instructor, worse actually having to work in an office.

People like to ninny and say they feel threatened. It's kind of like meta-gaming in an MMO. Sure they can't get your job or get promoted over you or something, but if they can say they "feel threatened" and get you hauled off by the cops, they will. Again I prefer if people who do stuff like that would play this game. That sort would come up to a belt in a Wreathe and one miner and see a Hulk and hit the "report bot" button just out of jealousy.


People would joke and ask me if I would bring a gun to work to help straighten out management and I would say "STFU that crap gives cops a chance to add to their own gun collections:"


Don't joke about that stuff. Eventually you will be dealing with someone who hears the word "gun" and they grow a 500 lb vagina and start peeing themselves and then you might find yourself in trouble.


haha yeah...

They actually said they would love to see me loose control since I never do.

But if people around me did not know my personality or how I behave then I might have had an issue with what you describe. Only make jokes like that and push boundries if you know people can take it. It takes a small slip in misjudgement of others threshold to recieve an invitation from HR to join them for Coffee.

"Kane is the End Boss of Highsec." -Psychotic Monk

Solstice Project
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#34 - 2012-06-06 08:37:54 UTC  |  Edited by: Solstice Project
I seriously consider people that scream "u mad" and ignore everything the other man says as sociopaths, yes.
They simply ignore every actual feeling one has and project only their own **** onto the other.

People that are so desperately in need of "SchadenFreude", that they have no idea about what's actually going
on/said by the other man ... definitely have issues with themselves.

And for the "it's just roleplaying"-crowd, i have to say that NOBODY can untie any of his behaviour from his inner
workings / mental state / emotional situation.

The last idiot i've blocked said he "raped" me and was proud about his mate using a disruptor and himself using a neut,
while the faction police killed me. And then they claimed awesomeness and me being mad, although they haven't done
anything except killwhoring. Acting like literally 12 year old kids that try to find a spot in their life, because they haven't
figured out yet how to be actually proud of themselves.

I sure hope i don't run out of blocking-slots too soon.
Chopper Rollins
hahahlolspycorp
Brave Collective
#35 - 2012-06-06 08:52:57 UTC
Herzog Wolfhammer wrote:
Cannibal Kane wrote:
In the RW...

...

Funny Story... I told my co-workers the only thing keeping me from showing up at work with a Shotgun and blowing all you away is my ability to go online and shoot people. I got nervous laughter which i found extremely funny.

They pay for my internet connection.



Oh dear.

DO NOT joke like that. It's bad enough being known to be a firearms instructor, worse actually having to work in an office.

...

People would joke and ask me if I would bring a gun to work to help straighten out management and I would say "STFU that crap gives cops a chance to add to their own gun collections:"


Don't joke about that stuff. Eventually you will be dealing with someone who hears the word "gun" and they grow a 500 lb vagina and start peeing themselves and then you might find yourself in trouble.


No need to overthink it. Where I'm from, you make joke/threats like that and magical things start to happen. Things like your wheel-nuts becoming loosened.


Goggles. Making me look good. Making you look good.

Nomad I
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#36 - 2012-06-06 08:53:45 UTC
A sociopath isn't able to build long term relationships and I see many lonely miners in the belts.
Bossy Lady
Vanishing Point.
The Initiative.
#37 - 2012-06-06 08:56:21 UTC
These things go through fashions. At the moment it's "You ganked my ship, you must be a sociopath."

Before that it was "You ganked my ship, you must have been abused as a child"

Before that it was "You ganked my ship, you must be an obese basement dweller"

Before that it was "You ganked my ship, you must be a teenage kid"

Before that, I wasn't playing EVE, but no doubt there was an equally plausible and evidence-based reason for you ganking my ship. Possibly because you were a hacker or maybe a communist vampire.


I wonder if it will ever be "You ganked my ship, you must have outplayed me in this encounter. Maybe next time I'll do the same to you"...?

Posting on this character because apparently some people get upset when they're asked difficult questions. M.

Vaju Enki
Secular Wisdom
#38 - 2012-06-06 09:06:39 UTC  |  Edited by: Vaju Enki
This comment usually comes from buthurt players that don't understand what EvE Online is. It's simply the result of their two-digit IQ at work.

It's like playing Poker and then calling someone "sociopath" because they took your money.

The Tears Must Flow

Aruken Marr
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#39 - 2012-06-06 09:32:31 UTC  |  Edited by: Aruken Marr
Spikeflach wrote:
Quote:
This might be accurate if there were real world consequences for blowing up someone's ship.


He isn't talking about consequences of actions, he is talking about people's behaviors in an "anonymous" world in how it actually is showing your true nature.


He was actually talking about people's actions when consequences are removed or diminished shows the strength of their moral character. This is true other than the fact that this is a computer game. Killing someone in a game or stealing in a game doesn't really have the same kind of effect on the victim/s as it does in real life, which is where the comparison doesn't really work.


Destiny Corrupted wrote:

- to a small/moderate degree, all of the above, but more often than not, mostly from the following list:

- extreme cussing
- promises of petitions due to my apparent use of hacks and exploits
- accusations of real-life terrorism
- threats of lawsuit/police action
- real-life threats to harm me (mostly done by people who also claimed to be in the armed forces or in possession of weapons)
- real-life threats to sexually-assault me
- real-life threats to harm my wife/significant other (I am unmarried)
- real-life threats to harm my children (I have no kids)
- real-life threats to sexually-assault my wife/significant other
- real-life threats to sexually-assault my children

(I really wish I didn't have to put that last one on there, but I don't want to sugar-coat the issue either; not only has it happened, it's happened more than once.)


It's amazing how many people can go absolutely ape **** over something like a game and then in the same breath accuse you of mental instability. A lot of people gank simply because of the hilarity of the reactions they get.
Cannibal Kane
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#40 - 2012-06-06 10:16:50 UTC  |  Edited by: Cannibal Kane
To go back on topic...

With regards to what people think Griefers/pvpers are compared to Carebears.

I have more abuse from Carebears than Griefers/pvpers. I see destiny has put it in list nicely and I can tell that is exactly how it is.

I get more threats from Carebears when they loose ships than I do from other PVP'ers.

So to me it appears the really calm and good people are PVP'ers doing something in eve they can;t do in RL... like blow up spaceships. Carebears are the sociopaths. Very agressive in RL, do something calming ingame until their world explodes into threats of retribution.

"Kane is the End Boss of Highsec." -Psychotic Monk