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Further evidence that Minmatar is overpowered, and Gallente underpowered
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Alexandria Aesirial
Fancypants Inc
Pandemic Horde
#21 - 2011-09-19 23:43:56 UTC  |  Edited by: Alexandria Aesirial
Practically, the sleipnir is much better than the abso. I strongly suggest an extra mid slot and more cap/pg for the abso. Evil

It's only blobbing when you lose, otherwise it's good fleet comp.
Zeomebuch Nova
Undrinkable Grog Inc.
#22 - 2011-09-19 23:50:07 UTC
Alexandria Aesirial wrote:
I thought I'd add this. Absolution deals almost the same amount of dps even though it's one turret short and has better EHP.

ABSO STATS

SLEIP STATS


Now forget the numbers on your desk and try fielding an abso and a sleip. Later on, tell me which one made shitloads more damage than the other, just dont keep em like sitting ducks while at it for the sake of unbiased, sense-making sheets.

Have fun.
Written Word
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#23 - 2011-09-20 00:38:58 UTC
I added up the number of turrets of a Brutix and a Deimos and the turrets of a Vagabond and a Cyclone

Gallente: 12!!!!!!!
Minmatar: 10

Obviously the only conclusion we can draw from excellent statistical data like this

Is to nerf gallente.
Headerman
Native Freshfood
Minmatar Republic
#24 - 2011-09-20 01:50:38 UTC  |  Edited by: Headerman
DarkAegix wrote:
Because I was exceedingly bored I decide to add up the T2 resists of each race.
Minmatar: 417.5
Caldari: 408.75
Amarr: 405
Gallente: 366

Minmatar is on top, of course. Gallente is at the bottom, as expected. Minmatar have their Vagabonds, while Gallente have their Diemosts.

On a side note, the Cyclone, Claymore and Sleipnir all have one extra slot compared to their counterparts.
Damnation = 17 slots
Sleipnir = 18 slots

*sigh*


Now add up short range default DPS (all highest tier guns, standard shortest range ammo, no damage mods)

Now add up EHP

In fact, let me google that for you.

Damnation: 40,817 EHP, 156 DPS with HAMs
Absolution: 29,217 EHP, 361 DPS
Claymore: 25,821 EHP, 216 DPS
Sleipnir: 23,862 EHP, 379 DPS

Oh what a surprise.

Australian Fanfest Event https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&find=unread&t=90062
Hatsumi Kobayashi
Perkone
Caldari State
#25 - 2011-09-20 02:00:17 UTC
Written Word wrote:
I added up the number of turrets of a Brutix and a Deimos and the turrets of a Vagabond and a Cyclone

Gallente: 12!!!!!!!
Minmatar: 10

Obviously the only conclusion we can draw from excellent statistical data like this

Is to nerf gallente.


To further support your claim I have added up the number of turrets of the Gallente battleships and the turrets of the Minmatar battleships.

Gallente: 21
Minmatar: 19

Obviously our conclusions match and we should indeed nerf Gallente.

No sig.
SpaceSquirrels
#26 - 2011-09-20 02:18:24 UTC
Simple.... train minm ships. It's not as if you dont have the option.
Goose99
#27 - 2011-09-20 02:42:26 UTC
SpaceSquirrels wrote:
Simple.... train minm ships. It's not as if you dont have the option.


By the time you're done with that, blasters will be buffed and autos rolled back.Big smile
Menenda Tararena
Project XIII
#28 - 2011-09-20 07:48:56 UTC
Adam Kirwen wrote:
Sphynix wrote:
All these wonderful posts about how this race or that race is WTFPWN or not... wasn't it just 2 years ago(?) that Minmatar were the "laughing stock" and everyone was saying they were the worst?


No, it wasn't.


3 years
Malcanis
Vanishing Point.
The Initiative.
#29 - 2011-09-20 07:59:04 UTC
DarkAegix wrote:
Because I was exceedingly bored I decide to add up the T2 resists of each race.
Minmatar: 417.5
Caldari: 408.75
Amarr: 405
Gallente: 366

Minmatar is on top, of course. Gallente is at the bottom, as expected. Minmatar have their Vagabonds, while Gallente have their Diemosts.

On a side note, the Cyclone, Claymore and Sleipnir all have one extra slot compared to their counterparts.
Damnation = 17 slots
Sleipnir = 18 slots

*sigh*


The Sleipnir and Damnation aren't counterparts

Sleipnir <=> Absolution
Claymore <=> Damnation

"Just remember later that I warned against any change to jump ranges or fatigue. You earned whats coming."

Grath Telkin, 11.10.2016
Malcanis
Vanishing Point.
The Initiative.
#30 - 2011-09-20 08:05:38 UTC
Menenda Tararena wrote:
Adam Kirwen wrote:
Sphynix wrote:
All these wonderful posts about how this race or that race is WTFPWN or not... wasn't it just 2 years ago(?) that Minmatar were the "laughing stock" and everyone was saying they were the worst?


No, it wasn't.


3 years


IIRC, Minmatar got their fix with Dominion with the changes to projectile ammo and to Tracking Enhancers/Computers. Blaster ships also received a small boost with the tracking enhancer change.

"Just remember later that I warned against any change to jump ranges or fatigue. You earned whats coming."

Grath Telkin, 11.10.2016
Malcanis
Vanishing Point.
The Initiative.
#31 - 2011-09-20 08:08:01 UTC
SpaceSquirrels wrote:
Simple.... train minm ships. It's not as if you dont have the option.


Train all ships. It gives one such a calm perspective in these nerf/buff tussles.

"Just remember later that I warned against any change to jump ranges or fatigue. You earned whats coming."

Grath Telkin, 11.10.2016
DarkAegix
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#32 - 2011-09-20 08:48:10 UTC
Malcanis wrote:

The Sleipnir and Damnation aren't counterparts

Sleipnir <=> Absolution
Claymore <=> Damnation

Oh, perfect, it's another one of you. I picked the Damnation because it's a very well known ship. Whatever point you're making is irrelevant, because I'm comparing command ship races and not command ship sub-classes. Let me make this abundantly clear:
Claymore - 18 slots
Sleipnir - 18 slots
Damnation - 17 slots
Absolution - 17 slots
Eos - 17 slots
Astarte - 17 slots
Nighthawk - 17 slots
Vulture - 17 slots
Aamrr
#33 - 2011-09-20 09:18:09 UTC  |  Edited by: Aamrr
Might want to throw in the Tier-1 BCs to that group, just for completion's sake.
Edit: Hardpoint analysis might be justified too.
DarkAegix
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#34 - 2011-09-20 10:06:42 UTC
Sleipnir
18 slots
7 turrets, 3 missiles

Claymore
18 slots
5 turrets, 3 missiles

Absolution
17 slots
6 turrets, 1 missile

Damnation
17 slots
4 turrets, 5 missiles

Nighthawk
17 slots
1 turret, 6 missiles

Vulture
17 slots
5 turrets, 5 missiles

Astarte
17 slots
7 turrets, 0 missiles

Eos
17 slots
5 turrets, 0 missiles

So, see any reason why the Minmatar command ships should have any slot advantage? There is none.


Tier 1 BCs:

Cyclone
17 slots
5 turrets, 3 missiles

Brutix
16 slots
7 turrets, 0 missiles

Ferox
16 slots
6 turrets, 5 missiles

Prophecy
16 slots
6 turrets, 1 missile

Aha, a reason for the extra slot. But is it balanced? No.
The Ferox, Brutix and Prophecy are all but USELESS.
Which tier 1 battlecruiser was heavily used throughout the alliance tournament? Cyclone.
All tier 1 BCs should be pushed up to the Cyclone's level, and the Command Ships balanced to remove Minmatar's completely unnecessary advantage.
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