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Incursions decimated by nerf
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Simi Kusoni
HelloKittyFanclub
#61 - 2012-06-03 13:43:49 UTC
Lin-Young Borovskova wrote:
Richard Desturned wrote:
sweetrock wrote:
And that was a bad thing? Null is the most boring place in the universe!!


It's boring because most of the potential targets aren't there because they're doing more lucrative PvE in hisec.




No, it's boring because easy target picking with no risk is easier in high sec. Now the way high sec incursions were done it helped, but since the changes I don't see that much more targets in null, so it changed nothing about the number of your null targets but just made high sec incursions something you don't even care about.

Where is the good job in this?


Thats probably because you are bloody terrible at finding targets.

In the last month I have seen a notable increase in the number of targets in low, null and wormholes.

[center]"I don't troll, I just give overly blunt responses that annoy people who are wrong but don't want to admit it. It's not my fault that people have sensitive feelings"  -MXZF[/center]
Maxpie
MUSE LLP
#62 - 2012-06-03 15:41:59 UTC
I used to run incursions once in a while for fun myself. Now it's not even worth the trip over to the location since there's such great chance that it will have just been a waste of time. I know people abused them as an isk faucet, but there must have been a better way to fix that issue than by making it a dead feature. I found them fun.

No good deed goes unpunished
Akirei Scytale
Okami Syndicate
#63 - 2012-06-03 15:44:05 UTC
Quote:
Incursions decimated by nerf


Pretty sure that was the point.

Risk vs Reward, muhfuggas.
Mallak Azaria
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#64 - 2012-06-03 16:00:07 UTC
sweetrock wrote:
Richard Desturned wrote:
Yes please keep comparing riskfree incursion isk to tech moons



So your saying O-tec - the agreement between 90% of 0.0 tech moon holders that who ever has a moon keeps it indefinatly - doesnt reduce the owning and passive, not even logged on income from techmoons not risk free?


If you've ever had to look after Tech moons, you would know that it's far from passive.

This post was lovingly crafted by a member of the Goonwaffe Posting Cabal, proud member of the popular gay hookup site somethingawful.com, Spelling Bee, Grammar Gestapo & #1 Official Gevlon Goblin Fanclub member.
Selinate
#65 - 2012-06-03 16:12:18 UTC
Fearless M0F0 wrote:

CCP: great work "rebalancing" hundredths of players out of the game Roll


That's a lot of players. What, like 0.05?
RubyPorto
RubysRhymes
#66 - 2012-06-03 16:56:46 UTC
Mallak Azaria wrote:
sweetrock wrote:
Richard Desturned wrote:
Yes please keep comparing riskfree incursion isk to tech moons



So your saying O-tec - the agreement between 90% of 0.0 tech moon holders that who ever has a moon keeps it indefinatly - doesnt reduce the owning and passive, not even logged on income from techmoons not risk free?


If you've ever had to look after Tech moons, you would know that it's far from passive.


Say No to POS. It's a gateway drug. Pretty soon you'll quit EvE. (Reaction farms, especially)

"It's easy to speak for the silent majority. They rarely object to what you put into their mouths." -Abrazzar "the risk of having your day ruined by other people is the cornerstone with which EVE was built" -CCP Solomon
Fearless M0F0
Incursion PWNAGE Asc
#67 - 2012-06-03 17:09:16 UTC
First time ever a thread I start exceeds 1 page \o/

I don't think the idea of CCP at "rebalancing" incursions was to force 2/3 of the incursion player base out. This need to be looked at and some small adjustments made. Moving vanguards toward being a little easier to complete (specially OTAs) would be a good start, even if the payout is reduced further.
Rico Minali
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#68 - 2012-06-03 17:19:56 UTC
The incursions were never run because of 'great community', not even for 'fun'. Incursions were never a 'great feature that people teamed up to complete'. Otherwise people would still be running them.

The ONLY reason people did incursions was the massive payout, never for fun, never for community, never for completing storyline RPing stuff. They were only run because of teh massive payout. So it is good that they are abandodned, it proved the whole point of why people were annoyed about them.

What I suggest now is to remove incursions entirely from hisec and nullsec, move them entirely to lowsec and keep the big payouts. Risk = Reward. You get two buffs then, incursion runners get to still do them adn lowsec gets a much needed buff. Mayeb even throw in a Sansha Faction for FW fans.

Trust me, I almost know what I'm doing.
Fearless M0F0
Incursion PWNAGE Asc
#69 - 2012-06-03 17:24:14 UTC  |  Edited by: Fearless M0F0
Selinate wrote:
Fearless M0F0 wrote:

CCP: great work "rebalancing" hundredths of players out of the game Roll


That's a lot of players. What, like 0.05?


Let me pull some numbers off my ass: on a weekend we used to find around 500 players per highsec incursion. Let's say each of these players is online for around 2 hrs. That would be 1500 x 12 = 18000 incursion runners pre-nerf. If we have 300k active subscriptions, that's 6% of the player base.

So this nerf too away a fun activity from around 5% of the players. Whether this is an isk faucet or not, CCP sells ENTERTAINMENT and made this game less entertaining to 5% of their CUSTOMERS. If I'm in charge of a company and a employee makes 5% of my customers unhappy, that dude would, at the very least, receive the kind of "work responsibility rebalance" that CCP Zulu got Evil
Simi Kusoni
HelloKittyFanclub
#70 - 2012-06-03 17:31:15 UTC
Fearless M0F0 wrote:
Selinate wrote:
Fearless M0F0 wrote:

CCP: great work "rebalancing" hundredths of players out of the game Roll


That's a lot of players. What, like 0.05?


Let me pull some numbers off my ass: on a weekend we used to find around 500 players per highsec incursion. Let's say each of these players is online for around 2 hrs. That would be 1500 x 12 = 18000 incursion runners pre-nerf. If we have 300k active subscriptions, that's 6% of the player base.

So this nerf too away a fun activity from around 5% of the players. Whether this is an isk faucet or not, CCP sells ENTERTAINMENT and made this game less entertaining to 5% of their CUSTOMERS. If I'm in charge of a company and a employee makes 5% of my customers unhappy, that dude would, at the very least, receive the treatment CCP Zulu got Evil

Wow that's some bad maths.

1) Assuming each player is online for 2 hours is ridiculous.
2) Last time CCP released any data we had 410k subscriptions.
3) 500 players, three incursions. Both assumptions backed up with zero data.
4) A large number of those players were for the incursion nerfs, for them CCP have not made the game less entertaining.
5) Not everyone stopped running incursions, you have not deducted these players from your end total.

etc.

[center]"I don't troll, I just give overly blunt responses that annoy people who are wrong but don't want to admit it. It's not my fault that people have sensitive feelings"  -MXZF[/center]
Fearless M0F0
Incursion PWNAGE Asc
#71 - 2012-06-03 17:35:52 UTC
Rico Minali wrote:
The incursions were never run because of 'great community', not even for 'fun'. Incursions were never a 'great feature that people teamed up to complete'. Otherwise people would still be running them.


Lots of us ran the live events before incursions. Got paid nothing for them yet we risked our ships and still participated because it was fun.

You might have a point about the payout. The Isk faucet needed to be addressed and some people left because isk/hr is no longer that good. I just find hard to believe all 65% of players who no longer run incursions left because of that.
RubyPorto
RubysRhymes
#72 - 2012-06-03 17:59:58 UTC
Fearless M0F0 wrote:
Rico Minali wrote:
The incursions were never run because of 'great community', not even for 'fun'. Incursions were never a 'great feature that people teamed up to complete'. Otherwise people would still be running them.


Lots of us ran the live events before incursions. Got paid nothing for them yet we risked our ships and still participated because it was fun.

You might have a point about the payout. The Isk faucet needed to be addressed and some people left because isk/hr is no longer that good. I just find hard to believe all 65% of players who no longer run incursions left because of that.


From my experience in incursions, I don't have any trouble believing exactly that. The payout is no longer better than l4s, so the incursion communities have disintegrated (except for the small number of people who honestly were there for the group pve, etc).

"It's easy to speak for the silent majority. They rarely object to what you put into their mouths." -Abrazzar "the risk of having your day ruined by other people is the cornerstone with which EVE was built" -CCP Solomon
Superpooper
SHITLORDS
#73 - 2012-06-03 18:12:45 UTC
Richard Desturned wrote:
sweetrock wrote:
And that was a bad thing? Null is the most boring place in the universe!!


It's boring because most of the potential targets aren't there because they're doing more lucrative PvE in hisec.


Can you be any more full of **** goon?

You have no targets because you blued everyone now STFU.
Aramatheia
Tiffany and Co.
#74 - 2012-06-03 18:41:49 UTC  |  Edited by: Aramatheia
RubyPorto wrote:
sweetrock wrote:
Richard Desturned wrote:
sweetrock wrote:
hmmmm palyers working together..... what like incursions....?


"Guys join this channel and x up for fleets whenever you feel like it"

Yeah running an incursion community is a lot like running a 0.0 alliance



That jstu proves you didnt run incursions in high sec what so ever, there were constant griefers, banlists, ship replacements etc I wasnt involved in it but know alot of background stuff went on


How were there Griefers? Were people baiting newbies in incursioned newbie systems? Bumping freighters?

Anyway, sounds like Awoxers, to me. Null has those too. More of them than incursions ever did.


Im guessing you are new to the forums. There were even posts made by people trying to organise methods of incursion griefing. People who knew each other were going in as logi then warping off once site was up in order to kill ships nothing more. Before the "hate" for miners in highsec it was a "hate" for incursion fleets. It always seemed to be orchestrated by some group from low/null too. I find that oddly curious indeed lol

I personally stopped flying incursions several months ago, took a bit of a break to get my alts orca training and mining booster/leadership skills up. I was having alot of difficulty back then as a relatively experienced logi 5 scimi pilot due to there being one or zero fleets up at any given time
Selinate
#75 - 2012-06-03 18:45:40 UTC
Fearless M0F0 wrote:
Selinate wrote:
Fearless M0F0 wrote:

CCP: great work "rebalancing" hundredths of players out of the game Roll


That's a lot of players. What, like 0.05?


Let me pull some numbers off my ass: on a weekend we used to find around 500 players per highsec incursion. Let's say each of these players is online for around 2 hrs. That would be 1500 x 12 = 18000 incursion runners pre-nerf. If we have 300k active subscriptions, that's 6% of the player base.

So this nerf too away a fun activity from around 5% of the players. Whether this is an isk faucet or not, CCP sells ENTERTAINMENT and made this game less entertaining to 5% of their CUSTOMERS. If I'm in charge of a company and a employee makes 5% of my customers unhappy, that dude would, at the very least, receive the kind of "work responsibility rebalance" that CCP Zulu got Evil


I was making more of a math joke. a hundredth is 0.01.
J3ssica Alba
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#76 - 2012-06-03 18:45:53 UTC
Arugas Koken wrote:


I don't understand.

Incursions still require fleets... If it really was the fleets you enjoyed and not the ISK, why go back to solo stuff?


Because it is now way harder to get a fleet especially in my timezone and I'm not going to waste my time waiting and doing nothing. So between doing nothing while sitting in an incursion constellation and doing something useful on my own in the little time I have to play, the choice is obvious don't you think?

Anyways I get the feeling that with your kind of post (similar to others in this thread) it is an argument that is lost before it's posted. 
This is my signature. There are many others like it, but this one is mine.  Without me, my signature is useless. Without my signature, I am useless
Darth Tickles
Doomheim
#77 - 2012-06-03 18:52:07 UTC
You heard it here first: the reason nobody does them anymore is because there's nobody to do them with anymore.
RubyPorto
RubysRhymes
#78 - 2012-06-03 19:22:25 UTC  |  Edited by: RubyPorto
Aramatheia wrote:
RubyPorto wrote:


How were there Griefers? Were people baiting newbies in incursioned newbie systems? Bumping freighters?

Anyway, sounds like Awoxers, to me. Null has those too. More of them than incursions ever did.


Im guessing you are new to the forums. There were even posts made by people trying to organise methods of incursion griefing. People who knew each other were going in as logi then warping off once site was up in order to kill ships nothing more. Before the "hate" for miners in highsec it was a "hate" for incursion fleets. It always seemed to be orchestrated by some group from low/null too. I find that oddly curious indeed lol

I personally stopped flying incursions several months ago, took a bit of a break to get my alts orca training and mining booster/leadership skills up. I was having alot of difficulty back then as a relatively experienced logi 5 scimi pilot due to there being one or zero fleets up at any given time


Show me where CCP's definition of Griefing includes disrupting other player's revenue streams?

CCP is very clear about what Griefing behavior is. They also enforce the prohibition on it fairly harshly. It pretty much boils down to ganking/baiting/messing with newbies in newbie systems and endlessly bumping freighters.

Nothing else is griefing. What you experienced wasn't griefing, it was big ebil meanies being mean. Probably for a profit.


And yes, I'm very new to the forums indeed Roll

"It's easy to speak for the silent majority. They rarely object to what you put into their mouths." -Abrazzar "the risk of having your day ruined by other people is the cornerstone with which EVE was built" -CCP Solomon
Richard Desturned
Royal Amarr Institute
Amarr Empire
#79 - 2012-06-03 19:42:47 UTC  |  Edited by: Richard Desturned
Superpooper wrote:
Can you be any more full of **** goon?

You have no targets because you blued everyone now STFU.


Keep thinking that there are no targets within arm's reach of our space. It's fine that you don't realize it, but your opinion on this matter is irrelevant in any case.

npc alts have no opinions worth consideration
Jalabaster
Aether Ventures
#80 - 2012-06-03 20:03:37 UTC
J3ssica Alba wrote:
I used to run Incursions and no I didn't really do it for the money.

J3ssica Alba wrote:
Oh well, I'm back to my solo stuff now.


Wait, what? I thought you didn't do it for the money?

"when a ship is blown up, the pilot usually winds up replacing it. This drives the economy, steadies inflation, and gives industrialists a reason to manufacture. In contrast, creating isk while never losing any items has the unfortunate reverse effect on the market, plus it isn't really any fun." Jala