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Are Exhumer's a dead ship line ?
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baltec1
Bat Country
Pandemic Horde
#141 - 2012-06-03 14:51:53 UTC
Jorma Morkkis wrote:
baltec1 wrote:
[Covetor, New Setup 1]
Damage Control II
Micro Auxiliary Power Core II

Medium F-S9 Regolith Shield Induction

Strip Miner I
Strip Miner I
Strip Miner I

Medium Core Defence Field Extender I
Medium Core Defence Field Extender I
Medium Core Defence Field Extender I

Hornet EC -600 X5


Even with T2 rigs it's still less than 15k. Not enough.


Mine survived. Not only is it not worth ganking but chances are it will jam you and get on your KM too. It work, 10 mil please.
Jorma Morkkis
State War Academy
Caldari State
#142 - 2012-06-03 15:02:08 UTC
baltec1 wrote:
Mine survived. Not only is it not worth ganking but chances are it will jam you and get on your KM too. It work, 10 mil please.


T2 fit Catalyst does 700 dps. 30 seconds to do as much damage as you can if you know what you're doing.

That's 21k of damage.
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#143 - 2012-06-03 15:11:12 UTC
…at this point, I really have to ask.

When was the last time anyone actually sat down and clocked the CONCORD response times at various sec levels?
baltec1
Bat Country
Pandemic Horde
#144 - 2012-06-03 15:11:54 UTC
Jorma Morkkis wrote:
baltec1 wrote:
Mine survived. Not only is it not worth ganking but chances are it will jam you and get on your KM too. It work, 10 mil please.


T2 fit Catalyst does 700 dps. 30 seconds to do as much damage as you can if you know what you're doing.

That's 21k of damage.


You dont get 30 seconds.
baltec1
Bat Country
Pandemic Horde
#145 - 2012-06-03 15:13:42 UTC
Tippia wrote:
…at this point, I really have to ask.

When was the last time anyone actually sat down and clocked the CONCORD response times at various sec levels?


My corp did before the caldari ice interdiction. We also tested all sorts of tank on barges to see what we could do and to get the best out of our gank ships.
Vaerah Vahrokha
Vahrokh Consulting
#146 - 2012-06-03 15:17:47 UTC
Tallian Saotome wrote:
Jorma Morkkis wrote:
Vaerah Vahrokha wrote:
I have witnessed many cov kills, the ganker kills them and then can still kill the pod.


That's my point. Cool

Then don't be AFK.


Then don't say a solo catalyst can't pull that. Blink

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Wilma Lawson
Hedion University
Amarr Empire
#147 - 2012-06-03 15:18:37 UTC  |  Edited by: Wilma Lawson
Bossy Lady wrote:
No, seriously though: read the ship description.

This reason = FAIL!
Ship Description, really? Mining Rokh anyone. Salvaging destroyers anyone? Salvaging Battlecruisers anyone?
People use ships all the time for purposes that are not in their description.

Quote:

Rokh:
Having long suffered the lack of an adequate hybrid platform, the Caldari State's capsule pilots found themselves rejoicing as the Rokh's design specs were released. A fleet vessel if ever there was one, this far-reaching and durable beast is expected to see a great deal of service on battlefields near and far.

Quote:

Catalyst:
Ideally suited for both skirmish warfare and fleet support, the Catalyst is touted as one of the best anti-frigate platforms out there. Faced with its top-of-the-line tracking equipment, not many can argue.

Quote:

Hurricane:
The force with which this ship hits is more than sufficient to leave a trail of shattered enemies, floating around like so much lifeless debris. An adaptable vessel, it has enough turret hardpoints for a full-scale assault while remaining versatile enough to allow for plenty of missile fire, and has both sufficient speed to outrun its enemies and sufficient capacitor charge to outlast them.
Wilma Lawson
Hedion University
Amarr Empire
#148 - 2012-06-03 15:20:37 UTC  |  Edited by: Wilma Lawson
Tippia wrote:
Why not?Because, funnily enough, they're too strong…


To put that claim into context, there was a thread a few years back (triggered by an earlier hulkageddon) about what the problem was with the Hulk, and the conclusion was that it's a bit too weak to work well outside of highsec, but too strong for anything you might need and encounter in highsec. Consequently, the barges were largely made obsolete by the existence of those exhumers (and by other, better, T1 mining-capable ships). “Strong” and “weak” meaning, in this case, both the tank and the yield.

Ideally, both barges and exhumers should be buffed, but the latter should be restricted to the actually dangerous parts of space where you need the extra tank and/or the extra yield to survive stronger belt rats and to be able to ninja-mine a big chunk of rocks before you run away (preferably using one less strip miner than usual, since that last highslot will take a cloak). Meanwhile, the barges are buffed to have about as easy a time with the highsec belt rats as the exhumers currently have, but they remain so cheap that they can simply “ISK tank” any player-based attack.

I see your point, to a point; but funnily enough you don't think it's capable to do it's intended job. Also, the reasons you state are design reasons. This ship was designed to do x, y, and z. That doesn't mean it can't be used for something else, i.e. mining Rokh, salvage destroyers.

If the devs intended it not to be used the high sec, then they wouldn't have allowed. it.
Tallian Saotome
Nuclear Arms Exchange Inc.
#149 - 2012-06-03 15:20:38 UTC
Vaerah Vahrokha wrote:
Tallian Saotome wrote:
Jorma Morkkis wrote:
Vaerah Vahrokha wrote:
I have witnessed many cov kills, the ganker kills them and then can still kill the pod.


That's my point. Cool

Then don't be AFK.


Then don't say a solo catalyst can't pull that. Blink

I said that?

Solo Catalyst can't kill a tanked hulk, I stand by that, but solo covetor? Probably can, even tanked, but who cares? Its just a covetor.

First rule of EVE, after all. Don't fly what you can't afford to lose Bear

Inappropriate signature removed, CCP Phantom.
Jorma Morkkis
State War Academy
Caldari State
#150 - 2012-06-03 15:23:08 UTC
Tallian Saotome wrote:
I never said anything about tanking it, but the idea is that you are ISK tanking it.

The loss costs you so little that it is meaningless, in other words.


Not really. Ganker still gets his profit from doing it. And a easy kill.

Covetor is 30 million now. Requires quite a lot of mining if you keep losing them.
Tallian Saotome
Nuclear Arms Exchange Inc.
#151 - 2012-06-03 15:23:16 UTC
Wilma Lawson wrote:
If the devs intended it not to be used the high sec, then they wouldn't have allowed. it.

The intended for bombers, HICs, and DICs to be used in highsec?

Problem is, the only realistic way to prevent it would be to make strips not work in highsec, which would neuter barges, which ARE meant to be used that way.

Inappropriate signature removed, CCP Phantom.
Barbara Nichole
Royal Amarr Institute
Amarr Empire
#152 - 2012-06-03 15:23:44 UTC
Tippia wrote:
Wilma Lawson wrote:
Price Check Aisle3 wrote:
Exhumers don't belong in high-sec.
Why not?
Because, funnily enough, they're too strong…



hogwash, If something isn't done to mackinaws they might as well take them out.. everyone will have to be mining ice with hulks. Macks have no room for a sufficient tank.

  - remove the cloaked from local; free intel is the real problem, not  "afk" cloaking -

[IMG]http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a208/DawnFrostbringer/consultsig.jpg[/IMG]
Tallian Saotome
Nuclear Arms Exchange Inc.
#153 - 2012-06-03 15:24:08 UTC
Jorma Morkkis wrote:
Tallian Saotome wrote:
I never said anything about tanking it, but the idea is that you are ISK tanking it.

The loss costs you so little that it is meaningless, in other words.


Not really. Ganker still gets his profit from doing it. And a easy kill.

Covetor is 30 million now. Requires quite a lot of mining if you keep losing them.

How does he get his profit? Oh, are you still insisting on using the most expensive mods you can to mine?

Inappropriate signature removed, CCP Phantom.
Barbara Nichole
Royal Amarr Institute
Amarr Empire
#154 - 2012-06-03 15:27:07 UTC
Wilma Lawson wrote:
Tippia wrote:
Why not?
Because, funnily enough, they're too strong…
.



it's like a terrorist claiming that somehow you are responsible for his attack on you because you are strong... sorry I don't by the flimsy excuse.

  - remove the cloaked from local; free intel is the real problem, not  "afk" cloaking -

[IMG]http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a208/DawnFrostbringer/consultsig.jpg[/IMG]
Skydell
Bad Girl Posse
#155 - 2012-06-03 15:29:48 UTC
Wilma Lawson wrote:
This can apply to many ships.



This really.

---

Price Check Aisle3 wrote:
Exhumers don't belong in high-sec, but they're not a dead ship line.


Then they can remove Mining missions because 40% of them are Ice and require a Mackinaw. Yes, I have heard it 1000 times, they suck and nobody does them but said again, if thats the case, get rid of them.
Much like the ships though, if they got rid of all the trash nobody does or uses suddenly the sandbox of EVE would look more like a pottery factory.
Tallian Saotome
Nuclear Arms Exchange Inc.
#156 - 2012-06-03 15:29:51 UTC
Barbara Nichole wrote:
Wilma Lawson wrote:
Tippia wrote:
Why not?
Because, funnily enough, they're too strong…
.



it's like a terrorist claiming that somehow you are responsible for his attack on you because you are strong... sorry I don't by the flimsy excuse.

Its pretty much the reason to do terrorist attacks, since if your target wasn't so strong an actual military attack would be much more effective.

Then again, the US invented modern terrorism with the Green Barets, to deal with Cambodia during the Vietnam war.

Inappropriate signature removed, CCP Phantom.
Skydell
Bad Girl Posse
#157 - 2012-06-03 15:30:28 UTC
Barbara Nichole wrote:
Wilma Lawson wrote:
Tippia wrote:
Why not?
Because, funnily enough, they're too strong…
.



it's like a terrorist claiming that somehow you are responsible for his attack on you because you are strong... sorry I don't by the flimsy excuse.


Also called wife beater syndrome.
Jorma Morkkis
State War Academy
Caldari State
#158 - 2012-06-03 15:32:28 UTC
Tallian Saotome wrote:
How does he get his profit? Oh, are you still insisting on using the most expensive mods you can to mine?


T2 strip miners and T2 MAPC aren't what you would call 'cheap'.
RubyPorto
RubysRhymes
#159 - 2012-06-03 15:33:39 UTC
Jorma Morkkis wrote:
Tallian Saotome wrote:
I never said anything about tanking it, but the idea is that you are ISK tanking it.

The loss costs you so little that it is meaningless, in other words.


Not really. Ganker still gets his profit from doing it. And a easy kill.

Covetor is 30 million now. Requires quite a lot of mining if you keep losing them.


1) The Covetor is insurable.
2) HS mining has around a 30m ISK/hr income
3) The fittings available to drop are worth a total of 10m Isk (50% is likely to drop). The two Catalysts required to gank it are worth 10m Isk. There's no bounty on Covetors. Nobody's going to bother.
4) Where's My Money?

"It's easy to speak for the silent majority. They rarely object to what you put into their mouths." -Abrazzar "the risk of having your day ruined by other people is the cornerstone with which EVE was built" -CCP Solomon
Wilma Lawson
Hedion University
Amarr Empire
#160 - 2012-06-03 15:37:22 UTC
Tallian Saotome wrote:
Wilma Lawson wrote:
If the devs intended it not to be used the high sec, then they wouldn't have allowed. it.

The intended for bombers, HICs, and DICs to be used in highsec?

Problem is, the only realistic way to prevent it would be to make strips not work in highsec, which would neuter barges, which ARE meant to be used that way.

Exactly, then weird rules come into play that don't make much logical sense, but does seem to make some game mechanic sense. So really, Eve isn't a sandbox.