These forums have been archived and are now read-only.

The new forums are live and can be found at https://forums.eveonline.com/

EVE General Discussion

 
  • Topic is locked indefinitely.
 

What is the point of High Sec?
Author
Previous Topic Next Topic
Malcanis
Vanishing Point.
The Initiative.
#161 - 2012-05-28 22:18:49 UTC
Nemesis Factor wrote:
Eva Rourge wrote:
Tippia wrote:
Eva Rourge wrote:
Interesting, but define cost please.
Get a dictionary.


No reason for aggression. Simply pointing to the fact that cost is relative and may approach zero and thus become irrelevant.


She probably realized you weren't genuinely asking the question. You had your pre-conceptions already and we're shooting down everyone's input and would continue to do so until we all came to the same conclusion as you; that hi-sec is unnecessary.

As for my two cents, imagine joining this game in lowsec. Unless you know someone in the game you are instantly toast. No opportunity to gain a foothold, no money to buy ships, no way to make money. Within a day you would have no isk, no assets and no reason to continue your sub.



mmm I'm not so sure this is true.

"Just remember later that I warned against any change to jump ranges or fatigue. You earned whats coming."

Grath Telkin, 11.10.2016
Barbelo Valentinian
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#162 - 2012-05-28 23:16:34 UTC
It's just a place where relatively new, mainly PvE players, can find their feet re.the mechanics of the game without too much danger of getting ganked. It also makes sense as lore.
Ocih
Space Mermaids
#163 - 2012-05-28 23:27:25 UTC
Patch to patch the answer will be different.

In other words, CCP don't have a fuckin clue what it's for.
Aggressive Nutmeg
#164 - 2012-05-29 00:07:31 UTC
Imagine how boring the game would be if you didn't have several environments to work with.

The game is richer for the presence of high, low and null. Each requires a different skillset. Take any of them away and we have a lesser game.

Never make eye contact with someone while eating a banana.
Thorn Galen
Bene Gesserit ChapterHouse
The Curatores Veritatis Auxiliary
#165 - 2012-05-29 09:17:00 UTC
Eva Rourge wrote:
Thorn Galen wrote:
Good grief, yet another one of these posts.


Define "these" please.


"this" = singular, one.
"these" = plural, many.

I hope I have contributed positvely towards your language acumen.

COO - Bene Gesserit Chapterhouse  CEO - Sanctuary Pact Alliance
Roime
Mea Culpa.
Shadow Cartel
#166 - 2012-05-29 09:54:50 UTC
Hisec is the tutorial and market area of New Eden. It's just a bit broken at the moment, and many people exploit the features that are meant to help new players to learn the game and gather some capital.


.
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#167 - 2012-05-29 10:01:15 UTC
Roime wrote:
Hisec is the tutorial and market area of New Eden.
Nope. Never was, never will be.
Cushi
Planet Buffy
#168 - 2012-05-29 11:09:11 UTC
Eva Rourge wrote:
No wall of text here, just a simple question. A clear one sentence reply would benice.

So CCP Devs don't have to take up singing.
Malcanis
Vanishing Point.
The Initiative.
#169 - 2012-05-29 11:11:23 UTC
Roime wrote:
Hisec is the tutorial and market area of New Eden. It's just a bit broken at the moment, and many people exploit the features that are meant to help new players to learn the game and gather some capital.




This may have been the original conception but it hasn't been true since at least 2006. The sooner that we recongnise that Hi-sec isn't just a starter area, the sooner we can have a sensible debate on how to develop it to provide high-end, high-risk, high-reward gameplay.

I wrote a thing.

"Just remember later that I warned against any change to jump ranges or fatigue. You earned whats coming."

Grath Telkin, 11.10.2016
March rabbit
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#170 - 2012-05-29 11:13:12 UTC
Tippia wrote:
Roime wrote:
Hisec is the tutorial and market area of New Eden.
Nope. Never was, never will be.

have never heard about Jita? Shocked

The Mittani: "the inappropriate drunked joke"
J'Poll
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#171 - 2012-05-29 11:16:58 UTC
Without high-sec a lot of griever corps and alliance would not alive and a lot of players wouldn't have the game they like to play.

Personal channel: Crazy Dutch Guy

Help channel: Help chat - Reloaded

Public roams channels: RvB Ganked / Redemption Road / Spectre Fleet / Bombers bar / The Content Club
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#172 - 2012-05-29 11:20:42 UTC
March rabbit wrote:
have never heard about Jita? Shocked
Jita is definitely not a tutorial area and only ever really hurts new players. They might indeed learn something from the experience, though, but they'll do that same when they jump into HED-GP as well.
Bad Messenger
Rehabilitation Clinic
#173 - 2012-05-29 11:22:58 UTC
Snow Burst wrote:
Bad Messenger wrote:
Question is wrong, why we need 0.0 is proper question.

for fun... nuff said


What is fun in there?
Malcanis
Vanishing Point.
The Initiative.
#174 - 2012-05-29 11:26:00 UTC
Bad Messenger wrote:
Snow Burst wrote:
Bad Messenger wrote:
Question is wrong, why we need 0.0 is proper question.

for fun... nuff said


What is fun in there?



I live in Curse, plenty of fun to be had there (also missions)

"Just remember later that I warned against any change to jump ranges or fatigue. You earned whats coming."

Grath Telkin, 11.10.2016
Roime
Mea Culpa.
Shadow Cartel
#175 - 2012-05-29 11:41:02 UTC
Malcanis wrote:
Roime wrote:
Hisec is the tutorial and market area of New Eden. It's just a bit broken at the moment, and many people exploit the features that are meant to help new players to learn the game and gather some capital.




This may have been the original conception but it hasn't been true since at least 2006. The sooner that we recongnise that Hi-sec isn't just a starter area, the sooner we can have a sensible debate on how to develop it to provide high-end, high-risk, high-reward gameplay.

I wrote a thing.


All the issues involved with hisec currently stem from it not functioning properly as a tutorial & neutral market area.

It's impossible to balance the safety and income for older players between security levels so that everyone is happy.

1. If you leave it as it is, everybody whines (high reward, uncontrollable risk)
2. If you buff safety to satisfy carebears, rest of EVE whines
3. If you nerf income to satisfy rest of EVE, carebears whine

it would be great to have 4. Buff the income outside hisec, but this would probably break EVE.

When it's fixed and established as a tutorial area, these problems cease to exist. New players plan their tutorial time with the mindset that they will eventually leave the cradle.

How to do this, and what it would do subscriber counts does not interest me.

Problem is as stated above, and I see only two solutions. CCP can either ignore the whine (will work fine, forum whiners are not really important in the grand scheme) or completely change the mechanics of NPC corps and hisec, content & feature balancing will never completely solve the issues.



.
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#176 - 2012-05-29 11:52:48 UTC
Roime wrote:
All the issues involved with hisec currently stem from it not functioning properly as a tutorial & neutral market area.
Close, but not quite. All issues stem from people falsely believing it's a tutorial area. As soon as people drop this notion, the vast majority of the supposed issues go away.

If people stop assuming that it is, and stop thinking that they can hide behind it, the level of automated safety turns out to be just right — perhaps even a bit on the high side — and they will start to create their own security, there as everywhere else.

Stop spreading the myth.
Roime
Mea Culpa.
Shadow Cartel
#177 - 2012-05-29 11:56:27 UTC
Tippia wrote:
Roime wrote:
All the issues involved with hisec currently stem from it not functioning properly as a tutorial & neutral market area.
Close, but not quite. All issues stem from people falsely believing it's a tutorial area. As soon as people drop this notion, the vast majority of the supposed issues go away.

If people stop assuming that it is, and stop thinking that they can hide behind it, the level of automated safety turns out to be just right — perhaps even a bit on the high side — and they will start to create their own security, there as everywhere else.

Stop spreading the myth.


No, they do not realise it was meant to be a tutorial area.

The whiners think it's a PVE server in the middle of the sandbox.

.
Talon SilverHawk
Patria o Muerte
#178 - 2012-05-29 12:07:06 UTC  |  Edited by: Talon SilverHawk
Tippia wrote:
Eva Rourge wrote:
The point is: with all the noise around ganking and mining and bears and goons and whatnot - does anyone actually understand what this particular environment is supposed to represent and what one should actually expect of it?
Most people do, yes. The rest whine.


Nope, some ppl think they know , and are biased towards there own play style. Everyone complains when they think its biased towards the play style of someone else.. (which it currently is as far as high sec ganking of Hulks is concerned)

Tal
Roime
Mea Culpa.
Shadow Cartel
#179 - 2012-05-29 12:08:17 UTC
Talon SilverHawk wrote:
Tippia wrote:
Eva Rourge wrote:
The point is: with all the noise around ganking and mining and bears and goons and whatnot - does anyone actually understand what this particular environment is supposed to represent and what one should actually expect of it?
Most people do, yes. The rest whine.


Nope, some ppl think they know , and are biased towards there own play style. Everyone complains when they think its tipped towards the play style of someone else..

Tal





What's a "play style"?

.
Talon SilverHawk
Patria o Muerte
#180 - 2012-05-29 12:11:18 UTC
Roime wrote:
Tippia wrote:
Roime wrote:
All the issues involved with hisec currently stem from it not functioning properly as a tutorial & neutral market area.
Close, but not quite. All issues stem from people falsely believing it's a tutorial area. As soon as people drop this notion, the vast majority of the supposed issues go away.

If people stop assuming that it is, and stop thinking that they can hide behind it, the level of automated safety turns out to be just right — perhaps even a bit on the high side — and they will start to create their own security, there as everywhere else.

Stop spreading the myth.


No, they do not realise it was meant to be a tutorial area.

The whiners think it's a PVE server in the middle of the sandbox.




Its not just a tutorial area, can you show me where it says that in the official documentation ?


The sand box is bollocks, CCP regularly change rules in all sec areas depending on balance and player found exploitations.

Tal