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ATTN: Everyone moaning over the new UI and anything else

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Roime
Mea Culpa.
Shadow Cartel
#41 - 2012-05-23 12:43:57 UTC  |  Edited by: Roime
Tippia wrote:
Roime wrote:
That is exactly why I compare these three, font & Neo-Neocom were both purely net improvements, with 0 functionality lost.
Eh no. The necom was a reduction in functionality in terms of how well it handles chat channels and other, similar multiples of windows of the same category.


Instead of forcing you to keep a gutter for minimized chat windows (or have them overlapping other windows), new Neocom allows you to minimize them properly. Double-click the header bar to minimize them in a form that keeps member count visible. No functionality lost, just different.

Quote:
The current UI is not a case of net improvements: it adds two things, solves a third, but breaks so much else that it lands squarely in the negative in terms of functionality. It may very well be that the functionality lost was something you never used, but trust me: it has lost far more than it has gained.


It's difficult to feel bad for losing features one doesn't need, and bloobloo I unsub, trust me I know bloobloo doesn't really change that.

Quote:
It's only “blatantly wrong” in the sense of “it shouldn't work that way”. It is unfortunately not blatantly wrong in the sense of “that's incorrect”…


If you'd start counting, you'd find that there are way more cases when reasoning has lead to changes, and only a few cases when statue-shooting has lead to anything, and even those few cases are debatable. You know that you are trying to turn our subjective opinion into a fact.

Quote:
…and are unable to explain how or why, whereas those who are complaining about it have very long and very detailed lists of what's wrong by now (and have had those for many weeks).


1. Filters in POS hangar Divs. To keep my gear organised in my hangar, I've resorted to using named GSCs. To use these, I had to swap to an indy to open the can. The new filters allow me to just lump everything in the hangar, and find everything easily and quickly.

2. Folder (container) tree. Instead of needing to have two windows open, I can move things from the open window to other containers.

3. Volume and value readouts. No more calculator for mundane tasks.

4. Less clicks and shorter dragging distances.

As I haven't experienced any missing features relevant to my workflows, it adds up to a positive change.

.
MisterArch
Red October.
Fanatic Legion.
#42 - 2012-05-23 12:44:58 UTC
Well. I'd ask someone liking the new inventroy to go to the POS and try to break through than inventory. Having all the turrets in the inventory navigation, alongside with all the other structures... Not mentioning problems with dividing loot between containers and so on... For those living at POSes it is awful.
CCP Soundwave
C C P
C C P Alliance
#43 - 2012-05-23 12:46:08 UTC
There's about 5 inventory threads going right now and I can't keep up with all of them. I'm going to stick to posting in this one: https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=1346084#post1346084
Jack Paladin
State War Academy
Caldari State
#44 - 2012-05-23 12:47:21 UTC
This thread did show signs of recovery but now .... *sad face*. Waiting for CCP to clear out all the bs posts. +1 to those of you who actually gave a point of view and detailed reply on the new Inventory UI.

Steijn
Quay Industries
#45 - 2012-05-23 12:52:11 UTC
Roime wrote:
Darth Kilth wrote:
Nobody is complaining for the sake of complaining, if that is why you think everyone is complaining it is not a miracle you don't get why they are complaining.
The new UI is brilliant, yes, but poorly worked out and thats why we hate it, not because its 'different'

But I guess you are just fishing for attention here, and not for actual discussion.


Maybe the problem is that none of the complainers can actually point out anything that is wrong with the inventory? It's all just bloblooblooo I unsub bloobloo.


1 thing - it lags like ****!!!.

Considering CCP had this massive 'war on lag' episode awhile back, its absolutely hilarious to find them contradicting themselves so quickly and inducing more lag into the game.
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#46 - 2012-05-23 13:04:16 UTC  |  Edited by: Tippia
Roime wrote:
Instead of forcing you to keep a gutter for minimized chat windows (or have them overlapping other windows), new Neocom allows you to minimize them properly. Double-click the header bar to minimize them in a form that keeps member count visible.
…and have them take up much more space in a location where they're kind of in the way while minimised.

Quote:
It's difficult to feel bad for losing features one doesn't need, and bloobloo I unsub, trust me I know bloobloo doesn't really change that.
…it worked the last time. Twisted

Quote:
If you'd start counting, you'd find that there are way more cases when reasoning has lead to changes, and only a few cases when statue-shooting has lead to anything, and even those few cases are debatable.
They've increased with time, and the cases are not really debatable. We got the hangar back and we're only now getting any kind of response to the UI feedback (and let's go through all the carrier and capship revamps…) because people yelled. A lot. If the reasoning had worked, they wouldn't have happened to begin with.

Quote:
As I haven't experienced any missing features relevant to my workflows, it adds up to a positive change.
The things you've listed are things that everyone else agrees are nice as well (aside from #4, since more clicking and dragging is among the many complaints), but here's the thing: most of them already existed — they're not actual improvements, just the same thing presented in a new way. I'm talking about the issues being presented and why they somehow don't count as being issues and how “shift click” — the standard troll response — in any way eases or removes those issues. Dismissing issues because you have a minute set of use cases where they don't appear, and then grandly proclaiming that it's working fine is downright insulting. No reason is given why the complaints are invalid and that things are actually fine.

And again, you're kind of only raising the question “wth were you doing before if you had those problems?!”
Roime
Mea Culpa.
Shadow Cartel
#47 - 2012-05-23 13:19:32 UTC
Tippia wrote:
…and have them take up much more space in a location where they're kind of in the way while minimised.


They have the same pixel height, with the difference that you don't have to reserve screen estate for a place to minimize them.

Quote:
The things you've listed are things that everyone else agrees are nice as well (aside from #4, since more clicking and dragging is among the many complaints), but here's the thing: most of them already existed — they're not actual improvements, just the same thing presented in a new way. I'm talking about the issues being presented and why they somehow don't count as being issues and how “shift click” — the standard troll response — in any way eases or removes those issues. Dismissing issues because you have a minute set of use cases where they don't appear, and then grandly proclaiming that it's working fine is downright insulting. No reason is given why the complaints are invalid and that things are actually fine.

And again, you're kind of only raising the question “wth were you doing before if you had those problems?!”


When I lived in K-space, I had a neatly organised base in a station, with opened GSC windows covering most of the docked up view. Now I live in the Great Unknown, and have assets in the stinking hangar divs and spread across 30+ systems just on this character. The new system provides me with the same functionality as the GSC version, without me actually wasting any time or money to do it... and using much less screen estate to achieve it.

Same with my indy alt, no more hassle with blueprints or mineral stacks, just lump it all in one hangar and forget.

PI alts, trade alt, even my bomber alt living out of a can has it easier. This is my subjective experience.

I didn't say that the complaints are invalid, when someone actually made the effort and listed them. All I'm saying that bloobloo I unsub bloobloo is an invalid method of operation, in this case like it is in every other case.

.
Darion Amador
Followers of Ouroboros
#48 - 2012-05-23 13:43:39 UTC  |  Edited by: Darion Amador
Personally i think the poor devs should get their own forum where they can rant at the players LolTwisted

On second thought, they probably do already Lol
Josef Djugashvilis
#49 - 2012-05-23 13:52:59 UTC
Lady Hofstedar wrote:
Purple Storm wrote:
LOL @ Lady Hofstedar for really having no clue that there is a diference between a game and RL.
Go back to your awsome life and STFU


Got abit touchy there didnt u

Didn't like what i typed or did i offend your *honour*

Get a life, this is the 21st century, armys dont defend civilized countrys anymore, we invade the weak and procalim them terroists.

Anytime sumone tells me to STFU cause he's *in the military*.

Go jump off a bridge, perhaps another innocent child in another country will live another week.


Lady you would be on safer ground if you dropped the IQ bit as you show precious little evidence of it here.What?

This is not a signature.
Jack Paladin
State War Academy
Caldari State
#50 - 2012-05-23 14:04:46 UTC
Darion Amador wrote:
Personally i think the poor devs should get their own forum where they can rant at the players LolTwisted

On second thought, they probably do already Lol


One does wonder how they up with all our bs. +1 for the devs who have to read our crap =\
Cedar Locus
Fleet 2 die
#51 - 2012-05-23 14:12:33 UTC
dont know if OP is trolling or serious
TheGunslinger42
All Web Investigations
#52 - 2012-05-23 14:42:38 UTC
Jack Paladin wrote:
Note: Realising the audience that will likely reply to this topic, I shall not be pouring my blood and tears into a heartfelt rant that will ultimately lead me to WIN eve. So I will keep it nice and simple.

Stop complaining for the sake of complaining.

The new UI is BRILLIANT. Just cause you basement dwellers are too fail to adapt to change and anything remotely different introduced is indicitive of one thing. You suck at EVE.

Learn to play the game or GTFO.

I heard http://www.eveuniversity.org is really good for players wanting to learn how to play the game.

And your stuff .... keep it. Do not want.

Lastly, you need to be reminded of one thing.

http://www.whiteroseconventicle.com/images/stories/eve_learning_curve.png

Thankyou for the time.

That is all.


They complain about some ui change, you complain about people who have a different opinion. You're as annoying as they are, go shitpost somewhere else.
Asuri Kinnes
Perkone
Caldari State
#53 - 2012-05-23 14:56:07 UTC  |  Edited by: Asuri Kinnes
Jack Paladin wrote:
Stop complaining for the sake of complaining.

The new UI is BRILLIANT. Just cause you basement dwellers are too fail to adapt to change and anything remotely different introduced is indicitive of one thing. You suck at EVE.

The new UI sucks in space around a POS. How about those of us complaining because of real issues? Or do you label anyone that doesn't agree with you a "basement dweller". If that's the case (and it looks like it is) get real. Everyone pissing/moaning over this is a paying subscriber who have a right to vent their opinion.


Don't like it? Don't read it.


P.S. - *you* suck at eve (even though I know nothing about you, it makes as much sense as your random ad-hominem personal insult against others).

Bob is the god of Wormholes.

That's all you need to know.
Ban Bindy
Bindy Brothers Pottery Association
True Reign
#54 - 2012-05-23 14:56:36 UTC
Jack Paladin wrote:
Darth Kilth wrote:
Nobody is complaining for the sake of complaining, if that is why you think everyone is complaining it is not a miracle you don't get why they are complaining.
The new UI is brilliant, yes, but poorly worked out and thats why we hate it, not because its 'different'

But I guess you are just fishing for attention here, and not for actual discussion.


When the situation demands it, my Troll hat will get put away and my Diplomatic Discussion hat will get dusted off.

Sadly, this is what the EVE forums have become...

Until someone actually proves they are willing to have a genuine discussion with me regarding the current state of EVE, I reserve that energy for more productive uses.


Confirming that I don't care what hat you are wearing, you sound too smug for any kind of real discussion.
Jack Paladin
State War Academy
Caldari State
#55 - 2012-05-23 16:13:59 UTC
Ban Bindy wrote:
Jack Paladin wrote:
Darth Kilth wrote:
Nobody is complaining for the sake of complaining, if that is why you think everyone is complaining it is not a miracle you don't get why they are complaining.
The new UI is brilliant, yes, but poorly worked out and thats why we hate it, not because its 'different'

But I guess you are just fishing for attention here, and not for actual discussion.


When the situation demands it, my Troll hat will get put away and my Diplomatic Discussion hat will get dusted off.

Sadly, this is what the EVE forums have become...

Until someone actually proves they are willing to have a genuine discussion with me regarding the current state of EVE, I reserve that energy for more productive uses.


Confirming that I don't care what hat you are wearing, you sound too smug for any kind of real discussion.


Confirming your confirmation.

Asuri Kinnes wrote:

Don't like it? Don't read it.
Leetha Layne
#56 - 2012-05-23 16:16:31 UTC
It is a video game.
Jack Paladin
State War Academy
Caldari State
#57 - 2012-05-23 16:17:52 UTC
Leetha Layne wrote:
It is a video game.


Finally someone who gets it.

You just won EVE!

We need to be reminded of this from time to time.
Barbelo Valentinian
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#58 - 2012-05-23 16:37:01 UTC
Jack Paladin wrote:
Leetha Layne wrote:
It is a video game.


Finally someone who gets it.

You just won EVE!

We need to be reminded of this from time to time.


Yes, it's an MMO videogame, and generally MMO videogame developers try to improve functionality for their users, not reduce it.

I think the current type of problem is a rather unique problem to CCP actually. I'm sure most EVE devs do love EVE and play it sometimes. But by the nature of the beast, it's highly unlikely that they're going to play it as intensively, or have played it as long and intensively, as many of the players. That's going to be a common situation for most videogames.

But in this one, EVE, the game has a property not many other videogames, even MMOs, have - for certain types of players and playstyles, there's a HUGE amount of inventory management, of shuffling things from one place to another.

It's probably natural that people who don't play the game as much as many other players won't understand the workflow that power users have developed.

But isn't that part of what putting things on test is for, to overcome such blind spots?

*sigh*
General Freight
GIRLFRIEND SURF TEAM
#59 - 2012-05-23 16:44:46 UTC
Nalha Saldana wrote:
The new inventory is good but still have some major issues.

Being at a POS blows up the list with all the guns making it horrible to navigate, there is no division memory for structures etc.


And since you can't name the Corp Hangars and such, it's a real ***** to know which one is which. Not nearly as fun to interact with as clicking on a starbase structure in space. We set up our POSes in a meaningful spatial arrangement. Now it's a pain in the ass to use that arrangement, because the giant new UI window always opens itself across my whole screen.


I'm glad there are people for whom this "upgrade" is not a clusterfuck. I have enjoyed not caring about many other patches, because they did not negatively effect my game play and even brought new and cool stuff sometimes. This is not one of those occasions. You have radically changed my ability to ignore this update. The degree to which it inconveniences my game play is directly proportional to the complexity of the wad my panties are currently in.
CCP Guard
C C P
C C P Alliance
#60 - 2012-05-23 17:46:28 UTC
There's enough threads about this topic already that are far more constructive.

CCP Guard | EVE Community Developer | @CCP_Guard
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