These forums have been archived and are now read-only.

The new forums are live and can be found at https://forums.eveonline.com/

Jita Park Speakers Corner

 
  • Topic is locked indefinitely.
 

Issler Dainzer should be removed from the csm.

First post
Author
Nick Bison
Bison Industrial Inc
#21 - 2012-05-19 16:38:43 UTC
White Tree wrote:
More like Issler Dunce.


Was almost clever ... almost.

Nothing clever at this time.

HVAC Repairman
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
#22 - 2012-05-19 16:39:07 UTC
Andreus Ixiris wrote:
But wasn't the whole CFC argument before that Mittani shouldn't be removed from the CSM, despite violating the EULA?

What has Issler done? Has s/he violated the EULA or any other CCP-sanctioned terms of service? Or is s/he simply saying something you don't agree with?
The argument that a certain segment of the player base was using was that the only reason people were throwing a tantrum was because it was the Mittani who did it, not because of what he did. If the leader of EVE Uni had been on the CSM and did the exact same thing, it would have never been an issue. The vast majority of the people who were calling for the Mittani to step down/get banned did not give a **** about the player who was mocked and only used it as a political excuse to go after him. Which to me, is every bit as bad as what Mittens did.
Pok Nibin
Doomheim
#23 - 2012-05-19 16:42:21 UTC
Tippia wrote:
Pok Nibin wrote:
Removing a CSM isn't a precedent. Mitt's departure may have been a first…
It wasn't a first. IIRC, he was the third CSM to be kicked out of office.
I sit corrected.

The right to free speech doesn't automatically carry with it the right to be taken seriously.

adam smash
Department of Gub'nent Welfare
Harkonnen Federation
#24 - 2012-05-19 16:42:33 UTC
REMOVE THE WHOLE CSM

Nothing but another place for null asses to get off on.

O hey, 70% of eve is in HS... LETS HAVE A CSM OF NULL YEP, MAKES SENSE LOLOLOL.


Yes caps were needed for this post.
Pok Nibin
Doomheim
#25 - 2012-05-19 16:50:37 UTC  |  Edited by: Pok Nibin
HVAC Repairman wrote:
Andreus Ixiris wrote:
But wasn't the whole CFC argument before that Mittani shouldn't be removed from the CSM, despite violating the EULA?

What has Issler done? Has s/he violated the EULA or any other CCP-sanctioned terms of service? Or is s/he simply saying something you don't agree with?
The argument that a certain segment of the player base was using was that the only reason people were throwing a tantrum was because it was the Mittani who did it, not because of what he did. If the leader of EVE Uni had been on the CSM and did the exact same thing, it would have never been an issue. The vast majority of the people who were calling for the Mittani to step down/get banned did not give a **** about the player who was mocked and only used it as a political excuse to go after him. Which to me, is every bit as bad as what Mittens did.
That's the thing. The leader of EVE Uni would never do such a thing. MOST people wouldn't. You're also overlooking the fact that what was done violated Icelandic law - re: Iceland Media Board. MOST people don't get drunk and engage in unlawful activity (then claim being drunk as an excuse.) That CCP allowed Mitt an open mic without a broadcast delay and a kill switch makes them culpable. Don't minimalize this. It isn't a small thing, and it certainly isn't "just because it was Mitt." Though, the fact that it WAS him is more reason why more caution should have been taken by management.
Never drink with the customers.

Where favoritism shows is allowing Mitt to resign. They needed to give him the boot, but good, to allay any doubts about their capacity to be trusted with broadcasting rights. You can't just broadcast anything you want. You can't broadcast a call to commit a felony. In the U.S., conspiring to commit a misdemeanor IS a felony. Mitt had said beforehand he intended to make such a speech. AND, in the U.S. it is recognized there can be a conspiracy of ONE. (The U.S. becomes relevant as CCP has offices in Stone Mountain, Georgia.) This is really an issue you don't want to be in front of.

The right to free speech doesn't automatically carry with it the right to be taken seriously.

Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#26 - 2012-05-19 16:50:40 UTC  |  Edited by: Tippia
HVAC Repairman wrote:
The argument that a certain segment of the player base was using was that the only reason people were throwing a tantrum was because it was the Mittani who did it, not because of what he did. If the leader of EVE Uni had been on the CSM and did the exact same thing, it would have never been an issue. The vast majority of the people who were calling for the Mittani to step down/get banned did not give a **** about the player who was mocked and only used it as a political excuse to go after him. Which to me, is every bit as bad as what Mittens did.
…as demonstrated by the fact that the “outrage” came, not when he made his controversial statements, but when he was re-elected chairman.
Pok Nibin wrote:
It isn't a small thing, and it certainly isn't "just because it was Mitt."
The timing of the whole thing tells a slightly different story, though…
Skydell
Bad Girl Posse
#27 - 2012-05-19 16:53:37 UTC  |  Edited by: Skydell
Does this mean we don't hate mittens anymore?
Does anyone know if Issler is a real girl? Maybe next year at fanfest we will get to see some bewbs

They blotted that out. Roll
Josef Djugashvilis
#28 - 2012-05-19 16:53:52 UTC
HVAC Repairman wrote:
Andreus Ixiris wrote:
But wasn't the whole CFC argument before that Mittani shouldn't be removed from the CSM, despite violating the EULA?

What has Issler done? Has s/he violated the EULA or any other CCP-sanctioned terms of service? Or is s/he simply saying something you don't agree with?
The argument that a certain segment of the player base was using was that the only reason people were throwing a tantrum was because it was the Mittani who did it, not because of what he did. If the leader of EVE Uni had been on the CSM and did the exact same thing, it would have never been an issue. The vast majority of the people who were calling for the Mittani to step down/get banned did not give a **** about the player who was mocked and only used it as a political excuse to go after him. Which to me, is every bit as bad as what Mittens did.


Partially true I suspect

For those who used it go go after mittens in the political sense, good, mittens would have, quite rightly, done the same if it had been some one else.

Eve is a harsh and brutal game, as mittens now knows to his cost.

This is not a signature.

Alara IonStorm
#29 - 2012-05-19 16:55:16 UTC
Tippia wrote:
…as demonstrated by the fact that the “outrage” came, not when he made his controversial statements, but when he was re-elected chairman.

One thing is followed by the other and therefor is caused by the former.

I wanted some sort of reprimand and never heard about the comment until after. I voted for him before I did.

Some people did it for political reasons (In a video game as silly as it sounds.) but it doesn't change the event.
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#30 - 2012-05-19 16:59:46 UTC
Alara IonStorm wrote:
Some people did it for political reasons (In a video game as silly as it sounds.) but it doesn't change the event.
No, but it makes their outrage and the baying for blood insincere and hollow and belittles the whole deal even further. Calculated cynicism is a nasty (and very contagious) affliction.
Ashina Sito
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#31 - 2012-05-19 17:11:43 UTC
Just Alter wrote:


Issler should be removed too, if anybody was not convinced by these posts/letters alone then they can search these forum, the proof of issler inadequacy to be a part of the csm is clear.



Deal with it, you can quote me on that.
Malcanis
Vanishing Point.
The Initiative.
#32 - 2012-05-19 17:11:57 UTC
adam smash wrote:
REMOVE THE WHOLE CSM

Nothing but another place for null asses to get off on.

O hey, 70% of eve is in HS... LETS HAVE A CSM OF NULL YEP, MAKES SENSE LOLOLOL.


Yes caps were needed for this post.



Really CCP need to look at that rule that stops "HS" voting for "HS" candidates.


Wait no they need to look at the rule that you're allowed to smear your posts over everyone's screens like the feces of a deranged paranoid-schizophrenic.

"Just remember later that I warned against any change to jump ranges or fatigue. You earned whats coming."

Grath Telkin, 11.10.2016

Jame Jarl Retief
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#33 - 2012-05-19 17:14:31 UTC
I think I can safely say 93.64% of EVE's player base doesn't give a flying squirrel, one way or the other, about CSM or its members. Let it be.
Commit Sudoku
Perkone
Caldari State
#34 - 2012-05-19 17:16:10 UTC
maybe organize your high sec gaggle of scrublords into something slightly less ******** and you, too, can fly to ice land to dine and wine with the best (nerds)
Andreus Ixiris
Duty.
WE FORM V0LTA
#35 - 2012-05-19 17:17:13 UTC
HVAC Repairman wrote:
The argument that a certain segment of the player base was using was that the only reason people were throwing a tantrum was because it was the Mittani who did it, not because of what he did. If the leader of EVE Uni had been on the CSM and did the exact same thing, it would have never been an issue. The vast majority of the people who were calling for the Mittani to step down/get banned did not give a **** about the player who was mocked and only used it as a political excuse to go after him. Which to me, is every bit as bad as what Mittens did.


I've seen this argument used a dozen times by Goons and it doesn't fly with me. That's the thing - the leader of the EVE Uni wouldn't have called for people to encourage someone to commit suicide. He didn't call for people to encourage someone to commit suicide - Mittens did. You can get into all these hypotheticals until the sun turns black and it won't make a bit of difference - it was Mittens that did it, and it was Mittens that got punished for it. To be honest, I think he got off incredibly lightly for a man who was essentially implying that a living human being should be encouraged to end their own existence - a 30-day ban and forced resignation from one CSM is an incredibly lenient punishment when I personally know people who've been permabanned for less.

Here's a hypothetical question for you - if the offending person had been a member of Raiden. or NCDot, or a large hi-sec alliance... no, wait! I've got the perfect example. What if it had been Jade Constantine? I don't think there's a single member of Goonswarm who likes Jade Constantine. Jade seems like an excellent person for this hypothetical.

What if it had been Jade Constantine who had done what Mittens did? Would Goons be so quick to leap to Jade Constantine's defense if he'd violated the EULA in such a manner? Would the Goons be clamouring for him to be allowed to stand on the next CSM, or would they be calling for a permaban? Or would they just not care?

Andreus Ixiris > A Civire without a chin is barely a Civire at all.

Pieter Tuulinen > He'd be Civirely disadvantaged, Andreus.

Andreus Ixiris > ...

Andreus Ixiris > This is why we're at war.

Commit Sudoku
Perkone
Caldari State
#36 - 2012-05-19 17:27:17 UTC
people who play eve can hardly be called living human beings
Commit Sudoku
Perkone
Caldari State
#37 - 2012-05-19 17:28:13 UTC
also whats this specist bull crap? why is telling a human to kill themselves suddenly worse than shouting at your cat when they dig deep furrows in your favorite anime real doll?
Commit Sudoku
Perkone
Caldari State
#38 - 2012-05-19 17:28:35 UTC
lina inverse died that day. she died and it was the fault of that stupid cat,,
Andreus Ixiris
Duty.
WE FORM V0LTA
#39 - 2012-05-19 17:30:36 UTC
Herp derp, let's make vaccuous and disjointed derogatory guestures, because that will make our arguments valid.

Andreus Ixiris > A Civire without a chin is barely a Civire at all.

Pieter Tuulinen > He'd be Civirely disadvantaged, Andreus.

Andreus Ixiris > ...

Andreus Ixiris > This is why we're at war.

Nick Bison
Bison Industrial Inc
#40 - 2012-05-19 17:31:21 UTC
Commit Sudoku wrote:
maybe organize your high sec gaggle of scrublords into something slightly less ******** and you, too, can fly to ice land to dine and wine with the best (nerds)


You mean like your candidate this year ... oh wait, sorry

Nothing clever at this time.