EVE Information Portal

So how long is the blanket argument of "cost to the aggressor" going to be a viable one, CCP? It's not the first time you've used it and I doubt it will be the last. The new cost mechanics were a great change to war decs and really brought a lot of balance to the system; a system which now has to deal with yet another shock from poorly planned, out of touch content.
Having seen CCP's involvement in player driven content over the last year alone, it's also hard to imagine that they don't have an general idea of the "masses'" attitude. cough(#burnjita)
But no doubt yesterday's exploit mechanics would be today's hot fix. I also have no doubts the merc community as a whole will stand strong through whatever this "feature" brings.

The fixes are unlimited allies with scaling costs or limited allies where allies can charge for help but there's no minimum cost. Unlimited free allies is a bad bad combination.

Yes! yes and more YES

You declared war and must now accept the risk that you can get blobbed. It is almost hilarious that some think that because they have been abusing the system for years (And calling it the sandbox) they should not have to experience the same blob feel the defenders have had for years.

You brought the war and must experience the risk. The "cost" to the attacker is one of those risks.



Except for the fact that they have stayed docked thus lost opportunity. Wow... Folks who do all this griefing really have no idea what happens to the other side do they?




It is not "poorly planned. out of touch" If anything the out of touch is the amount of griefers whining that finally the defender gets a single advantage in a sea of disadvantage to them.

What you do? Whine on the forums apparently.

Edit: No I don't know much about your group and I don't really care. This change is badly needed for the many who get forced out of EVE by these wardecs.

Maybe it's because a gratuitous griefing mechanic can not be "fixed" in any other way but by removing it.

The entire anti-inferno argument is based on the assumption that corps will Ally for free. Thats not a very good assumption to have, considering greed is what fuels us.

1) Corporations will ask for money as long as they know they can get away with it. Why not be paid?
2) The defender corp would rather hire well known merc corps for a bit of isk, instead of hiring a no-name brand corporation that is offering something for free. In EO nothing is free and the defender would sleep better at night hiring a corp with some worth and a good track record.

Maybe I have missed it, but can a hired Ally attack its defenders freely?

You mean many pages of stupid?

There will be mountains of free help at first. Eventually tho it will balance out when they find they can make some money in the process of getting lots of targets.

some of my ideas after reading some post n blogs ... parts reposted here n revised since it has something to do with ally system ...

what is concord? hisec police of course, player pays to get the concord law out of their war "turf" (dirty cops!).

instead of a CCP curvaceous formula, i base it on the difference in number of pilots and a standard penalty system for oversized blob aggression and war leavers which a lay person CAN easily calculate. base war tax is still 50m isk

10 pilots dec 50 pilots = 40 toon difference. for each toon gap add 100k isk, which makes this dec = 54m per week.

bonuses and penalties ---> oversized corp has a dec penalty on smaller corp based on how many times they are oversized.

players can choose to leave a war by paying a isk penalty to concord.

so corp A 5 toons who decs Corp B 9000 pilots, will have to pay = 50m + (8995*0.1) = 949.5m isk !.

THAT is if the whole alliance is dec-ed. now since CCP has moved to conclude (or seems so to me) that alliance AND corp may receive same fee structure for war costs system, and the same system applies to ANY number of wars. WHY not now make war dec become a corp-corp only system, which is to say, the alliance no longer appears as an entity that is war-decable. so say to war dec the 9000 peeps in goons, the 5 man corp has to apply the war procedure 133 times to ALL the individual corps (makes more sense now doesnt it? 1 corp vs 1 alliance of 133 CORPS) ... and of course they have to pay more (133 corps, base costs will be = 50 x133 = 6.65b ! now that will be a nice isk sink, but then again players may just end up flipping 133 cans costing less than 1m isk hahaha, "WHY PAY FOR WAR when you can just have it right here" --> title of can marker)

say now the same 5 man decs the goon corp, 5 vs 3900 toons. it will cost (50+(3895 * .1)) = 439.5m isk !.

in reverse, 3900 toons dec 5 man toons. it will cost (50+(3895 * .1)) = 439.5m isk ++ a oversized penalty of ((3900/5 toons) = oversized ratio ) multiply by 2m isk = 1560m isk !!

so now an immensely huge corp like that can also do alot of damage to the game play, so in reverse mechanics, the same immensely large corp will destroy the entire game play for tens of thousands of hisec players in no time (i think we all know goons did OTEC-icize the game, with unlimited isk = unlimited wars, i hope CCP did know this). that is why a 3900 deccing a 5 man corp must pay a oversized war ratio tax. anyway, even @ 1999.5m isk per week, goons 1 tec moon generates about 3.2b in 1 week, so its is just peanuts, very likely he can still obliterate hisec with a few constant surgical strikes into hisec.

strategically it is foolish to do that 2b dec on a 5 man corp (unless there is a TEC moon involved), im sure they will hire mercs, but now merc knowing this is the actual cost will of cause ask for suitable compensation. NOW this is where things get interesting, small gang PVP will still thrive under this mechanic, and earn isk! and BIG blob war in hisec will survive and be containable too cos large corp wars will jus be in their own class and scale. this will entail focused pvp/wars and not rampant destruction ! unless CCP intended widespread upheaval

now what happens when wars get into situation of allies?

250 toons vs 150 toons, cost = (0.1X100)+50m = 60m / week. what happens when either side asks for reinforcements? 150 toon gather a corp of 300 toons to join the fray in defense. so now it becomes 250 vs 450, new costs accordingly = (0.1x200)+50m = 70m, however since the defenders are changing this equation, they will have to pay the new total of 70m (new defense entity total) + another 50m base cost, and this refreshes the war new by 7 days. this now updates the defendor entity to retaliator status. in retaliator status, attacker can now ask for allies to help him, same formula, status becomes retaliator as well. at retaliator status any additional addition of allies will now add 60m isk for the 3rd ally onwards. imagine the defender now retaliator 150toons + 300 toons adds 1 more 200 toon ally, costs will now become (400*0.1) +50m , +50m base, +60m 3rd ally = 190m (++5.2m oversized tax)

so what does alliance benefit in all these? adding a ally from within the same alliance reduces the add on costs by 30m. so say if the same above defender corp goes into distress and initiates his allies within alliance, he now pays (400*0.1) +50m , +20m base, +30m 3rd ally = 130m (++5.2m)

for defending side unable to sustain such a war, how should it end? i think CCP did not address this area very clearly for people WHO DO NOT WANT TO PVP. this will lead to players exploiting this particular mentality of the player and grief them in particular (i wonder is CCp hopping to transform eve into a fully PVP game?) , this is not very good, more name calling and more personal griefing attacks.

corp disband within 12hrs = end war (surrender), concord pays back 50% of war tax to initiator. corp cannot disband after 12hrs n must sit it out (too bad). ceo who disbands will create a 14 day cooldown of not able to join corp OR make corps. members cannot join corps for 7days.
single player exit corp, player PAYS concord 25m isk, OR 10% of total war tax which ever is the higher and rounded up to nearest million (OR if he exits within 12 hrs of being decced before war goes live he pays flat 5% of total war tax, so CEO/appt holders cannot leave). toon who exited will not be able to rejoin any corp for 7 days of course.... OR ... just sit your axx out.

any 7 day war will have a mandatory 1 day concord ceasefire, during which ceo decide to prolong wars, disband corp, exit members, nego peace treaty, etc

and of course i think the new war information panels are going to be very useful for very big corps with very impressive combat FC and combat muscles ... that leaves smaller entities to gawk and scurry to 1 desolate corner.

to be continued ...

So we fix "gratuitous griefing mechanics" with more griefing mechanics? We get to taste the blob now (cause if there's one thing Noir. doesn't have to deal with, it's blobs right)?

GG goonswarm alt.

A perfect summary of everything we a) don't want, b) don't do and c) never said anything about.