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Are the Goons killing Eve?
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Vyl Vit

Likes received: 1,217

#141 - 2012-05-18 20:46:22 UTC | Edited by: Vyl Vit

What the Goons have done so far can't be defined as ruining or trashing the game. The burn Jita episode, whether they'll admit this or not, cost them far more than it cost anyone else. The big HOWEVER to that is, cost is relative. If they had the ISK to burn, more power to them (and send some my way. I'll put you on my Christmas card list.)

The question has never been "Does the presence of Goonswarm tilt the game against the greater EVE community?" The question is, "How long is the greater EVE community going to stand by and just whine about the successes of Goonswarm?" The game mechanics more than amply provide the means by which any OTHER "competitive" alliance can topple Goonswarm, or any other alliance that makes its presence heavily felt. It's just that, no one's done it...yet.

Will anyone ever? I like that question better. We could wait and see, of course. Conventional wisdom dictates that's an eventuality. Logic dictates it's something someone(s) has to actually DO. Goonswarm, when you catch them being honest, will be the first to say there are some likely candidates for this role. Do these alliances see toppling Goonswarm as a viable, or productive goal? I for one would be dissatisfied with a leadership that selected goals like that. There'd have to be some greater gain than just poking a popularly hated group in the eye.

No one has made a believeable case that Goonswarm should not be in the game. As far as their infamous scamming goes, I'm put in mind of something Sammy "The Bull" Gravano said about La Cosa Nostra. "Without people wanting something for nothing we wouldn't exist." Or what W.C. Fields said, "Never cheat an honest man. Never give a sucker an even break." Every complaint I've read about a Goon scam has the key feature that the complaintant was after something for nothing.

As far as Goonswarm's talk goes, if you can back it up, say it. If you can make them shut up, do it. Teddy Roosevelt suggested we "talk softly, but carry a big stick." All anyone needs if they're wanting to put Goonswarm in their (real or imagined) "place" is a big enough stick. Till that time comes...as they like to say...deal with it.

Paradise is like where you are right now, only much, much better.

KarmaFleet Goonswarm Federation 286
Malak Dawnfire KarmaFleet Goonswarm Federation Likes received: 286	#142 - 2012-05-18 20:47:28 UTC The short answer is simply : Yes.

Talon SilverHawk

Patria o Muerte

Likes received: 739

#143 - 2012-05-18 21:40:47 UTC | Edited by: Talon SilverHawk

Serge Bastana wrote:

Talon SilverHawk wrote:

Vokanic wrote:

Cys Root wrote:

Haven't read the entire thread but...

3 out 5 of my accounts are inactive because all i use them for is mining ...

I'm not saying goons are killing EVE but they sure are costing it subs...

Spoken like someone who hasn't got a clue. I think there's one goon in the top 10 of hulkageddon altogether.

Only people killing EvE are the people complaining about goons and other large organised entities.

Sorry mate just to correct you but even if there is only one Goon in the top 10. This is a Goon event which they are bank rolling, and I haven't really seen any other large entities being winged about apart from CCP.

I would hope the guy your quoting would also have a clue as to why his own accounts are inactive.

Try harder next time.

Cheers

Tal

Try getting a clue yourself, the Goons aren't 'bankrolling' this event, they have donated prizes as many other have and the publicity for it was coupled with that of Burn Jita. Only those with their head stuck in the sand seem to believe this is a Goon run event.

You really don't do the arguments made here any favours by appearing to be so utterly clueless and whiney.

Actualy numpty I'll retract my retraction. Goons are mostly bank rolling this event. So climb back into your hole troll (see what I did there). I never claimed it was started or led by them , but it is definitely encouraged by them.

If you know others are donating ISK maybe you let us know who they are.

Looking at the tears tab on the above link, I'm not sure what ppl find funny about players leaving Eve, sad really.

Tal

Harbonah

Short Bus Window Licker

Likes received: 73

#144 - 2012-05-18 23:41:19 UTC

Vyl Vit wrote:

Teddy Roosevelt suggested we "talk softly, but carry a big stick." All anyone needs if they're wanting to put Goonswarm in their (real or imagined) "place" is a big enough stick. Till that time comes...as they like to say...deal with it.

The problem so far in Eve has been that all the people wanting to carry a big stick usually end up carrying a limp one about 90% of the time. I have yet to see one forums post calling for the destruction of the Goons result in anything substantial. You can attribute this to general fear of their "mysterious ways" or just substantial indifference on the part of the pvp community who probably already fight them on a daily basis and just are not vocal about it.

Pretty much though at the end of the day there are two universal truths.

1. The Goons are here to stay until they get bored with Eve online.

2. Nobody to date has the leadership ability, coordination, sheer economic power or the figurative cajones to embark on a true extermination mission against the Goons.

Further talk about them, complaining, tears, etc etc is fruitless and simply gives them more emotional turmoil to feed off of. I would say that the Goon's literally subsist on real life tears. I wouldn't be surprised if Mittani has a bath tub full of the tears of new players that keeps him young forever.

knulla

Doomheim

Likes received: 61

#145 - 2012-05-18 23:45:06 UTC | Edited by: knulla

Vyl Vit wrote:

I know who!

[u]Malice Redeemer[/u] - "Post if you are unsubing over the new inventory" Posted: 2012.05.23 01:39

lol

Alavaria Fera

GoonWaffe

Likes received: 6,953

#146 - 2012-05-18 23:48:21 UTC

Harbonah wrote:

I ... I... a limp stick? What is this exactly?

Triggered by: Wars of Sovless Agression, Bending the Knee, Twisting the Knife, Eating Sov Wheaties, Bombless Bombers, Fizzlesov, Interceptor Fleets, Running Away, GhostTime Vuln, Renters, Bombs, Bubbles ?

269
Shian Yang Likes received: 269	#147 - 2012-05-18 23:49:20 UTC Talon SilverHawk wrote: If you know others are donating ISK maybe you let us know who they are. Greetings capsuleer SilverHawk, Reading is hard. This is linked from the Hulkageddon campaign under prizes. Regards, Shian Yang


Harbonah Short Bus Window Licker Likes received: 73	#148 - 2012-05-18 23:49:51 UTC \| Edited by: Harbonah Don't ask me. I'm just a guy that shoots lasers at rocks. I know nothing of sticks. I guess that makes me stickless?..........

RubyPorto

RubysRhymes

Likes received: 5,663

#149 - 2012-05-19 00:15:28 UTC

Talon SilverHawk wrote:

Serge Bastana wrote:

Talon SilverHawk wrote:

Vokanic wrote:

Cys Root wrote:

Haven't read the entire thread but...

3 out 5 of my accounts are inactive because all i use them for is mining ...

I'm not saying goons are killing EVE but they sure are costing it subs...

EvE caters to a very specific type of Player. Those who understand that in a Sandbox, the content comes from people building sandcastles and when two people want to build a sandcastle in the same place, the interaction between the players.

The people who quit because their interaction with another player went poorly for them are not the kind of players that EvE caters to. So we cheer when players stop playing a game that doesn't cater to them and find a game that does, saving them much heartache. We're humanitarians, really.

"It's easy to speak for the silent majority. They rarely object to what you put into their mouths." -Abrazzar "the risk of having your day ruined by other people is the cornerstone with which EVE was built" -CCP Solomon

Istvaan Shogaatsu

Guiding Hand Social Club

Likes received: 940

#150 - 2012-05-19 01:21:05 UTC

Are the Goons killing Eve? CCP should ban them! Are BoB killing Eve? Ban! Are GHSC killing Eve? Ban! Are m0o killing Eve? Ban!

From the earliest days of this game, all of which I have been around to witness, there have been mewling quims like the OP, trying to suggest that the current power du jour is bringing Eve to some fantastic and terrible doomsday. These lowly creatures, without an achievement to their names, hope to turn the tide of public opinion against their chosen anathema and rally CCP devs to mass-ban them.

No matter what happens, you will not get your wish.

Pesky LaRue

Mercatoris

Likes received: 268

#151 - 2012-05-19 01:23:08 UTC

Peter Raptor wrote:

Tippia wrote:

Peter Raptor wrote:

the stats speak for themselves.

Indeed they do. Just look at these stats:

Last days in the work week = statistically have the lowest population online.
Days after one of the most anticipated game releases in the last five years = statistically have the lowest population online.
Spring lull in anticipation of a new patch = statistically lowers the population online.
Hulkageddon = statistically lowers the population a bit in the first couple of days.

…so yeah, the stats speak for themselves and what they're saying is that the goons are a pretty insignificant factor.

Every single one of these things have happened in previous years and the player count has been much higher then, so yeah, stats speak volumes.

Do you have the stats to back that up or, like everything else I've seen from you on this subject, are you just getting your info straight out of your ass?

Machiavellian Space Bastards 28,489
Jonah Gravenstein Machiavellian Space Bastards Likes received: 28,489	#152 - 2012-05-19 01:26:58 UTC 3 +1 for stats being produced anally In the beginning there was nothing, which exploded. New Player FAQ Feyd's Survival Pack

Dawn Flare

Federal Navy Academy

Gallente Federation

Likes received: 49

#153 - 2012-05-19 01:36:44 UTC

Istvaan Shogaatsu wrote:

tbh, BoB was really do quite the good job of destroying eve, with T20 scandals, and elitist attitudes towards even their friends.

Otherwise, yeah, its always someone destroying eve.


Alavaria Fera GoonWaffe Likes received: 6,953	#154 - 2012-05-19 01:39:15 UTC Jonah Gravenstein wrote: +1 for stats being produced anally Ugh, at least clean it up before you bring it into GD. Triggered by: Wars of Sovless Agression, Bending the Knee, Twisting the Knife, Eating Sov Wheaties, Bombless Bombers, Fizzlesov, Interceptor Fleets, Running Away, GhostTime Vuln, Renters, Bombs, Bubbles ?


Jonah Gravenstein Machiavellian Space Bastards Likes received: 28,489	#155 - 2012-05-19 01:42:51 UTC 1 Alavaria Fera wrote: Jonah Gravenstein wrote: +1 for stats being produced anally Ugh, at least clean it up before you bring it into GD. Shhhh I wiped it first. In the beginning there was nothing, which exploded. New Player FAQ Feyd's Survival Pack

Deep Core Mining Inc. Caldari State 1,190
Jame Jarl Retief Deep Core Mining Inc. Caldari State Likes received: 1,190	#156 - 2012-05-19 02:12:48 UTC Implying Implications wrote: It's over. Eve is finished. www.youtube.com/watch?v=JWzzX4lLPnU#t=1m57s That's how I feel about it anyway.


Harbonah Short Bus Window Licker Likes received: 73	#157 - 2012-05-19 02:13:33 UTC I'd just like to point out that somone just blew up my Retriever and it wasn't a Goon. Now I am a Sad Panda and I am going to have to uhh warp back to the station and go get my hulk I guess..... Will someone write a eulogy for my poor Retriever?

Peter Raptor

Galactic Hawks

Likes received: 697

#158 - 2012-05-19 06:36:55 UTC

Harbonah wrote:

I'd just like to point out that somone just blew up my Retriever and it wasn't a Goon. Now I am a Sad Panda and I am going to have to uhh warp back to the station and go get my hulk I guess.....

Will someone write a eulogy for my poor Retriever?

Arent the Goons gonna pay your attacker for killing your ship? You know, 100 mil per ten kills.

Evelopedia;

The Amarr Empire, is known for its omnipresent religion †

Archimedes Eratosthenes

Imperial Academy

Amarr Empire

Likes received: 70

#159 - 2012-05-19 07:25:33 UTC

Francisco Bizzaro wrote:

Peter Raptor wrote:

Shaampoo wrote:

Please don't look at players on-line the week of a 12 years in waiting sequel

But yes if look at the graph of players online things are dropping

but i think that has nothing to do with any nullsec power bloc

http://eve-offline.net/?server=tranquility

Five thousand 300 million isk Hulks dead and all the victims just bounced back happy as ever...........right...

Hulkageddon is the meteor which hit at the end of the cretaceous era. Result: Lots of dead dinosaurs leaving behind a robust, adaptable population of mammals.

But actually I don't think hulkageddon has much to do with anything. We're in a decline after the previous expansion peak, which is not unusual.

Maybe some miners are learning they can't safely run 8 hulks at once, and are cutting back to 4. If they pay with PLEX anyway, that's only an indirect hit on CCP's bottom line and doesn't represent a genuine drop in number of players.

Quote:

again, the stats speak for themselves.

No, they don't actually. Correlation does not imply causation.

Sir, my alt account (Hulk pilot) has been deactivated since the start of Hulkageddon.

However I'm thinking of using this idea from a recent thread about protecting your Hulk with a heavily tanked Arbitrator (t1 cruiser) with two large shield transporters and ECM drones, while assisting your Hulk with mining drones while not being ganked (the Hulk also has 5 ecm drones and no mining drones and fits a high resistance tank)

Sarah Schneider

Native Freshfood

Minmatar Republic

Likes received: 2,837

#160 - 2012-05-19 07:40:47 UTC

Weyuun wrote:

Im a player of Eve for about a year and 1/2 now. Most of my income has come from mining.. nothting fancy, hours of work to earn enough to buy my first hulk.. followed by more hours of work. Im not into PvP, more because my lifestyle cant support the time it takes to hunt cooperatively with a group of others. I have lost 2 hulks now, to dirt cheap (in comparison) PvP ships.

So, afk (or semi-afk) -ing the game while the minerals comes in constitutes as 'work' now? gotcha. People lose ships, all the time. There are many who have lost billions (not just hundreds of mils) worth of pve ships from dirt cheap ships, but it seems that only miners are the one who whines about this, considering Eve is a pvp game.

Weyuun wrote:

I just wanted to say, I don't get it.. I really dont understand what fun or challenge there is, to destroy a mining ship. It seems such a selfish, ego driven, and teenage - rage thing to do. I understand of course, its for the ISK earning... but even so.. it seems so short sighted a way to play.

Year and a half and you still don't get it? huh, i guess that's what mining does to you then. Selfish and ego driven? m8, Eve is a game, a g a m e. Miners do their thing, gankers does their thing, both are fair and valid way to play, if you happen to be the victim of the gank, hey, that's just the way it is, that's just how the game works. Eve, as a game, allows it. Also, no, it's not about the ISK, maybe for some people, or for some cases, but not most of them. It's also kinda weird that you said ganking is a short sighted way to play, what is mining then? all you do is what? go to a belt, turn on the mining lasers, watch tv, haul minerals, back to a belt, turn on mining lasers, read books? what do you call that?

Weyuun wrote:

Seriously.. why would I pay for a game that I can't play for a whole month during the year... because if I try to play in the way I would prefer too.. I will only die, and be worse of than not playing at all? Hulkaggedon is just a big, idiotic and short sighted childhood bully-fest.

Playing the way you prefer doesn't mean others can't play the way they prefer as well. If what you said is what i think you've said, then you're just one selfish introvert person who doesn't want others to enjoy the game as well just because you just want to be left alone, in a multiplayer online game that promotes conflict and player interaction. Also, how is it that dying in a game is worse than not playing?

"I'd rather have other players get shot by other players than not interacting with others" -CCP Soundwave

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KarmaFleet

Goonswarm Federation

Patria o Muerte

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Guiding Hand Social Club

Mercatoris

Machiavellian Space Bastards

Federal Navy Academy

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Caldari State

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Minmatar Republic