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Are the Goons killing Eve?
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baltec1
Bat Country
Pandemic Horde
#121 - 2012-05-18 17:29:25 UTC
Weyuun wrote:
Im a player of Eve for about a year and 1/2 now. Most of my income has come from mining.. nothting fancy, hours of work to earn enough to buy my first hulk.. followed by more hours of work. Im not into PvP, more because my lifestyle cant support the time it takes to hunt cooperatively with a group of others. I have lost 2 hulks now, to dirt cheap (in comparison) PvP ships.

I just wanted to say, I don't get it.. I really dont understand what fun or challenge there is, to destroy a mining ship. It seems such a selfish, ego driven, and teenage - rage thing to do. I understand of course, its for the ISK earning... but even so.. it seems so short sighted a way to play.

Don't the PvPers think that if the kill too many miners.. they themselves will have to go back to mining, to make up for the shortfall?.. Perhaps that's what it is.. control enough of the Market.. and you stand to make more of a profit.

I know that pretty much anything goes, in Eve.. I understand that, I signed up for it.. at least initially... all I can say is that contrary to many PvPers belief's ... as a miner, I cant afford to keep loosing mining ships, so I'm seriously considering quitting Eve.. and I know from all the posts I've been reading.. Im not the only one.

Seriously.. why would I pay for a game that I can't play for a whole month during the year... because if I try to play in the way I would prefer too.. I will only die, and be worse of than not playing at all? Hulkaggedon is just a big, idiotic and short sighted childhood bully-fest.

And a single visit to Hulkageddon V: Unholy Unions web page will reveal them for the silly children they are:

http://hulkageddon5.machine9.net/



You can make a profit from killing untanked fools and space is swarming with untanked fools. The children are the ones who cry about bad things happening to them that they made happen.
Harbonah
Short Bus Window Licker
#122 - 2012-05-18 17:52:45 UTC
I remember a long time ago there was this other PVP game called Darkfall. Players there complained that two alliances called Hyperion Kingdom and of course another alliance lead by Goons were destroying the game with their mega zerg tactics and bullying etc etc.

After a good 6 months of fighting and (though I loath to admit it) superior goon political manuevering, the Hyperion alliance was destroyed and the Goons got bored shortly thereafter and petered out to play other games. The player base of that game dropped from 10,000 or more to less than a few thousand in the span on a few months.

The moral of the story is that people routinely complain about the bad guys that make their life hell in an online game. Unfortunately, PVP based MMO's require bad guys as much as they require good guys. Without them, EVE players would die of boredom and this would be another in a long line of failed MMO's.

Don't get me wrong. I disagree with the Goons as an organization and I especially dislike the tactics that they use to accomplish some of their goals. You can't be assured that your contract with them will result in a payoff or a knife in back. Maybe some of that randomization appeals to others, it's just not for me.

I will however, recognize that Goons for better or worse bring a certain flavor to the game that help keep it alive. The goons provide a realistically mutually hated opponent that gives other players a reason to exist and rally again. They dare to do things that most corporations won't do simply because they push the bounds of what EVE players can do.

If you remove the Goons and people of their kind, EVE will become a more boring and stagnate place where absolutely nothing of interest will happen on a daily basis. Some of their actions and the actions of other famous trouble makers such as the black hand will live in infamy forever and draw players to an otherwise unknown game.
Jonah Gravenstein
Machiavellian Space Bastards
#123 - 2012-05-18 17:59:27 UTC
Harbonah wrote:

If you remove the Goons and people of their kind, EVE will become a more boring and stagnate place where absolutely nothing of interest will happen on a daily basis. Some of their actions and the actions of other famous trouble makers such as the black hand will live in infamy forever and draw players to an otherwise unknown game.


Selectively quoting for truth.

In the beginning there was nothing, which exploded.

New Player FAQ

Feyd's Survival Pack
Cys Root
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#124 - 2012-05-18 18:02:52 UTC

Haven't read the entire thread but...

3 out 5 of my accounts are inactive because all i use them for is mining ...

I'm not saying goons are killing EVE but they sure are costing it subs...
Vokanic
Imperial Shipment
Amarr Empire
#125 - 2012-05-18 18:07:38 UTC
Cys Root wrote:

Haven't read the entire thread but...

3 out 5 of my accounts are inactive because all i use them for is mining ...

I'm not saying goons are killing EVE but they sure are costing it subs...


Spoken like someone who hasn't got a clue. I think there's one goon in the top 10 of hulkageddon altogether.

Only people killing EvE are the people complaining about goons and other large organised entities.
Talon SilverHawk
Patria o Muerte
#126 - 2012-05-18 18:11:17 UTC  |  Edited by: Talon SilverHawk
Vokanic wrote:
Cys Root wrote:

Haven't read the entire thread but...

3 out 5 of my accounts are inactive because all i use them for is mining ...

I'm not saying goons are killing EVE but they sure are costing it subs...


Spoken like someone who hasn't got a clue. I think there's one goon in the top 10 of hulkageddon altogether.

Only people killing EvE are the people complaining about goons and other large organised entities.



Sorry mate just to correct you but even if there is only one Goon in the top 10. This is a Goon event which they are bank rolling, and I haven't really seen any other large entities being winged about apart from CCP.

I would hope the guy your quoting would also have a clue as to why his own accounts are inactive.

Try harder next time.

Cheers

Tal
Kashada Kire
Nigerian Prince Recruitment InitiativeDOT
#127 - 2012-05-18 18:18:51 UTC
wiskyjack wrote:
in general people are giving goon fare to much credit. They didnt break it steel it or kill it, they are just doing what hundreds before them have done.

Manipulate the markets...... Nothing new
Hulkageddon...going for five year's....nothing new
Forming a super blob alliance.......nothing new

What is affecting EVE in general is the overall negative attitude a large percentage of players have. Everyone is pissed off about something. Be it high sec miners hating tankers, low sect hating high sec etc etc etc

So in the work off CCP.... Everything is fine and our logs show nothing.
Because nothing has changed bar the size of the mittanis ego


They've just done it all better and more efficiently than anyone else.
Gosakumori Noh
Coven of One
#128 - 2012-05-18 18:19:47 UTC
Tippia wrote:
Yes, the player counts have also been higher, but not while those things have been happening. The pattern is the same as always, and the only thing the stats say with any volume is that the goons are a pretty insignificant factor.


The drop in these last few days aligns conspicuously well with the release of Diablo III, and probably cannot be pinned on Goons. As for the more gentle drift going on for the last couple of weeks, I would be inclined to pin it on loot nerfs, price shocks, and substantial indifference to Inferno. Here again, blaming/crediting Goons seems a bit of a stretch.
baltec1
Bat Country
Pandemic Horde
#129 - 2012-05-18 18:20:58 UTC
Talon SilverHawk wrote:



Sorry mate just to correct you but even if there is only one Goon in the top 10. This is a Goon event which they are bank rolling, and I haven't really seen any other large entities being winged about apart from CCP.

I would hope the guy your quoting would also have a clue as to why his own accounts are inactive.

Try harder next time.

Cheers

Tal


This in not a goon event it is a helicity event that takes place every year. Goons have simply donated to the prize pool along with many other entities.
Hroya
#130 - 2012-05-18 18:21:36 UTC
Harbonah wrote:
I remember a long time ago there was this other PVP game called Darkfall. Players there complained that two alliances called Hyperion Kingdom and of course another alliance lead by Goons were destroying the game with their mega zerg tactics and bullying etc etc.

After a good 6 months of fighting and (though I loath to admit it) superior goon political manuevering, the Hyperion alliance was destroyed and the Goons got bored shortly thereafter and petered out to play other games. The player base of that game dropped from 10,000 or more to less than a few thousand in the span on a few months.

The moral of the story is that people routinely complain about the bad guys that make their life hell in an online game. Unfortunately, PVP based MMO's require bad guys as much as they require good guys. Without them, EVE players would die of boredom and this would be another in a long line of failed MMO's.

Don't get me wrong. I disagree with the Goons as an organization and I especially dislike the tactics that they use to accomplish some of their goals. You can't be assured that your contract with them will result in a payoff or a knife in back. Maybe some of that randomization appeals to others, it's just not for me.

I will however, recognize that Goons for better or worse bring a certain flavor to the game that help keep it alive. The goons provide a realistically mutually hated opponent that gives other players a reason to exist and rally again. They dare to do things that most corporations won't do simply because they push the bounds of what EVE players can do.

If you remove the Goons and people of their kind, EVE will become a more boring and stagnate place where absolutely nothing of interest will happen on a daily basis. Some of their actions and the actions of other famous trouble makers such as the black hand will live in infamy forever and draw players to an otherwise unknown game.


Yes indeed, Goons and "their kind" add alot of vallue to a game, especially to eve. It is their opponents inabillity to organise into an effective counter.
I wouldnt want Goons and their playstyle to leave eve behind for a long time. I like some off the things they do.
It's just dishearting for the average Joe that they controll so many aspects that ticks people off. Their organisation is impressive in many ways. It's only a matter of time untill things go souer, not just because of Goons themselves i might add.
The success of eve ect depends on organisations like them to strike a ballance between giving and taking in order to keep the ship afloat.

Goons like eve, as far as i can tell. It's rules and leeway in performing dasterly deeds is something you wont find in many games out there. ( well atleast i hope they like eve for that ). If so i would doubt they want to ruin the game itself.

You dont have to like them, infact it's encouraged to hate them. But regardless of your feelings they do deserve respect for the organisation as a whole imo. Case incidents happen everywhere and those are handled seperately.

You go your corridor but.
Serge Bastana
GWA Corp
#131 - 2012-05-18 18:26:24 UTC
Talon SilverHawk wrote:
Vokanic wrote:
Cys Root wrote:

Haven't read the entire thread but...

3 out 5 of my accounts are inactive because all i use them for is mining ...

I'm not saying goons are killing EVE but they sure are costing it subs...


Spoken like someone who hasn't got a clue. I think there's one goon in the top 10 of hulkageddon altogether.

Only people killing EvE are the people complaining about goons and other large organised entities.



Sorry mate just to correct you but even if there is only one Goon in the top 10. This is a Goon event which they are bank rolling, and I haven't really seen any other large entities being winged about apart from CCP.

I would hope the guy your quoting would also have a clue as to why his own accounts are inactive.

Try harder next time.

Cheers

Tal


Try getting a clue yourself, the Goons aren't 'bankrolling' this event, they have donated prizes as many other have and the publicity for it was coupled with that of Burn Jita. Only those with their head stuck in the sand seem to believe this is a Goon run event.

You really don't do the arguments made here any favours by appearing to be so utterly clueless and whiney.

WoW holds your hand until end game, and gives you a cookie whether you win or lose. EVE not only takes your cookie, but laughs at you for bringing one in the first place...

Talon SilverHawk
Patria o Muerte
#132 - 2012-05-18 18:34:41 UTC
Serge Bastana wrote:
Talon SilverHawk wrote:
Vokanic wrote:
Cys Root wrote:

Haven't read the entire thread but...

3 out 5 of my accounts are inactive because all i use them for is mining ...

I'm not saying goons are killing EVE but they sure are costing it subs...


Spoken like someone who hasn't got a clue. I think there's one goon in the top 10 of hulkageddon altogether.

Only people killing EvE are the people complaining about goons and other large organised entities.



Sorry mate just to correct you but even if there is only one Goon in the top 10. This is a Goon event which they are bank rolling, and I haven't really seen any other large entities being winged about apart from CCP.

I would hope the guy your quoting would also have a clue as to why his own accounts are inactive.

Try harder next time.

Cheers

Tal


Try getting a clue yourself, the Goons aren't 'bankrolling' this event, they have donated prizes as many other have and the publicity for it was coupled with that of Burn Jita. Only those with their head stuck in the sand seem to believe this is a Goon run event.

You really don't do the arguments made here any favours by appearing to be so utterly clueless and whiney.



Ok corrected on the Goon front, but you don't do anyone any favours by being such a p*ick about about it.

Tal

Ila Dace
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#133 - 2012-05-18 18:36:55 UTC
Mittens' origin story: http://dilbert.com/strips/comic/2009-05-07/

Explains a few things...

If House played Eve: http://i.imgur.com/y7ShT.jpg

But in purple, I'm stunning!
Mithrantir Ob'lontra
Ixion Defence Systems
#134 - 2012-05-18 18:45:30 UTC
Peter Raptor wrote:
Its worth it in WHs where you can make hundreds of millions per hour mining, in hisec you make a fraction of that, obviously you havent mined in Hisec during Hulkageddon, who would with the lo returns and all that Dscanning lol


I don't really want to ruin your argument, but in 0.0 dscanning is an almost automatic move after a couple of months.
You have to do it, if you want to survive.
During any activity be it pve or pvp (for small and medium gangs) or just traveling.
EvilweaselSA
GoonCorp
Goonswarm Federation
#135 - 2012-05-18 18:48:24 UTC
Talon SilverHawk wrote:

Ok corrected on the Goon front, but you don't do anyone any favours by being such a p*ick about about it.

Tal


he did me a favor by making me giggle at how hard he smacked you down

so i guess that isn't true either
Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe
#136 - 2012-05-18 18:52:35 UTC
Serge Bastana wrote:
Try getting a clue yourself, the Goons aren't 'bankrolling' this event, they have donated prizes as many other have and the publicity for it was coupled with that of Burn Jita. Only those with their head stuck in the sand seem to believe this is a Goon run event.

You really don't do the arguments made here any favours by appearing to be so utterly clueless and whiney.

Yeah and supposedly Helicity is a goon alt What? even though Hulkageddon has been run four times before without any "bankrolling."

Triggered by: Wars of Sovless Agression, Bending the Knee, Twisting the Knife, Eating Sov Wheaties, Bombless Bombers, Fizzlesov, Interceptor Fleets, Running Away, GhostTime Vuln, Renters, Bombs, Bubbles ?
Scatim Helicon
State War Academy
Caldari State
#137 - 2012-05-18 18:56:09 UTC
Alavaria Fera wrote:
Serge Bastana wrote:
Try getting a clue yourself, the Goons aren't 'bankrolling' this event, they have donated prizes as many other have and the publicity for it was coupled with that of Burn Jita. Only those with their head stuck in the sand seem to believe this is a Goon run event.

You really don't do the arguments made here any favours by appearing to be so utterly clueless and whiney.

Yeah and supposedly Helicity is a goon alt What? even though Hulkageddon has been run four times before without any "bankrolling."


Everyone is a goon alt if they do, say, or think something that someone disagrees with.

Every time you post a WiS thread, Hilmar strangles a kitten.
Serge Bastana
GWA Corp
#138 - 2012-05-18 18:56:47 UTC
EvilweaselSA wrote:
Talon SilverHawk wrote:

Ok corrected on the Goon front, but you don't do anyone any favours by being such a p*ick about about it.

Tal


he did me a favor by making me giggle at how hard he smacked you down

so i guess that isn't true either


I am becoming more and more frustrated with some people in high sec at times, I'm usually fairly reasonable but at times I just get fed up with the blinkered attitudes you encounter from some certain elements. I do a fair amount of stuff in high sec helping new players in my corp but I'm beginning to want to distance myself from it more and more these days.

WoW holds your hand until end game, and gives you a cookie whether you win or lose. EVE not only takes your cookie, but laughs at you for bringing one in the first place...

Talon SilverHawk
Patria o Muerte
#139 - 2012-05-18 19:15:42 UTC
EvilweaselSA wrote:
Talon SilverHawk wrote:

Ok corrected on the Goon front, but you don't do anyone any favours by being such a p*ick about about it.

Tal


he did me a favor by making me giggle at how hard he smacked you down

so i guess that isn't true either



But he didn't ?
No More Heroes
Boomer Humor
Snuffed Out
#140 - 2012-05-18 20:14:17 UTC
I'm stuck on a 6 day business trip right now with terrible wifi otherwise I'd be logged in. I don't think miners make the world go round. And anyone who quite Eve because they got a ship blown up doesn't 'get' this game anyways.

.