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Orbit woes
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Corporate Envoy
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#1 - 2012-05-16 23:21:55 UTC
I can't seem to make sense of the orbit function.

I set the distance to, say, 2800m. Then when I press the orbit button, the ship happily orbits at 3000m. I then set the orbit range to 2600m, the ship now orbits at 2800 and at full speed too. So the problem is not that the orbit is too tight. I have never seen anyone complain about this, am I the only one with this problem?

Another piggy: If I do anything at all to the speed while orbiting, like turning on a propulsion module or changing the speed manually, my ship decides to change its direction as well. This is fairly catastrophic as it causes my angular velocity to drop to nothing mid turn. I don't like that.

Could anybody be so kind as to tell me what I am doing wrong?
Abyssum Invocat
Yet Another Tax Haven
#2 - 2012-05-16 23:31:22 UTC
Your ship tries to orbit it at the distance you dictate but inertia can pull you farther out, the more agile your ship is and the wider the orbit is the closer it will be to the number you picked. The speed of your target will also change your orbit distance because your ship is constantly changing course to keep orbit.
Immortis Vexx
Onyx Moon Industries
#3 - 2012-05-16 23:31:33 UTC
Corporate Envoy wrote:
I can't seem to make sense of the orbit function.

I set the distance to, say, 2800m. Then when I press the orbit button, the ship happily orbits at 3000m. I then set the orbit range to 2600m, the ship now orbits at 2800 and at full speed too. So the problem is not that the orbit is too tight. I have never seen anyone complain about this, am I the only one with this problem?

Another piggy: If I do anything at all to the speed while orbiting, like turning on a propulsion module or changing the speed manually, my ship decides to change its direction as well. This is fairly catastrophic as it causes my angular velocity to drop to nothing mid turn. I don't like that.

Could anybody be so kind as to tell me what I am doing wrong?


What ship are you piloting? The ships can only turn so quickly without dropping speed so two things are going to happen:
A) You will drop speed to make the turn sharper
B) you will go outside the radius you set by a slight amount

The best way to avoid B (As you cannot avoid A), is to set the radius a bit smaller than you would like. If you want to orbit at 2500, set it at 2200. If you want to orbit at max speed you will need to find the balance between how fast your ship can turn.

Vexx
bongsmoke
Visine Red
420 Chronicles of EvE
#4 - 2012-05-16 23:34:50 UTC
Abyssum Invocat wrote:
Your ship tries to orbit it at the distance you dictate but inertia can pull you farther out, the more agile your ship is and the wider the orbit is the closer it will be to the number you picked. The speed of your target will also change your orbit distance because your ship is constantly changing course to keep orbit.



This


say your in a frigate and you want 3k distance with blasters, but your orbit is 3800 to 4000m, try lowering your orbit to 2700m and experiment.

Each ship in this regard is different, please keep that in mind.
Corporate Envoy
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#5 - 2012-05-16 23:40:20 UTC  |  Edited by: Corporate Envoy
Thank you all.

The orbit range thing is not that big of a problem, it is just strange that it would be disobedient when I could tighten the orbit and still maintain full speed.

The direction change is really bugging me though, any ideas as how to avoid this?

I'm doing this in a cruiser by the way, orbiting a stationary drone.
bongsmoke
Visine Red
420 Chronicles of EvE
#6 - 2012-05-16 23:42:40 UTC
Corporate Envoy wrote:
Thank you all.

The orbit range thing is not that big of a problem, it is just strange that it would be disobedient whe nI could tighten the orbit and still maintain full speed.

The direction change is really bugging me though, any ideas as how to avoid this?


I am sorry, what are you referring to with direction change? how your ship orbits, either on a flat plain and over and under what your orbiting?
Corporate Envoy
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#7 - 2012-05-16 23:47:13 UTC
bongsmoke wrote:
Corporate Envoy wrote:
Thank you all.

The orbit range thing is not that big of a problem, it is just strange that it would be disobedient whe nI could tighten the orbit and still maintain full speed.

The direction change is really bugging me though, any ideas as how to avoid this?


I am sorry, what are you referring to with direction change? how your ship orbits, either on a flat plain and over and under what your orbiting?


For example, I'm going clockwise and I decide to drop the speed a bit by pressing on the 'speed bar'. Now my ship almost comes to a stop and starts to go counter clockwise.
Immortis Vexx
Onyx Moon Industries
#8 - 2012-05-16 23:50:13 UTC
Corporate Envoy wrote:
bongsmoke wrote:
Corporate Envoy wrote:
Thank you all.

The orbit range thing is not that big of a problem, it is just strange that it would be disobedient whe nI could tighten the orbit and still maintain full speed.

The direction change is really bugging me though, any ideas as how to avoid this?


I am sorry, what are you referring to with direction change? how your ship orbits, either on a flat plain and over and under what your orbiting?


For example, I'm going clockwise and I decide to drop the speed a bit by pressing on the 'speed bar'. Now my ship almost comes to a stop and starts to go counter clockwise.


I've never seen this behavior before. I am not at my desk right now but I will test it when I get home.

Vexx
Corporate Envoy
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#9 - 2012-05-16 23:54:10 UTC
Thanks, it is driving me absolutely potty.

It is not always as drastic as clockwise -> counterclockwise, but tinkering with the speed will not fail the change the orientation of the orbiting plane. If that makes sense.
Abyssum Invocat
Yet Another Tax Haven
#10 - 2012-05-17 00:20:56 UTC
Corporate Envoy wrote:
bongsmoke wrote:
Corporate Envoy wrote:
Thank you all.

The orbit range thing is not that big of a problem, it is just strange that it would be disobedient whe nI could tighten the orbit and still maintain full speed.

The direction change is really bugging me though, any ideas as how to avoid this?


I am sorry, what are you referring to with direction change? how your ship orbits, either on a flat plain and over and under what your orbiting?


For example, I'm going clockwise and I decide to drop the speed a bit by pressing on the 'speed bar'. Now my ship almost comes to a stop and starts to go counter clockwise.

This happens fairly frequently to me.
Dradius Calvantia
Lip Shords
#11 - 2012-05-17 03:55:09 UTC
"Orbit"

This is clearly in regards to PVE activities which have their own forum subsection...
IbanezLaney
The Church of Awesome
#12 - 2012-05-17 04:18:33 UTC
Immortis Vexx wrote:
Corporate Envoy wrote:
bongsmoke wrote:
Corporate Envoy wrote:
Thank you all.

The orbit range thing is not that big of a problem, it is just strange that it would be disobedient whe nI could tighten the orbit and still maintain full speed.

The direction change is really bugging me though, any ideas as how to avoid this?


I am sorry, what are you referring to with direction change? how your ship orbits, either on a flat plain and over and under what your orbiting?


For example, I'm going clockwise and I decide to drop the speed a bit by pressing on the 'speed bar'. Now my ship almost comes to a stop and starts to go counter clockwise.


I've never seen this behavior before. I am not at my desk right now but I will test it when I get home.

Vexx


I'd guess it is because you are not yet at the orbit distance you have selected when you click to slow down - the ship then takes the quickest route to that orbit distance which results in turning toward or away from the target (dependent on if you are under or over your selected orbit distance). It's no big deal as long as you time the turn for in between any arty volleys - they really hurt if they fire at you during the turn.

https://soundcloud.com/ibanezlaney
Gerrick Palivorn
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#13 - 2012-05-17 05:25:21 UTC
The problem of the ship changing directions is because (I don't have any proof, this is an assumption, but it makes sense to me) the coding of the orbital path is reset when your speed input is changed. So if you decide to turn on or off your AB/MWD or manually change your speed the ships orbit command will reset and pick a new vector to orbit the enemy almost always resulting in a turn around.

The above post also makes sense to me.

What the real answer is IDK

As for the solution, orbiting manually by constantly turning and double clicking in space will solve this issue, but it does require a little bit of skill.

MMOs come and go, but Eve remains.  -Garresh-
Corporate Envoy
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#14 - 2012-05-17 10:07:38 UTC
Dradius Calvantia wrote:
"Orbit"

This is clearly in regards to PVE activities which have their own forum subsection...


"Sarcasm"

You are such a badass internet pilot and a looker to boot. I wish I was you.






Gerrick Palivorn wrote:
The problem of the ship changing directions is because (I don't have any proof, this is an assumption, but it makes sense to me) the coding of the orbital path is reset when your speed input is changed. So if you decide to turn on or off your AB/MWD or manually change your speed the ships orbit command will reset and pick a new vector to orbit the enemy almost always resulting in a turn around.

The above post also makes sense to me.

What the real answer is IDK

As for the solution, orbiting manually by constantly turning and double clicking in space will solve this issue, but it does require a little bit of skill.


Makes sense to me too, sounds like I'll just have to live with it. I'll have a go at the manual orbiting, it's just a bit difficult to keep angular up when the other guy is trying to burn away from me as fast as he can.
Mekhana
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#15 - 2012-05-17 10:14:56 UTC
When you get really familiar with your ship you'll know the right number to use.

Also when orbiting a target, let's say for tackle, you'll want to do it manually. There's also the fact there's some very good players that know how to predict your auto orbit and really ruin your day.

Vide longe er eros di Luminaire VII, uni canse pra krage e determiniex! Sange por Sange! Descanse bravex eros, mie freires. Mortir por vostre Liberete, farmilie, ide e amis. lons Proviste sen mort! Luminaire liber mas! 
Suzu Fujibayashi
Happy Dudes
#16 - 2012-05-17 11:06:51 UTC
The orbit command has a really bad algorithm, imo. For example:
I set my orbit at 2000m and the ships orbits at 2200m.
Now I use the "orbit at current distance" (at 2200m) command and the orbit gets bigger even though I was already orbiting at the desired range.
I guess it's hard to tell if you are orbiting and how the orbit looks like. (At least without adding lots of server strain)

I think in general orbit is good to keep some range while still keeping your speed up. To use it to maximize transversal it's very unreliable.

P.S.: Mekhana, you are my double?
Nicklaus Klaus'nik
Federal Defense Union
Gallente Federation
#17 - 2012-05-17 13:48:22 UTC
what i wanna know is, what happened to each ship "remembering" orbit/keep at range distances?
DirtyDozen
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#18 - 2012-05-17 13:52:12 UTC
Orbiting sucks btw, unless in a close range frig. It will get you killed against an experienced pvper. Learn to manual pilot and stay in range.
Metal Icarus
Star Frontiers
Brotherhood of Spacers
#19 - 2012-05-17 14:41:53 UTC
Consider the orbit as a minimum orbit. Your speed, inertia and agility factor in on your final orbit. want to orbit at your selected distance? Slowdown.
bongsmoke
Visine Red
420 Chronicles of EvE
#20 - 2012-05-17 14:46:31 UTC
Corporate Envoy wrote:
bongsmoke wrote:
Corporate Envoy wrote:
Thank you all.

The orbit range thing is not that big of a problem, it is just strange that it would be disobedient whe nI could tighten the orbit and still maintain full speed.

The direction change is really bugging me though, any ideas as how to avoid this?


I am sorry, what are you referring to with direction change? how your ship orbits, either on a flat plain and over and under what your orbiting?


For example, I'm going clockwise and I decide to drop the speed a bit by pressing on the 'speed bar'. Now my ship almost comes to a stop and starts to go counter clockwise.



Yep i know what you mean exactly. Usually orbit something, get webbed, and since you slow down, the orbiting turns you around and goes backwards circling. CCP either isn't aware, or they will fix it within 6 or 7 years, like its taken them for most everything else to implement.
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