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T2 torp let the rage Start.
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Sidus Isaacs
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#41 - 2012-05-16 11:42:29 UTC
Ares Tride wrote:
Your grasp of written English is supreme.


Oh no! Someone on the forums for a game with players from all over the world is not 100% proficient in English! RAGE!

Get over yourself, you just seem pathetic.
Alara IonStorm
#42 - 2012-05-16 11:51:04 UTC
Sidus Isaacs wrote:
Ares Tride wrote:
Your grasp of written English is supreme.


Oh no! Someone on the forums for a game with players from all over the world is not 100% proficient in English! RAGE!

Get over yourself, you just seem pathetic.

Seem?
Lin-Young Borovskova
Doomheim
#43 - 2012-05-16 11:57:17 UTC
stoicfaux wrote:
nat longshot wrote:

in testing a t2 launcher fit fleet typhoon with TP fireing on a Fleet Tempest just sitting there the t2s do about 25% to 30% less dmg then the faction torps. WTH ya that right 25% to 30% less dmg then faction though to use the t2 take more time to learn.


Fleet Tempest sig: 340m
TP: 30% increase to sig
T2 Rage Explosion Radius: 650m.

(340 * 1.3) / 650 = 68.0% max damage.

CN Torp: with 450m Explosion Radius
(340 * 1.3) / 450 = 98.2% max damage

Use more than one TP and/or a ship with a TP bonus. Otherwise, leave the Rage torps at home unless you're shooting at structures.

Eve missile damage formulas: http://community.eveonline.com/ingameboard.asp?a=topic&threadID=901280




This

Missiles are about to get some changes (soon) so we could expect some reasonable numbers coming out.

PS: Speed tested new launchers/missiles on SISI, if I haven't looked at numbers missile graphics are just awesome. However my Tengu heavy missile launchers make my ship awful ...

brb
Bouh Revetoile
In Wreck we thrust
#44 - 2012-05-16 12:45:18 UTC
Tier 3 BS have a huge signature (460m for Maelstrom for example) : mean that a standard or navy torp will hit for full damage (not accounting for speed).
Rage torpedoes have 10% more damage than navy ones but 30% more explosion radius and 15% less range.

With one TP on this Maelstrom, you do 90% of your damages with rage torpedoes ; that is without considering shield tank.

Other T2 high damage ammo have 10% more damage than navy mightest ammo with 30% tracking malus + 50% range malus.

Torpedoes have a range comparable to blasters, but with no falloff. They also have damage output comparable to blasters, but with more alpha.

As a missile, torpedo don't care about transversal velocity, which is something huge at very close range ; tradeoff is sig caped damages. Infact, torpedoes seem to suffer the exact same problem blasters suffered because of scramblers shuting down MWD. Hence, torpedoes would deserve a slight explosion radius buff and the removal of T2 ammo ship penalty.

NB : please, don't use minmatar ships to prove something related to speed or signature radius : the problem would be minmatar ship more than anything else ; most minmatar ship have blessed speed and signature.
Ager Agemo
Rainbow Ponies Incorporated
#45 - 2012-05-16 13:00:27 UTC  |  Edited by: Ager Agemo
missiles have it worse than turrets, they are not affected by transversal speed, true, instead they are affected by absolutely any speed, and so it happens even with max missile explosion speed skills, torps get an explosion speed of just 91ms, even the slowest of the slowest battleships, will kite about 15% damage just from moving.

on the case of rage torpedos, its completely broken once you add the 650 m radius. you get a reduction of about 60% just from moving, god forgive if the target is using an afterburner, your damage will get reduced by as much as 70% without counting resistances yet.


also!


Turrets do 100% damage on stationary targets regardless of size.
while a torpedo will hit a small ship for less than 10% its damage just from the signature.

having both all the turret and missile skills, I can say with good base, that missiles are underpowered in general, and the only reason they work sometimes, is because they are put on awesome ships like tengus.
Zyress
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#46 - 2012-05-16 14:29:38 UTC  |  Edited by: Zyress
Gabriel Karade wrote:
stoicfaux wrote:
Gabriel Karade wrote:
stoicfaux wrote:

Eve missile damage formulas: http://community.eveonline.com/ingameboard.asp?a=topic&threadID=901280

I’m of the opinion that, the formula in the link should only be based on the second set of functions.
I.e. the missile parameters (explosion velocity divided by explosion radius) which are a constant, multiplied by the target Sig/velocity term. In which case, as a target's velocity ---> 0, it’s always going to become a big number, such that the overall damage multiplier gets capped at 1…

From what I've seen, the second formula is already the main limiter of missile damage. The first formula is just there to make sure that large missiles don't do full damage against webbed/stationary frigates. Meaning, what you're asking for is already in place in practice.

Well that is where I was coming from - I don't see the problem of a large missile doing full damage to a stationary target, the Sig/velocity term amply compensates for moving targets and if the first formula were removed it would be one less thing for the server to check.

Just an opinion - I'm hardly what would be considered a 'missile fiend' , perhaps more of a 'recreational user' :]



This isn't unreasonable when you consider the explosion radius isn't instantly at its maximum size but starts small and expands. A direct hit should reasonably do full damage. Actually the explosion radius should be a benefit making a near miss do some damage instead of missing altogether. Maybe they could work it into a positive when Tracking Disruptors start making Missiles miss. Explosion velocity should be pretty close to light speed, it is energy after all. With the possible exception of Kinetic, that may be matter.
Selinate
#47 - 2012-05-16 14:34:55 UTC
Alara IonStorm wrote:
stoicfaux wrote:

Pffffffff! Way to slant the numbers!

Torpedoes buck the curve by trading range for raw DPS.

And no one really uses either in PvP.

Not counting Bombers which have massive Torp bonuses.
stoicfaux wrote:

By that logic, HAMs are also useless. You should use cruise missiles instead:

I think we have proven that neither is the correct answer to this equation.


Amarr missile boats are used typically in PvP. Fitting a HAM legion frees up a ton of powergrid making it possible to make it very good in PvP.
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