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you should never be at all safe anywhere
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Abel Merkabah
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#61 - 2012-05-07 03:22:39 UTC
Ranka Mei wrote:
Why is everyone so adamantly opposed to having places of relative safety? Because you fear everyone will go carebear in highsec if you make things too easy, right?

But think about that for a moment, as it also means.... you admit that a large section of the EVE population wants to carebear, given the chance (yes, let that reality sink in for a moment). Moreover, your loud protestations are nothing more than mere manifestations of your fear that people will do so, en masse. And that, manfriend, is why carebearing should always be allowed: because of your self-proclaimed confirmation of the need for it.


I may be wrong, because I am so new, but here is my reason why it is a concern with Eve...

Every aspect of Eve is PvP (excluding possibily mission runners). That means that every action is in competition with the other players. That is why carebears are a problem, they want safety to try to compete without risk; while the null/low sec crowd take risk to compete. Essentially, that is unfair to the null/low sec players. The counters to this are:

1. Null/low sec offer higher rewards for the risk invovled.

2. High sec is still on the table for ganking/forcing losses on other players, but with consequences. Essentially, this adds some risk to carebears.

See in theory it works out. In actuality, it seems like High sec carebears do get the pointy end of the stick though, because null sec alliances seem to have the money making down, and from what I've read, it is safer to be in nullsec (if you are part of the alliance) then in high sec...lol...but the best part, this is not a problem with the mechanics, it is the result of the nullsec players creating that environment for themselves, and the carebears not being ambitious enough to do something about it.

James315 for CSM 8!
Antisocial Malkavian
Antisocial Malkavians
#62 - 2012-05-07 04:04:01 UTC  |  Edited by: Antisocial Malkavian
Eian wrote:
Antisocial Malkavian wrote:
Simi Kusoni wrote:
Andski wrote:
I think what they're implying is that an average player should be relatively safe in hisec.

That average player is most certainly not somebody flying a pimp-fit mission boat, a loaded hauler, or a particular high-end mining vessel. Or completely inattentive to what's going on in the game.

I'm assuming (well, hoping) they also mean the average player should be safe as long as they aren't AFK.


Me too cause ACTUALLY making it safer would be me deciding whether I wanna stay in an increasingly carebear friendly game or say **** it and join goons to punish them


If you want to get some, go out side and tear it up son! Oh wait, you're a carebear in RL so EVE is the only place you're got left to live out your fantasy of being on the other end.

/sadface4u



Yeah... RL = EVE amiright?

******* idiot

You should need an IQ higher than mayonaise to poast


Ranka Mei wrote:
Why is everyone so adamantly opposed to having places of relative safety? Because you fear everyone will go carebear in highsec if you make things too easy, right?

But think about that for a moment, as it also means.... you admit that a large section of the EVE population wants to carebear, given the chance (yes, let that reality sink in for a moment). Moreover, your loud protestations are nothing more than mere manifestations of your fear that people will do so, en masse. And that, manfriend, is why carebearing should always be allowed: because of your self-proclaimed confirmation of the need for it.


That CANT be true cause if it was that would mea more ppl DONT wanna PVP than do

And, isn't sanity really just a one-trick pony anyway? I mean all you get is one trick, rational thinking, but when you're good and crazy, oooh, oooh, oooh, the sky is the limit.

Herping yourDerp
Tribal Liberation Force
Minmatar Republic
#63 - 2012-05-07 04:27:31 UTC
No, you should always be 100% safe in stations.
Krixtal Icefluxor
INLAND EMPIRE Galactic
#64 - 2012-05-07 12:14:17 UTC
Herping yourDerp wrote:
No, you should always be 100% safe in stations.


They do always forget that one, huh ?

"He has mounted his hind-legs, and blown crass vapidities through the bowel of his neck."  - Ambrose Bierce on Oscar Wilde's Lecture in San Francisco 1882
Herzog Wolfhammer
Sigma Special Tactics Group
#65 - 2012-05-07 14:48:27 UTC
Well tanked ships are pretty safe in high sec. Non-tanking mining ships are not.

But hey even birth control is not entirely effective yet people still have sex.


Bring back DEEEEP Space!
Krixtal Icefluxor
INLAND EMPIRE Galactic
#66 - 2012-05-07 15:13:12 UTC
Herzog Wolfhammer wrote:
Well tanked ships are pretty safe in high sec. Non-tanking mining ships are not.

But hey even birth control is not entirely effective yet people still have sex.





There is a wicked joke lurking here, but it's hurting my head to work through the necessary logic involved......

"He has mounted his hind-legs, and blown crass vapidities through the bowel of his neck."  - Ambrose Bierce on Oscar Wilde's Lecture in San Francisco 1882
Henry Haphorn
Killer Yankee
#67 - 2012-05-07 15:21:02 UTC
CCP meant relatively safe as in "not 100% safe".

Adapt or Die
John Ratcliffe
Tradors'R'us
IChooseYou Alliance
#68 - 2012-05-07 15:21:45 UTC  |  Edited by: John Ratcliffe
The following is from the perspective of a new Eve player. I haven't been playing long, probably 3-4 months on and off. My previous MMO experience is Dark Age of Camelot (11 years).

Personally, I think it's ******** you can be attacked by your own side. As a new player, it really doesn't appeal to me to spend a fortune fitting a ship out only to lose it to some tools camping Jita or a gate when I am going to mission.

I'd much rather you simply couldn't attack anyone unless they were from an opposing Realm. So no-one from Caldari can attack anyone else from Caldari. If you want PVP then go to specific places to fight players from opposing Realms.

PVP should be something you elect to do, not have it forced upon you by people just looking to be idiots.

I post this with the full acceptance that I'll be flamed stupid, but it's probably the thing I like least about Eve.

Plus ça change, plus c'est la même chose
Aqriue
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#69 - 2012-05-07 15:38:47 UTC
Pro-tip: Highsec could have 1.0 CONCORD response time in all highsec systems and the hulk could be buffed to fit 50k hitpoints while still putting in two MLU + 12km3 ore cargo bay only (1000m3 normal bay for crystals). Basicly enough tank to require a tier 3 battleship to crack.

What happens?

It can still die. There is no actual off flag to PVP, but this version of the hulk didn't go pop.

Why?

Because you don't repercussions to your actions, you don't open fire.

What is this?

Oh right...you want to kill without repercussions but needing 250 million isk ship to bust a hulk without insurance...lets not forget that sec status is a joke as an inconvience and its way more grindy to replace a hulk....why are you not willing to open fire but belive the hulk pilot should grind to replace his ship back? And no a covetor is just as bad as hulk...its a frigging glass cannon for asteroid busting since it cannot fit a tank at all!

Ah right...you are risk adverse because that 250m battleship is not isk that you can easily replace. You are a ******* Humanbear no different then the guy who spends more time in highsec, doesn't matter if you are pulling the trigger. Highsec isn't PVP off as everyone is so quick to proclaim its that safe, its PVP with consequences without a wardec or can flipping. You are just not willing to lose something more then a destroyer...scareybear..even if the guy sits in an NPC corp because he knows it prevents wardecs (like making BM around null gates...scouting gates to avoid dragging your freighter into a lowsec camp...its using game provided advantages with his mind and brain!!! like you) but he takes a cut to bounties as a repercussion as well he is unable to make what a level 5 in lowsec or a miner who cannot get nullsec ore.

Highsec is the worst space to make money with the least amount of risk to themselves, end of story.
Dradius Calvantia
Lip Shords
#70 - 2012-05-07 15:43:10 UTC
Krixtal Icefluxor wrote:
Andski wrote:
or a particular high-end mining vessel. Or completely inattentive to what's going on in the game.



STOP calling something with the structure of a paper bag 'High End". Jesus.

The Rorqual.....now THAT's high end.


What are you talking about... The Roqual is a combat vessel.

http://www.rotekapelle.com/killboard/?a=kill_detail&kll_id=67983

Look at those deeps.
Gawain Edmond
Khanid Bureau of Industry
#71 - 2012-05-07 15:51:22 UTC
wow you're all moaning about how "safe" high sec is what about 0.0? with cyno jammers and jump bridges 0.0 is safer than hi sec

get rid of local, jump bridges and cyno jammers and 0.0 will be risky again till then stop crying and sort out your own house till you come cryin about mine
Welsige
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#72 - 2012-05-07 16:44:54 UTC
John Ratcliffe wrote:
The following is from the perspective of a new Eve player. I haven't been playing long, probably 3-4 months on and off. My previous MMO experience is Dark Age of Camelot (11 years).

Personally, I think it's ******** you can be attacked by your own side. As a new player, it really doesn't appeal to me to spend a fortune fitting a ship out only to lose it to some tools camping Jita or a gate when I am going to mission.

I'd much rather you simply couldn't attack anyone unless they were from an opposing Realm. So no-one from Caldari can attack anyone else from Caldari. If you want PVP then go to specific places to fight players from opposing Realms.

PVP should be something you elect to do, not have it forced upon you by people just looking to be idiots.

I post this with the full acceptance that I'll be flamed stupid, but it's probably the thing I like least about Eve.



This is not the game you are looking for.

[b]~ 10.058 ~

Free The Mittani[/b]
Brother chookta
One Horse Trading
#73 - 2012-05-07 17:00:18 UTC
The sec system in this game is based on the one used in Elite. In that game the safest area was "democracy" even there you could be jumped by pirates if you were more than 12 KM from station ( range of police ships). As the sec went down to anarchy systems so risk went up. THIS is the system eve was conceived on and I wish people would stop going on about what they think it should be. I've been playing a long time and it's worked up til' now, so leave it alone. NOTE the slide said RELATIVELY SAFE, this is how the game was intended from the beginning - leave it alone.