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Well played Null Sec Zealots
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Mark Androcius
#41 - 2012-04-26 17:45:10 UTC
Xython wrote:
Mark Androcius wrote:
Nicolo da'Vicenza wrote:
Vince Snetterton wrote:

You null sec nutbars really can't see the forest for the trees. You will wipe out the subscription base

Every expansion that has expanded warfare and combat mechanics and ships has responded in an upswing in new subs (Dominion, Apocrypha, Crucible, etc). Every expansion centered around risk-free hisec isk and commodity faucets (Tyrannis, Incursion, etc) has resulted in a significant drop in EVE's player growth.

The most steadfast and loyal EVE players have stuck around because they play to be challenged and overcome genuine, emergent obstacles to their goals - not to tour a theme park with blinking wallets. HTH


+10

Although i must say that, it would kinda suck very hard, seeing as I spent countless hours farming standing and training my science skills, so i could get the best deals on datacores.
If they turn out to be worth nothing in a couple of months, i would kinda feel screwed.


I must have missed this thing about Datacores, what all is going on with them? The problem I see with the current system is that people are using it as a passive isk generator (make an alt account, 3x datacore and pi alts, ta-da, pays for that account and your main) instead of it's intended purpose.


This is probably the best solution to that specific problem, but sadly, i don't think CCP is willing to do such a thing.

https://androcius.wordpress.com
Akrasjel Lanate
Immemorial Coalescence Administration
Immemorial Coalescence
#42 - 2012-04-26 17:45:58 UTC
Please stop posting with alts SadCry

CEO of Lanate Industries

Citizen of Solitude
Tinnin Sylph
Perkone
Caldari State
#43 - 2012-04-26 17:46:19 UTC
Mark Androcius wrote:

I'm gonna give you that point here, I'm sorry community, but i must.

However, the reason a lot of people don't leave the comfort of high sec, is because they don't want to be part of any of the established alliances or corporations and without that, you can't really do anything in null.

The idea of a sandbox, is that you can do your own thing, not to say: well here's 3 large alliances, go join the one you hate the least and have fun.

So once again, credit for what you said there, but try to keep what i just said in mind, cause it's most likely not that far from the truth.


So your options are stay in High Sec and enjoy the lack of politics/risk and settle for a lower income, or join/found a 0.0 corp and enjoy the higher profits that go along with the increased effort involved for you and your corp mates. Sandbox, yay!

This really is working as intended.

Heh.
Vaerah Vahrokha
Vahrokh Consulting
#44 - 2012-04-26 17:50:05 UTC
Xython wrote:
So... free isk and outrageous market inflation is a good thing?

Huh. Learn something new everyday.

Myself, I hope they nerf L4 Missions a bit next update, they're a bit out of line too. What's this about Datacore Mining being nerfed?



I'd say that the modules drop nerf is quite of a nerf. In the last years, from 500k-1M mods on BS and some hundreds on BCs etc now the drops got replaced by 1 metal scrap. I don't know if they also implemented the bounties nerf already, but that will be another thing that stacks.

You have to keep something in hi sec that can be done by returning old players to help them get back on track. Else it ends like in other MMOs, where you get back after 2-3 years and are boned because you are so behind it's pointless to catch up.

EvE Online portal | EvE markets tutorials
Vince Snetterton
#45 - 2012-04-26 17:51:10 UTC
Mark Androcius wrote:
Xython wrote:
I must have missed this thing about Datacores, what all is going on with them? The problem I see with the current system is that people are using it as a passive isk generator (make an alt account, 3x datacore and pi alts, ta-da, pays for that account and your main) instead of it's intended purpose.


Yeah, i don't know where this idea comes from either, but it's all i could make out of the OP.


Sigh..what, the CCP major dev's are not on your dear leader's speed-dial?
I am not going to help my enemy with information, but It will make you null sec zealots dance with even more glee.
Mark Androcius
#46 - 2012-04-26 17:52:15 UTC
Tinnin Sylph wrote:
So your options are stay in High Sec and enjoy the lack of politics/risk and settle for a lower income, or join/found a 0.0 corp and enjoy the higher profits that go along with the increased effort involved for you and your corp mates. Sandbox, yay!

This really is working as intended.


You say found a 0.0 corp, like it's a 5 second job, which it isn't.

https://androcius.wordpress.com
Tinnin Sylph
Perkone
Caldari State
#47 - 2012-04-26 17:55:28 UTC
Tinnin Sylph wrote:
... join/found a 0.0 corp and enjoy the higher profits that go along with the increased effort involved for you and your corp mates.



That's kind of the point.

But if you want lower effort just join an existing corp. Or, stay in High Sec and accept lower profits. I honestly can't see what part of this could be confusing or considered broken.

Heh.
Mark Androcius
#48 - 2012-04-26 17:58:02 UTC
Tinnin Sylph wrote:
Tinnin Sylph wrote:
... join/found a 0.0 corp and enjoy the higher profits that go along with the increased effort involved for you and your corp mates.



That's kind of the point.

But if you want lower effort just join an existing corp. Or, stay in High Sec and accept lower profits. I honestly can't see what part of this could be confusing or considered broken.


Having a life besides EVE, meaning casual play, meaning less then 2 hours per day.
Didn't say you were wrong though, only said that there are people who do not WANT to join any of the currently running null sec corporations.

https://androcius.wordpress.com
DarthNefarius
Minmatar Heavy Industries
#49 - 2012-04-26 18:02:18 UTC
Vince Snetterton wrote:
I am speaking to the null sec zealots in-game plus the faction within the CCP dev/content community.
Well, you got what you wanted. Another massive transfer of wealth from high sec income to null sec.

Best guess after the devastation of the VG's, is we are looking at Incursion ISK injected in the game go from 9 Trillion/month to about 3-4 Trillion, once people have fully figured them out. An immense nerf.

Meantime, the bounties on all Drone missions equals new ISK from the Drone Regions.
High sec missions drone bounties will be less far far than the reduction in high sec Incursion Payouts, while the Drone Regions are a substantial new ISK flow.

Let's see what the May numbers look like when CCP does it's tweeets at end of May.
Let's see how close I am in my estimates.

I am banking on 3.5 trillion ISK injection from Incursions, and about 28-30 trillion from rest of the game.
Total reduction of ISK/month will be in the 1-2 trillion range tops, with a much larger percentage being generated from null.



nope I expect to see 39-44 trillion from bounties alone. the Drone bounties & all the peeps going from Incursions to L4's will more then inject any lost income from Incursions getting gutted. Vanguards in effect got a 50-75% reduction in ISK/hour with OTA's stacking up like dead bodies did in streets of Europe during the Black Plague. Thanks for probably ruining an entire community CCP DEV's... who tests this crap anyways? 

An' then Chicken@little.com, he come scramblin outta the    Terminal room screaming "The system's crashing! The system's    crashing!" -Uncle RAMus, 'Tales for Cyberpsychotic Children'
Tinnin Sylph
Perkone
Caldari State
#50 - 2012-04-26 18:04:38 UTC
I'm sure most High Sec residents spend at least as much time playing on average as people in 0.0. What separates them is that those who are risk adverse stay in 'safe' space and accordingly profit less in return for the added safety.

The simple fact is, anyone can move out to 0.0 space if they want to and take advantages of the rewards it offers them... If they're willing at accept the risk.

Heh.
Jenn aSide
Soul Machines
The Initiative.
#51 - 2012-04-26 18:10:07 UTC
Mark Androcius wrote:

Having a life besides EVE, meaning casual play, meaning less then 2 hours per day.
Didn't say you were wrong though, only said that there are people who do not WANT to join any of the currently running null sec corporations.


Then those people lose out, simple as that. Their a re plenty of null sec renting corps that expect NOTHING from a member but the isk from the bounties of the rats you kill (or a fixed fee if you are an industiralist). Perfect situation for someone with only a couple hours to play. Heck, there are even NPC null sec allainces that kind of do the same thing if you don't want to leave your stuff in a conquerable station.

But if you jjust have to have the safety of high sec, you should understand that that (like everything) comes at a cost, the cost being lower profits. I think EVE high sec dwellers are some of the most coddled and spoiled people in gaming and that's saying something.
Tanya Powers
Doomheim
#52 - 2012-04-26 18:10:36 UTC
I don't care about so much hate, peace and love people.

CCP plz just make this music mandatory when you jump in to Jita for the next week !!
Tanya Powers
Doomheim
#53 - 2012-04-26 18:14:14 UTC
Mark Androcius wrote:
Having a life besides EVE, meaning casual play, meaning less then 2 hours per day.
Didn't say you were wrong though, only said that there are people who do not WANT to join any of the currently running null sec corporations.


Find the good null sec corporation/alliance and instead of looking at your gaming time as a drawback, loo at it as an incredible moment of complicity with awesome people just like you, or with a different life, but al sharing the same passion for this game Lol
Vince Snetterton
#54 - 2012-04-26 18:14:22 UTC
DarthNefarius wrote:
Vince Snetterton wrote:
I am speaking to the null sec zealots in-game plus the faction within the CCP dev/content community.
Well, you got what you wanted. Another massive transfer of wealth from high sec income to null sec.

Best guess after the devastation of the VG's, is we are looking at Incursion ISK injected in the game go from 9 Trillion/month to about 3-4 Trillion, once people have fully figured them out. An immense nerf.

Meantime, the bounties on all Drone missions equals new ISK from the Drone Regions.
High sec missions drone bounties will be less far far than the reduction in high sec Incursion Payouts, while the Drone Regions are a substantial new ISK flow.

Let's see what the May numbers look like when CCP does it's tweeets at end of May.
Let's see how close I am in my estimates.

I am banking on 3.5 trillion ISK injection from Incursions, and about 28-30 trillion from rest of the game.
Total reduction of ISK/month will be in the 1-2 trillion range tops, with a much larger percentage being generated from null.



nope I expect to see 39-44 trillion from bounties alone. the Drone bounties & all the peeps going from Incursions to L4's will more then inject any lost income from Incursions getting gutted. Vanguards in effect got a 50-75% reduction in ISK/hour with OTA's stacking up like dead bodies did in streets of Europe during the Black Plague. Thanks for probably ruining an entire community CCP DEV's... who tests this crap anyways?



I should dig up one of my old threads predicting people were not going to touch OTA's because of the enormous risk factor .
But CCP listens only to null sec and anti-high sec people.
Peck R Wood
Doomheim
#55 - 2012-04-26 18:17:39 UTC
Hey, where can a fella find a little action in this universe. Peck Wood needs to party!

"Benteen, come on, big village, be quick. Bring packs." -George Armstrong Custer
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#56 - 2012-04-26 18:33:02 UTC
Vince Snetterton wrote:
Best guess after the devastation of the VG's, is we are looking at Incursion ISK injected in the game go from 9 Trillion/month to about 3-4 Trillion, once people have fully figured them out.
Highly unlikely, but good if it turns out to be true.

Quote:
I am banking on 3.5 trillion ISK injection from Incursions, and about 28-30 trillion from rest of the game.
Very unlikely, but at least the ratios would be moving in the right direction, so the overall picture would be good.

Quote:
Total reduction of ISK/month will be in the 1-2 trillion range tops, with a much larger percentage being generated from null.
Could have been even better if it was more, but still good.

It hasn't really become any harder to make ISK, but the influx will still be decreased to more sane levels from the various sources. If those rewards get shifted more towards less secure space, then that's a good start at fixing a problem that began to grow 8 years ago. Above all, it allows for more variety in gameplay without being a complete sucker about what you choose to do. So yes, if “null sec zealots” are the reason for these changes, then they deserve some cudos.
Enuen Ravenseye
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#57 - 2012-04-26 18:38:42 UTC
Vince Snetterton wrote:
angry stuff


TL:DR version: Dammit CCP, how can I RMT if you reduce my revenue stream?!?!?
Doc Severide
Doomheim
#58 - 2012-04-26 18:49:20 UTC
Tinnin Sylph wrote:
I'm sure most High Sec residents spend at least as much time playing on average as people in 0.0. What separates them is that those who are risk adverse stay in 'safe' space and accordingly profit less in return for the added safety.

The simple fact is, anyone can move out to 0.0 space if they want to and take advantages of the rewards it offers them... If they're willing at accept the risk.

This makes sense to me. More risk, bigger rewards. What's wrong with that?

I do disagree however as the reasons people won't leave HI-Sec. I fly alone these days, would love to move "back" to 0.0. But I for one thing don't want to go through the hassle of trying to get into a corp. Getting grilled, given the 3rd degree, demanding API, etc, etc.
Another thing, I'm tired of the melodrama and assholes who proliferate in some corps. I have been in a corp having lots of fun until some jerk joined up that treats everyone like crap, demanding that everyone flys the ships he thinks we should fly and fit them now he likes.
I just wanna meet some guys, fight, have fun, and forget treating the game like it's a matter of life and death...
Fredfredbug4
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#59 - 2012-04-26 19:11:55 UTC
CCP wants money making in this game to be about risk vs reward.

The higher the risk, the higher the reward.

Incursions messed that up by creating an extremely low risk and extremely high reward activity, essentially obsoleting every form of money making in the game.

Watch_ Fred Fred Frederation_ and stop [u]cryptozoologist[/u]! Fight against the brutal genocide of fictional creatures across New Eden! Is that a metaphor? Probably not, but the fru-fru- people will sure love it!
Vince Snetterton
#60 - 2012-04-26 19:28:06 UTC
Fredfredbug4 wrote:
CCP wants money making in this game to be about risk vs reward.

The higher the risk, the higher the reward.

Incursions messed that up by creating an extremely low risk and extremely high reward activity, essentially obsoleting every form of money making in the game.


Either provide numbers or you are a liar.
Plain and simple.

Oh, sorry, the numbers do not support you, liar.