EVE General Discussion

I'd be all for a timer preventing docking but not one preventing jumping. The big difference between the two is that I can position someone on the other side to tackle a fleeing Logi... I can't do anything to stop a docking Logi.

-Liang

i find no issue with the new system at all it has been explained to me and whats the big deal logis can jump/ dock when the ship they are repping can

so what does it change apart from fags in high sec doing there failness

most people just like to argue no matter what the topic

There is a difference between a ships basic design principles dictating its ability to disengage, and using what amounts to a broken mechanic that you say is not an aggressive act.

I say fooey. Repping a ship that is currently engaged in combat is an aggressive act, if I'm the one in combat with him.





Repping the target I'm shooting is a hostile act, I'm not sure how that doesn't compute to you or what PL's hot dropping habbits have to do with the broken state of logistics.


The game design company is telling you during this presentation that it actually is NOT working as intended.




Its amazing you can say that over and over with a straight face.

Stopping me from killing the man I'm killing is fairly aggressive, interfering in my fight is an aggressive act.








You can see it as a nerf if you want, and it is, you're justified in your belief. But its a nerf that people that have dealt with carriers sitting on the undock repping ships free of care asked for, its a nerf that people that fight in high sec have asked for, and low sec and nullsec have been begging for this change for longer than I care to remember.

Repping a target taking fire is a hostile action to the people shooting that target.

Your failure to acknowledge that is the core of the problem.

and I say you have an odd definition of aggressive
If you are beating someone up and I restrain you that's not aggressive



That you can't see what the point is is indicative of your own short sightedness. Explain to me what the difference is between neutrals starting to rep a target after it's been engaged and you dropping a capital blob on a ship that thought they were fighting a single ship right up to the point the cyno was lit



So based on this statement I assume you will cease to comment about the incoming titan nerfs



You accusing me of hypocrisy in this thread. that's really rich. and no, stopping you from trying to kill someone is a defensive act this has been consistent in every society human beings have ever devised so there is no reason to think EVE would be any different,






Once again it's a defensive act, I dare you to find any legal framework in human history that has ever held that preventing violence has ever been considered an aggressive act. By your twisted definitions field hospitals are the equivalent of main battle tanks.

Can a rep kill you? can it prevent you from warping? does it slow you down? the answer is no it doesn't affect your ship at all.

If CCP wants to change the role of logistics to something else that's their right but lets at least be honest about what's going on here. This is not about Neutral RR. this is about appeasing whinny crybabies who think they are entitled to easy kills and nothing else.

So lets just dispense with the pretext of this having anything to do with neutral RR it's that you don't like the RR mechanic itself. Fine lets make it an aggressive act, while we're at it why don't we make running a local rep an aggressive act as well. that's preventing someone from being killed right?

And I dare you to prove that defenders didn't get shot.

A rep can't kill me, but he can keep the other one on the field risk free while I get shot up. Thus deciding the outcome.
It slows my damage on the one I am shooting down and if it's a good repper can easy counter my damage output.

If a plane drops a bomb it's not the plane that kills but the bomb, but they are equally present in the whole action. The pilot didn't kill me. The bomb did. Does this however mean the pilot has nothing to do with it?

Aren't it the ones who use neutral or even none neutral reppers out for easier killing with a negation of risk to their own side?
So why are those using RR having double standards?

This isn't about any upcomming changes to RR for you. This is about your alt reppers or friend RR's suddenly facing actually partaking in PvP and lose the ship they brought to a fight.

Nope its that simple, you don't rep after the FC says jump.

You can't, you have 1/3 of the ship of the lines' eHP, can't chance getting caught out. Where now, you sit there are cover people landing and/or burning through bubbles until they hit the gate or you start catching heat.

If it goes like it sounds, you can't chance it.

Yeah I lost 300+ ships because I'm afraid of actually losing a ship.

If you shoot a defender in a civilian circumstance you'll go to jail for murder, if you do it in a war circumstance you're a war criminal.

By your logic the manufacturer of your target's ship should be magically teleported onto the grid since they built the ship you are fighting.

And of course the ones using RR are looking for easier killing that's the whole ******* point of the ship class.

My question is how is that any different from the Nano fags rolling around in uncatcheble ships and warping off the second anything that might able to kill them shows up, Or the hot droppers who will bait weaker forces into aggressing or having your fleet sitting on the gate in the adjacent system and only jumping in once your enemy has committed to a fight they thought they could win

Answer is that it isn't. It's a mechanic you learn to deal with it or avoid it. Simple as that. The game got along just fine, for what 8 years now? under the current mechanic, ships still died people still screwed up and lost logi on undocks and gates.

No one is holding a gun to your head and forcing you to engage people on stations or gates when they have logi. Just because you aggress someone doesn't mean you are entitled to a kill.

What the hell happened? Everyone turn into whinning carebears when I wasn't looking? What ever happened to HTF it's a cold harsh universe

What boggles my mind is that I'm willing to bet half the people (if not more) in this thread who are all butt hurt about how RR denies them kills (which is kind of the whole ******* point of RR in the first place) would defend suicide ganking as a perfectly fine mechanic. Even though there is quite literally no counter to a properly planned one (unlike RR which is actually pretty easy to counter). And no I'm not saying there is anything wrong with suicide ganking I'm just pointing out the hypocrisy of defending one while whining about the other.

BTW the only time I've ever used "Neutral" RR, was to get aggression from war targets who were at war with Blue while waiting for the Red war to go active back when I was in RVB and I did it with standard combat ships with the full intent to aggress not in logis ready to dock up.

RR ain't now and ain't ever been invincible else no one would ever die if they had that invincible RR.

And I have no problem with changes to the aggro mechanics I just don't think the current changes as proposed are a good idea. course it wouldn't be the first time CCP made a change that I thought was a bad idea, I'll adapt to whatever comes.

But now before **** is rolled out is the time to mention any problems that might come from the change. if for no other reason than so I can point and laugh in a year when my predictions come true. Cause I have no expectation that people are going to come to their senses on this matter.

Personally I think the change is good.

God forbid we might actually have to change our tactics to adjust for the mechanic. Also it provides a greater incentive to bring support EWAR to reduce the damage taken by logistics, rather than a straight up DPS/Logi fleet.

Also fewer station games, including RR carriers on stations is always a good thing.