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New to EVE, and I'll tell you what attracted me to it,. HINT: it wasn't the spaceships.

Author
Nazzer Dawk
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#121 - 2012-03-22 22:37:23 UTC  |  Edited by: Nazzer Dawk
Ai Shun wrote:
Ladie Harlot wrote:
Montevius Williams wrote:
Borun Tal wrote:
Why do people get so excited about the possibility of walking in a station when it's a game about spaceships, combat, and space-stuff? I don't get it...



Becasue EVE is more than that. EVE is supposed to be the ULTIMATE sci fi simulator. It's not there yet.


Why does Eve have to have space pants and dance emotes to make it the ULTIMATE sci fi simulator?

It's already the ultimate sci fi simulator...no need to cram second life roleplayer nonsense into it.


It is amusing seeing you repeat the same lines over and over. You'd have failed a Turing test by now for being unable to respond outside of a narrow set of choices. You can't even see there may be other aspects - even if you personally don't care for them.


This is true. It's pretty pathetic. I mean, I don't have a problem with others not liking roleplayers, but to have an attitude that your way is the only way the game is meant to be played? On a damned sandbox game?

Ladie Harlot wrote:

And I'll keep repeating them until somebody can answer my questions.

No one is answering that question because it's a dumb misrepresentation. Pro-WiS players don't talk about wanting dance emotes and "space pants", we talk about exploration, socialization, and meaningful representation of our characters. Not sure I'd even want dance emotes to exist in the game.

And almost all of us agree that the ideal situation would be the ability to do more cool sci-fi movie stuff like chilling in a Star Wars-ey cantina or meeting in secret in some remote derelict space station to organize a back-alley deal.

The problem here is that you are pretentious and think that only your vision of EVE can possibly be right. You would probably **** yourself in rage if I told you that all I do in the game is sit around my captain's quarters and play dress up, just because you think that no one else can be happy in a way that's different than the way you achieve happiness. (Note: I dont' actually do that, just using that as an example)
Ladie Harlot
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#122 - 2012-03-22 22:42:44 UTC
Nazzer Dawk wrote:
Ai Shun wrote:
Ladie Harlot wrote:
Montevius Williams wrote:
Borun Tal wrote:
Why do people get so excited about the possibility of walking in a station when it's a game about spaceships, combat, and space-stuff? I don't get it...



Becasue EVE is more than that. EVE is supposed to be the ULTIMATE sci fi simulator. It's not there yet.


Why does Eve have to have space pants and dance emotes to make it the ULTIMATE sci fi simulator?

It's already the ultimate sci fi simulator...no need to cram second life roleplayer nonsense into it.


It is amusing seeing you repeat the same lines over and over. You'd have failed a Turing test by now for being unable to respond outside of a narrow set of choices. You can't even see there may be other aspects - even if you personally don't care for them.


This is true. It's pretty pathetic. I mean, I don't have a problem with others not liking roleplayers, but to have an attitude that your way is the only way the game is meant to be played? On a damned sandbox game?


Explain how having a human shaped avatar is inherently more "sci-fi" than flying a spaceship. What is it about the ability to buy more space pants in the microtransaction store makes the game an "ultimate sci-fi emulator".

Also, I'm not telling anybody how the game is meant to be played. I'm just making sure that CCP follows through on their promise to focus on Eve content instead of wasting time on crap that only a tiny, tiny group of players cares about.

The artist formerly known as Ladie Scarlet.

Nazzer Dawk
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#123 - 2012-03-22 22:49:18 UTC  |  Edited by: Nazzer Dawk
Ladie Harlot wrote:

Explain how having a human shaped avatar is inherently more "sci-fi" than flying a spaceship. What is it about the ability to buy more space pants in the microtransaction store makes the game an "ultimate sci-fi emulator".

Also, I'm not telling anybody how the game is meant to be played. I'm just making sure that CCP follows through on their promise to focus on Eve content instead of wasting time on crap that only a tiny, tiny group of players cares about.


Having a human shaped avatar isn't more sci-fi. Having the ability to control a human shaped avatar and do other cool sci-fi stuff is more sci fi than a game that only has spaceships. If we are going to try and objectively measure what makes a game the "ultimate sci-fi game", having more sci-fi features definitely makes a game better on that scale than one that has fewer sci-fi features.

And if you aren't saying how EVE should be played, if we had a hypothetical model of development where FiS progresses precisely as it would without any WiS content, but the WiS content is still added, would you be opposed to that?

And how do you justify the assertion that only a tiny percentage of people want WiS content?
Ladie Harlot
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#124 - 2012-03-22 22:58:26 UTC
Nazzer Dawk wrote:
Having a human shaped avatar isn't more sci-fi.


I know.

Quote:
And if you aren't saying how EVE should be played, if we had a hypothetical model of development where FiS progresses precisely as it would without any WiS content, but the WiS content is still added, would you be opposed to that?


CCP ignored Eve for two years while working on WiS. If they had the ability to do both they would have done it. If, in the future, when all the FiS problems have been addressed and they want to add dance emotes or whatever I won't care but we're a long, long way off from fixing all the space content problems.

Quote:
And how do you justify the assertion that only a tiny percentage of people want WiS content?


Hardly anybody quit when they announced they were putting WiS on the backburner and focusing on actual Eve content. Also, if you look at Issler Dainze's "threadnaught" there are only a handful of people crying about WiS content and the rest of the thread is people trolling them for it.

The artist formerly known as Ladie Scarlet.

Nazzer Dawk
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#125 - 2012-03-22 23:11:38 UTC  |  Edited by: Nazzer Dawk
Ladie Harlot wrote:
Nazzer Dawk wrote:
Having a human shaped avatar isn't more sci-fi.


I know.

Quotemining? That's how you get your jollies? Like a damn child. Can't argue the point so you change the thing you are responding to.

Not even sure why you are in this discussion if you aren't trying to convince us of anything.
Quote:

CCP ignored Eve for two years while working on WiS. If they had the ability to do both they would have done it. If, in the future, when all the FiS problems have been addressed and they want to add dance emotes or whatever I won't care but we're a long, long way off from fixing all the space content problems.

You don't know what "hypothetical" means, do you?

Quote:



Hardly anybody quit when they announced they were putting WiS on the backburner and focusing on actual Eve content. Also, if you look at Issler Dainze's "threadnaught" there are only a handful of people crying about WiS content and the rest of the thread is people trolling them for it.


You think that it's a measure of how many people want a feature to look at how many people quit if that feature is put on the backburner? You seem to think the attitude of everyone else is that if they don't get exactly what they want, they just quit the game. Or maybe we are more mature than that?

Also, setting aside the fact that "forum opinion" doesn't necessarily reflect "player opinion", how about you actually go through that thread and compare the number of unique pro-WiS posters to the number of anti-WiS posters.
Ai Shun
#126 - 2012-03-22 23:49:37 UTC
Ladie Harlot wrote:
Explain how having a human shaped avatar is inherently more "sci-fi" than flying a spaceship.


Explain how any science fiction universe only had flying spaceships in it. Spaceships are a large and very important component of it. There is however a lot more to it than that.

Think.

Did Han / Luke and all the rest spend all of their time in the Millenium Falcon?
Did Captain Kirk spend all his time on the Enterprise?
Did Captain Reynolds and the crew spend all of their time onboard Serenity?

No. There was a science fiction out there with stories, lore and a lot more.

Ladie Harlot wrote:
What is it about the ability to buy more space pants in the microtransaction store makes the game an "ultimate sci-fi emulator".


That type of misrepresentation does **** all for your credibility. You are deliberately misrepresenting the position to denigrate it; which is starting to give me the hint you are either totally ******* dumb or incapable of forming a more coherent position on it.

Quote:
wasting time on crap that only a tiny, tiny group of players cares about.


Quote me the numbers, please.
Nazzer Dawk
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#127 - 2012-03-22 23:52:41 UTC
Ai Shun wrote:
Ladie Harlot wrote:
Explain how having a human shaped avatar is inherently more "sci-fi" than flying a spaceship.


Explain how any science fiction universe only had flying spaceships in it. Spaceships are a large and very important component of it. There is however a lot more to it than that.

Harlot wants EVE to be "PIXAR's "Spaceships".

The Cars universe thousands of years in the future.
Ladie Harlot
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#128 - 2012-03-23 00:23:13 UTC
Ai Shun wrote:
That type of misrepresentation does **** all for your credibility.


LOL

The artist formerly known as Ladie Scarlet.

Ai Shun
#129 - 2012-03-23 00:28:19 UTC
Nazzer Dawk wrote:
Harlot wants EVE to be "PIXAR's "Spaceships".

The Cars universe thousands of years in the future.


She is not wrong about the importance of the FiS component. You have said it, I have said it and a number of those that desire WiS have said it as well.

FiS is more important than WiS in terms of EVE. Nothing should happen to WiS that will compromise FiS. But, there is scope to develop WiS.

Better to talk about it and make sure it delivers meaningful content when they get around to doing it than getting rubbish because we stayed silent.
Ladie Harlot
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#130 - 2012-03-23 00:28:26 UTC
Nazzer Dawk wrote:
You think that it's a measure of how many people want a feature to look at how many people quit if that feature is put on the backburner?


If you don't think the number of people canceling their subscriptions for a game that survives on subscriptions is important then you are dumb.

I'll try to make this really, really simple for you.

CCP ignored Eve for two years to develop WoD and WiS.
A bunch of people got fed up and quit.
CCP lost a ton of money and had to lay off 20% of their employees.
They committed to working on Eve again and put WiS and the backburner.
People who had quit started coming back.

If there was some huge population that cared about WiS they would have quit when CCP announced that it was on the backburner but there is no evidence that this happened.

The artist formerly known as Ladie Scarlet.

Ladie Harlot
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#131 - 2012-03-23 00:30:38 UTC
Ai Shun wrote:
FiS is more important than WiS in terms of EVE. Nothing should happen to WiS that will compromise FiS. But, there is scope to develop WiS.


Not all of you believe this. In the other big WiS thread Issler Dainze is actively insulting developers who are fixing Eve but not working on WiS.

The artist formerly known as Ladie Scarlet.

Ladie Harlot
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#132 - 2012-03-23 00:32:52 UTC
Nazzer Dawk wrote:
Harlot wants EVE to be "PIXAR's "Spaceships".

The Cars universe thousands of years in the future.


I'm not sure where you're pulling Pixar from but, yes, Eve Online is spaceships. It always has been and always will be.

The artist formerly known as Ladie Scarlet.

Ai Shun
#133 - 2012-03-23 00:39:19 UTC
Ladie Harlot wrote:
Not all of you believe this.


There are unreasonable people across all aspects of the game. Hence, I said "a number of those that desire WiS have said it as well"
Ladie Harlot
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#134 - 2012-03-23 00:43:07 UTC
Ai Shun wrote:
Ladie Harlot wrote:
Not all of you believe this.


There are unreasonable people across all aspects of the game. Hence, I said "a number of those that desire WiS have said it as well"


The problem is that there are so few pro-WiS players that it's easy for it to look like one of you speaks for the rest.

The artist formerly known as Ladie Scarlet.

Nazzer Dawk
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#135 - 2012-03-23 00:46:25 UTC  |  Edited by: Nazzer Dawk
Ladie Harlot wrote:
Nazzer Dawk wrote:
You think that it's a measure of how many people want a feature to look at how many people quit if that feature is put on the backburner?


If you don't think the number of people canceling their subscriptions for a game that survives on subscriptions is important then you are dumb.

I'll try to make this really, really simple for you.

CCP ignored Eve for two years to develop WoD and WiS.
A bunch of people got fed up and quit.
CCP lost a ton of money and had to lay off 20% of their employees.
They committed to working on Eve again and put WiS and the backburner.
People who had quit started coming back.

If there was some huge population that cared about WiS they would have quit when CCP announced that it was on the backburner but there is no evidence that this happened.



So, WiS begins work, lots of people leave.

WiS stops work, not many people leave.

And that means that everyone hates WiS, not that everyone hates FiS being ignored?


Ladie Harlot wrote:
Nazzer Dawk wrote:
Harlot wants EVE to be "PIXAR's "Spaceships".

The Cars universe thousands of years in the future.


I'm not sure where you're pulling Pixar from but, yes, Eve Online is spaceships. It always has been and always will be.



Not surprised you don't get it, trolls don't get real people humor.


See, in the Cars universe, planes, trains, and automobiles pilot themselves. You don't see drivers, they aren't really needed.

You seem to want EVE to stay as a game where ships are basically autonomous, where the lore and a little portrait in the corner suggest that a person is there, but the person doesn't matter at all. In fact, you could remove the portrait and just be playing a game in a universe that has Autonomous ships and nothing else. Like the Cars universe thousands of years in the future.
Ai Shun
#136 - 2012-03-23 00:55:31 UTC
Ladie Harlot wrote:
Ai Shun wrote:
Ladie Harlot wrote:
Not all of you believe this.


There are unreasonable people across all aspects of the game. Hence, I said "a number of those that desire WiS have said it as well"


The problem is that there are so few pro-WiS players that it's easy for it to look like one of you speaks for the rest.


I don't know that. CCP has not released any survey data of the player-base to state what the situation is. I suppose your guess is as good as mine Lol
Nazzer Dawk
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#137 - 2012-03-23 00:56:25 UTC  |  Edited by: Nazzer Dawk
Ladie Harlot wrote:
Nazzer Dawk wrote:
So, WiS begins work, lots of people leave.

WiS stops work, not many people leave.

And that means that everyone hates WiS, not that everyone hates FiS being ignored?


:cripes:

This is why I usually just post about dance emotes and space pants. Space Barbie enthusiasts are apparently unable to comprehend anything more complex.

Excuse me, sir.

Did people leave because they didn't like WiS, or did they leave because they felt FiS was suffering?

I'm so ready to just block your posts. You don't care about convincing anyone, you care about making yourself feel superior to others.
Ladie Harlot
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#138 - 2012-03-23 00:59:50 UTC
Nazzer Dawk wrote:
I'm so ready to just block your posts.


Do it. You'll be happier in life.

The artist formerly known as Ladie Scarlet.

Terminal Insanity
KarmaFleet
Goonswarm Federation
#139 - 2012-03-23 01:01:44 UTC
I started playing for the ruthless pvp options available

I was an oldschool MUD fan (teleporting noobs directly to me and killing them ftw)
I played tons of Neverwinter Nights in a PVP server called Neversummer. I used to hunt people in the towns and then everyone would form up hunting parties to kill me \o/

Eve is one of the few games that really let you have fun, instead of just let you shoot NPC's

"War declarations are never officially considered griefing and are not a bannable offense, and it has been repeatedly stated by the developers that the possibility for non-consensual PvP is an intended feature." - CCP

Nazzer Dawk
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#140 - 2012-03-23 01:02:31 UTC
Ladie Harlot wrote:
Nazzer Dawk wrote:

See, in the Cars universe, planes, trains, and automobiles pilot themselves. You don't see drivers, they aren't really needed.

You seem to want EVE to stay as a game where ships are basically autonomous, where the lore and a little portrait in the corner suggest that a person is there, but the person doesn't matter at all. In fact, you could remove the portrait and just be playing a game in a universe that has Autonomous ships and nothing else. Like the Cars universe thousands of years in the future.


Now I understand. You don't have the cognitive ability nor the imagination to play a game unless you have a human-shaped avatar. The pod pilot or capsuleer lore of Eve is too complex for you.

It makes sense why you want to take our deep, complex game and dumb it down.


I see. You can't possibly respond to my arguments, so you instead try to insult me and ignore my points.

Tell me more about how the existence of avatars damage EVE's gameplay.