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[proposal] Delete Titans

Author
Scatim Helicon
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
#21 - 2012-03-18 17:04:33 UTC
Jean McBean wrote:
Scatim Helicon wrote:


Thankfully, this tracking nerf seems to be step one of CCP righting its long-standing mistakes and going through the process of giving Titans a clear defined role.


not sure if you are trolling or get what you are actually saying, but where are Titans in the process of getting a "clear" defined role, when your JUST reducing their abilities? besides the jump portal (whohoo 100b PVP ship just to bridge other ships aorund) there is literaly no purpose you cant just replace a Titan with a different type of ship. T3's are mostly prefered as a Bonus supplier already, since they are way cheaper, easier to move and can give different,mostly more usefull Boni. Dreads and SC's do both better DPS anyway. So would you please explain, why you think this is an improvment for defining the role of Titans?


Its almost like you didn't read the tracking nerf thread or something.

CCP Greyscale wrote:
We're not happy with the effectiveness of large groups of titans against subcapital ships, so we're making some adjustments to titans and to XL turrets.

This is a quick, surgical adjustment to solve a specific issue we have identified. It's not a general titan balance pass, and we don't consider titans "done" after this change. Titans will require significant further changes, and probably an overall adjustment in role, before they're in a place where we're really happy with them.

Every time you post a WiS thread, Hilmar strangles a kitten.

Ivanda Nothabeer
Exit-Strategy
Unchained Alliance
#22 - 2012-03-18 18:18:52 UTC  |  Edited by: Ivanda Nothabeer
By CCP's own admission the tracking Nerf is a quick fix because they can't decide on a role for Titans. It's almost like they dont read their own dev blogs. (and learn nothing from their past mistakes)

Anyway - Titan's were always meant to be very rare in Eve. Frankly, deleting all existing titans, compensating players by returning some Titan specific skillpoints and some portion of their value in minerals is a pretty good idea.

If you still think there should be Titans in Eve - and tbh, I think there should be a ship class called "Titan" - then give us a new, properly designed and properly balanced Ship that fills a role that doent completely unbalance large scale warfare. Most importantly, remove BPO's and tightly control the supply of BPC's to limit the number of those ships
paik
H A V O C
Test Alliance Please Ignore
#23 - 2012-03-18 19:00:47 UTC  |  Edited by: paik
The main problem I see is the Greyscale nerf realistically reduces DPS versus subcaps by 25%. Subcaps will still be blapped in short order. This is a useless slap in the face in a long list of useless slaps in the face against Titans. Every Titan nerf the "Anti-Titan" parties gather in celebrations and countdowns to nerf day. To only find out soon later that they are still getting ownzoned by Titans. If you read Seleene's Blog(My CEO ♥ Vote Seleene) you will see where the problem with this and pervious nerfs are.


Basically CCP has done this over and over through the years with Titans "kick the can down the road". However when they do so the Titan falls down the list of priorities on the backlog allowing them to divert attention to higher priorities. Instead of repeating this scenario again for the 5th time lets just do the sensible thing.



Delete Titan's as they exist now and everything Titan involved. Problem solved! Then CCP can take all the lessons learned over the years and design a new Titan that better fits into Eve. At that point the players will decide if they want to skill for or pilot the new Titan. Its really that simple.



Now I get it the "anti-titan" crowd wants vengence they are unhappy to have been subjugated to Titan blapping. They would like nothing more than to see the pilots punished. But I say punished for what? Titan pilots used the ship that CCP put into the game. No matter what CCP's best intentions were reality is the Titan has been a subcap smashing machine since introduction and will continue to be post Greyscale nerf.


Deleting Titans is a victory for everyone and a damn sure sight better than "Kicking the can down the road" again for the 5th time with a open-ended statement "We will revisit these later". We all have seen what that means.


18 month anyone? As a titan pilot I can live with blapping with 25% less dps for another 18 months. Can you?


Delete Titans

Seleene's Blog http://seleenes-sandbox.blogspot.com/2012/03/balancing-costs-benefits.html
paik
H A V O C
Test Alliance Please Ignore
#24 - 2012-03-18 19:01:08 UTC
The main problem I see is the Greyscale nerf realistically reduces DPS versus subcaps by 25%. Subcaps will still be blapped in short order. This is a useless slap in the face in a long list of useless slaps in the face against Titans. Every Titan nerf the "Anti-Titan" parties gather in celebrations and countdowns to nerf day. To only find out soon later that they are still getting ownzoned by Titans. If you read Seleenes Blog (My CEO ♥ Vote Seleene) you will see where the problem with this and pervious nerfs are.


Basically CCP has done this over and over through the years with Titans "kick the can down the road". However when they do so the Titan falls down the list of priorities on the backlog allowing them to divert attention to higher priorities. Instead of repeating this scenario again for the 5th time lets just do the sensible thing.



Delete Titan's as they exist now and everything Titan involved. Problem solved! Then CCP can take all the lessons learned over the years and design a new Titan that better fits into Eve. At that point the players will decide if they want to skill for or pilot the new Titan. Its really that simple.



Now I get it the "anti-titan" crowd wants vengence they are unhappy to have been subjugated to Titan blapping. They would like nothing more than to see the pilots punished. But I say punished for what? Titan pilots used the ship that CCP put into the game. No matter what CCP's best intentions were reality is the Titan has been a subcap smashing machine since introduction and will continue to be post Greyscale nerf.


Deleting Titans is a victory for everyone and a damn sure sight better than "Kicking the can down the road" again for the 5th time with a open-ended statement "We will revisit these later". We all have seen what that means.


18 month anyone? As a titan pilot I can live with blapping with 25% less dps for another 18 months. Can you?


Delete Titans
Tiger's Spirit
Perkone
Caldari State
#25 - 2012-03-19 07:06:17 UTC  |  Edited by: Tiger's Spirit
paik wrote:
Dear CSM & CCP;



Hello I fly a Titan class vessel in a corporation with many Titan Class vessel's in a Alliance with the most Titan class vessels. My alliance uses Titans more than anyother organization in game


You forgot to tell to us, Your alliance bought for RMT so many titan from Morsus Mihi when they leaving this game.

So, before you ask titan delete, you need to ask delete those pilot accounts too from CCP.
India99
Hesso Business
#26 - 2012-03-19 10:18:54 UTC
Tiger's Spirit wrote:


You forgot to tell to us, Your alliance bought for RMT so many titan from Morsus Mihi when they leaving this game.

So, before you ask titan delete, you need to ask delete those pilot accounts too from CCP.


you forgot to learn the language, that your accusing ppl stupid untruths with, mate
Tiger's Spirit
Perkone
Caldari State
#27 - 2012-03-19 11:03:00 UTC
India99 wrote:
Tiger's Spirit wrote:


You forgot to tell to us, Your alliance bought for RMT so many titan from Morsus Mihi when they leaving this game.

So, before you ask titan delete, you need to ask delete those pilot accounts too from CCP.


you forgot to learn the language, that your accusing ppl stupid untruths with, mate


Tipical damage control.
My language is the main problem, not the PL's RMT supcap transfer from MM.
India99
Hesso Business
#28 - 2012-03-19 11:17:51 UTC
Tiger's Spirit wrote:
[quote=India99][quote=Tiger's Spirit]

Tipical damage control.
My language is the main problem, not the PL's RMT supcap transfer from MM.


your questionable reading skills might actually be the reason why you think PL has to RMT at all. Have you checked the Technetium prices recently?
Tiger's Spirit
Perkone
Caldari State
#29 - 2012-03-19 11:48:43 UTC  |  Edited by: Tiger's Spirit
India99 wrote:
Tiger's Spirit wrote:
[quote=India99][quote=Tiger's Spirit]

Tipical damage control.
My language is the main problem, not the PL's RMT supcap transfer from MM.


your questionable reading skills might actually be the reason why you think PL has to RMT at all. Have you checked the Technetium prices recently?


Because i know, who sold those ships for to PL and Raiden.
Maybe it's time to check for the CCP those titans, how they transfered without ISK and without build to new proprietors.
knobber Jobbler
Bat Country
Pandemic Horde
#30 - 2012-03-19 16:13:20 UTC
Raivi wrote:
[quote=paik]Dear CSM & CCP;


May actually be the best solution long-term. The flood of minerals would be the big problem, but it might be something that needs to be done sooner or later.


There's 400 Titans give or take a few, that in minerals is a fair amount but they need to get to market and back into the chain. I bet you'd notice a slight change in the market in some bits of null for a very short while then nothing.

CCP might lose 400 subscriptions, big deal, thats 0.001% of the EVE player base. Likely they'll just all become supercap pilots and the minerals will be used to build supercaps. Then supercaps will be removed.



Asuka Solo
I N E X T R E M I S
Tactical Narcotics Team
#31 - 2012-03-19 16:36:29 UTC  |  Edited by: Asuka Solo
-1

Counter proposal:
Delete all sub capital ships, equipment, skills, BPOs and BPCs.

Solve the real hobo blob.

Now that would be win sauce.

Eve is about Capital ships, WiS, Boobs, PI and Isk!

Plaude Pollard
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#32 - 2012-03-19 19:30:00 UTC
Ivanda Nothabeer wrote:
By CCP's own admission the tracking Nerf is a quick fix because they can't decide on a role for Titans. It's almost like they dont read their own dev blogs. (and learn nothing from their past mistakes)

How about giving them some sort of "Flagship" status? Titans aren't meant to be something anyone can just fly. They're meant to be rare, valuable ships, that gives the pilot some kind of status. Strip it of its guns, let it remain able to use all the fancy Titan-only modules and give it superior Fleet Bonuses, while keeping it too expensive to just bring to every battle. This might actually give them the Flag-ship status I always imagined Titans having, instead of the Slightly Bigger Frigate-status they have now. Titans weren't meant to be something everyone could just get. In fact, removing all current Titans, reimbursing the SP and adding a Flagship-class with the same names and models as the current Titans might be the right way to go. Or even better: remove all Titan-Blueprints, but let the current Titans stay. When they're gone, there will be no replacing them, which will lead to them eventually getting some status, when enough are killed by smaller, cooler ships.

I'm not saying this is the only way to go, but it's definitely one way.

New to EVE? Want to learn? The Crimson Cartel will train you in the fields of _**your **_choice. Mainly active in EU afternoons and evenings. Contact me for more info.

Yamarash
13th Squadron
COALICION HISPANA
#33 - 2012-03-19 21:36:55 UTC
Ok so. After the upconing and ****** TITANS nerf

1) CANNOT SHOOT SUB-CAPITALS (why sub-capitals will able to shoot titans)
2) ALONE CAN ONLY KILL CARRIERS WITH DOOMSDAY. (and maybe dreads). SO DOOMSDAY DEVICE IS NOW UNUSEFUL
3) TITAN WILL TAKE A LOT OF TIME TARGETTING EVEN CAPITALS (5mm scan resolution) ITS A JOKE
4) TITANS DONT RECEIVE AT LEAST AN EXTRA BONUS LIKE MORE DAMAGE OR SOMETHING LIKE THAT. ****. ITS A 70-90 BILLION STUFF. WHAT IS THE ADD VALUE TO HAVE A TITAN???

BASICLY CCP IS LEAVING A VESSEL ONLY TO SHOOT POS'es and DO BRIDGES. LOL WE NEED TO EXPEND 90B TO DO BRIDGES CCP.

CCP are you really thinking what are you doing ???? i think nope. CSM guys are not doing his jobs for whole eve community. thats is a clear statement.

P.D: sry for caps but for god sake this the more ridiculous nerf i ever saw in EVE History. This kind of decisions are killing the game or fastening his inevitable death.

Jean McBean
Doomheim
#34 - 2012-03-19 22:10:16 UTC  |  Edited by: Jean McBean
knobber Jobbler wrote:


There's 400 Titans give or take a few,.



lol...
maybe you should not participate on this discussion Lol
Josef Huffenpuff
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#35 - 2012-03-20 04:02:13 UTC
Plaude Pollard wrote:
too expensive to just bring to every battle.


Define "too expensive". When someone drops 20 titans on you, that's well over a Trillion ISK. You simply cannot "balance" titans by making them too expensive - That was just one of the fundamentally flawed assumptions made when titans were introduced.

But yeah, deleting existing Titans and replacing with something truly rare and impressive again gets a +1 from me. Keeping the existing names and models makes sense.
King Rothgar
Deadly Solutions
#36 - 2012-03-20 05:26:34 UTC
+1 to deleting them and trying again. Same should be done with SC's in all honesty.

[u]Fireworks and snowballs are great, but what I really want is a corpse launcher.[/u]

Kemal Ataturk
Antisocial Mental Disorder
#37 - 2012-03-20 11:50:09 UTC
Why not introduce something new. Make Titans Corpvessels, operated by more users, like a Pos. One guy fly it, next guy fires frontguns, next guy rear guns etc. It would advance the game in a new experience of battle. Instead of nerfing it or deleting it transform it to a multiuser plattform.
Arduemont
The State of War.
#38 - 2012-03-20 15:30:57 UTC  |  Edited by: Arduemont
Delete Titans?

Way to throw the baby out with the bath water. I cant understand why so many people think that's a good idea.
Just fix them ffs.

Josef Huffenpuff wrote:
Keeping the existing names and models makes sense.


By that ^^ I presume you mean... not deleting them.

/endminirant

"In the age of information, ignorance is a choice." www.stateofwar.co.nf

Rico Minali
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#39 - 2012-03-20 16:07:44 UTC
Yes.

This would actually be the best way to handle Titans, the people crying about the nerf would be reimbursed adn could respend however they want. The people crying for the nerf get rid of their source of unhappiness.

Trust me, I almost know what I'm doing.

Sith8
Blank-Space
Northern Coalition.
#40 - 2012-03-20 16:21:25 UTC
Bahahaha .... so because your shiny I-WIN button is being nerfed it should be deleted from the game altogether?

Don´t be such a douche Manny and go back to playing Eve the hard way like most of us do.
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