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Are wormhole sites solo-able?
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Kaivar Lancer
Doomheim
#1 - 2012-03-16 18:57:39 UTC
I'm exploring (har har) other avenues of earning ISK and have turned my attention to exploring wormholes. I understand that WH offer combat sites which are populated by sleepers rather than pirate NPCs. Are these sites solo-able? I can bring in a second alt if I have to.

Basically I'm thinking of creating an explorer who can quickly jump into a wormhole, do a site or two, and get out without dying from sleepers or getting blown up by the WH owners. A second alt is available.

My envisioned setup:

- a self-reliant Domi, using a setup similar to this. I'm thinking of replacing the probe launcher and the remote armor rep with either another salvager and/or tractor beam. The drones will do the killing while the domi loots and salvages. I'll use a repair drone to fix any damaged drones.

- a Mammoth-trained alt equipped with a cloak and probe launcher. It'll be the Mammoth doing the probing. When I finish a site and start looting, I'll transfer loot from my overfilled Domi to the Mammoth. This is optional.

I have no idea how big these sites or whether looting and salvaging everything is worthwhile. Is this a viable setup?
FloppieTheBanjoClown
Arcana Imperii Ltd.
#2 - 2012-03-16 19:12:59 UTC
A Domi should handle C1/C2 without much trouble. You'd do well to progress to a T3, either Tengu or Legion if you're going to get serious about wormholes. Tengu is the better solo ship, but I've been flying a Legion for a long time now and it does a great job.

Sleeper loot is lightweight. Instead of a mammoth alt, use a noctis to salvage the sites and store your stuff. 3 tractors, 3 salvagers, a probe launcher and cloak should be fine (don't neglect mid/low slots, just fit them to taste). Just don't bring the noctis in until AFTER you've killed all the sleepers.

Founding member of the Belligerent Undesirables movement.
mxzf
Shovel Bros
#3 - 2012-03-16 19:18:58 UTC
Drones don't work so well in WHs, since Sleepers change agro. They can work somewhat, but it's not like the "grab agro, drop drones, forget about drones while they do their work" that you're likely used to in lvl 4s.

Salvaging is a must in WHs, a decent portion of the income is via ribbons.

And you can solo up to C4 WHs with the proper T3 fit, but C2 is about the most you can reliably solo without a T3.

How I would suggest starting out in WHs:
Use a Drake and look for C1/2 WHs.
Fit probes on both chars (it's a must).
Put your alt in a cruiser or BC fit out for salvaging, cloaking, and hauling ammo/loot.

For trying it out solo without an alt, try fitting a Drake out something like this:
[Drake, BasicWHs]
Ballistic Control System II
Ballistic Control System II
Ballistic Control System II
Damage Control II

Large Shield Extender II
Large Shield Extender II
Invulnerability Field II
Invulnerability Field II
Photon Scattering Field II
Experimental 10MN Afterburner

Advanced 'Limos' Heavy Missile Bay I, Trauma Heavy Missile
Advanced 'Limos' Heavy Missile Bay I, Trauma Heavy Missile
Advanced 'Limos' Heavy Missile Bay I, Trauma Heavy Missile
Advanced 'Limos' Heavy Missile Bay I, Trauma Heavy Missile
Advanced 'Limos' Heavy Missile Bay I, Trauma Heavy Missile
Advanced 'Limos' Heavy Missile Bay I, Trauma Heavy Missile
Salvager I
Core Probe Launcher I, Sisters Core Scanner Probe I

Medium Core Defence Field Purger I
Medium Core Defence Field Purger I
Medium Core Defence Field Purger I

Warrior I x5

That's a cheap fit that should be able to solo any C1/2 site easily with fairly basic skills.
FloppieTheBanjoClown
Arcana Imperii Ltd.
#4 - 2012-03-16 19:23:42 UTC  |  Edited by: FloppieTheBanjoClown
A few days ago I jumped a Hyperion and a Brutix in a C2 that were using drones. They weren't terribly effective, but they got the job done and both ships were able to tank the sleeper DPS no problem. Alas, their capacitors couldn't tank my neuts...

edit: but the Drake is a much better ship for getting started. Harbinger is a solid one as well; like the Legion it's not as good as it's Caldari counterpart, but it's fun and more accessible to people with gunnery skills.

Founding member of the Belligerent Undesirables movement.
Derath Ellecon
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#5 - 2012-03-16 19:24:58 UTC
FloppieTheBanjoClown wrote:
A Domi should handle C1/C2 without much trouble. You'd do well to progress to a T3, either Tengu or Legion if you're going to get serious about wormholes. Tengu is the better solo ship, but I've been flying a Legion for a long time now and it does a great job.

Sleeper loot is lightweight. Instead of a mammoth alt, use a noctis to salvage the sites and store your stuff. 3 tractors, 3 salvagers, a probe launcher and cloak should be fine (don't neglect mid/low slots, just fit them to taste). Just don't bring the noctis in until AFTER you've killed all the sleepers.



A domi would be overkill for a C1 (and have to be built inside). Even in a C2, the slow lock times and slow aligns IMO would make a Domi less than perfect for C2's.

I moved into a C1 when I had only been playing about 5 months. I have soloed C1 sites in:

Myrmidon
Ishtar
Dominix (yea I built it inside)
drake
tengu
proteus
zealot

A C1 can easily be soloed by hurricanes etc. You need maybe about a 200DPS omni tank

There are plenty of ships that can solo wormholes up thru a C3. While C4-s and C5's can be technically soloed by some, I believe the general consensus is they are not worth it for the isk/hr ratio.
Lady Ayeipsia
BlueWaffe
#6 - 2012-03-16 19:26:00 UTC
Domi won't work for c1s. The weight limit per jump limits you to battle cruiser or smaller for c1 wormholes. I would suggest a myrmidon. Also, remember that sleepers switch targets unlike normal npc pirates. You'll be constantly recalling and releasing drones if you do not have a method of repping drones as you go.

Also, I would suggest your prober be a covert ops. Signatures in a wormhole can be harder to track down. A well fit buzzard with good skills can.really help speed up probing. Plus having a ship that can warp cloaked is a bonus.

Lastly, not having a probe launcher can be foolish. If your noctis dies or pops the wormhole, you will have to self destruct your other ship and pod to get out.
FloppieTheBanjoClown
Arcana Imperii Ltd.
#7 - 2012-03-16 19:26:24 UTC
Derath Ellecon wrote:
zealot


This was a fun ship for wormholes. Only problem was the lack of a utility high, so I had to have an alt in a scanning ship or give up 20% of my DPS.

Founding member of the Belligerent Undesirables movement.
Derath Ellecon
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#8 - 2012-03-16 19:31:28 UTC
Also,

If you want a second alt for probing/salvaging, use a destroyer. plenty of high slots for salvagers and tractors. Way cheaper than a noctis. and yes sleeper loot/salvage is very small, so you dont need a lot of cargo space.
Caleidascope
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#9 - 2012-03-16 23:52:00 UTC
The big money in wh is the sleeper salvage. Melted Nanoribbons sell for 6-7 mil isk each.

t1 fitted drake does sleeper sites in c1 wh just fine.

Life is short and dinner time is chancy

Eat dessert first!
Daniel Plain
Doomheim
#10 - 2012-03-17 01:22:15 UTC
Caleidascope wrote:
The big money in wh is the sleeper salvage. Melted Nanoribbons sell for 6-7 mil isk each.

t1 fitted drake does sleeper sites in c1 wh just fine.


actually, for c1 sites i prefer an autocannon/mwd hurricane. medium ACs just rip up the numerous frigates and with decent skills, a passive shield tank should get you through all sites without too much trouble.

I should buy an Ishtar.
Bernie Nator
Seal Club Six
Plug N Play
#11 - 2012-03-17 04:34:38 UTC
A drake is my preferred ship of choice for c1 and c2 sites, followed by a tengu for c3. Anything past that, grab friends and watch the sleepers die in a c4!

For a c5 and c6, just have lots of friends. And caps! Fun abounds here in glorious wormhole space!
Derath Ellecon
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#12 - 2012-03-17 05:16:54 UTC
Bernie Nator wrote:
A drake is my preferred ship of choice for c1 and c2 sites, followed by a tengu for c3. Anything past that, grab friends and watch the sleepers die in a c4!

For a c5 and c6, just have lots of friends. And caps! Fun abounds here in glorious wormhole space!


A drake is easy mode. But I would agree with other posters that a turret ship can clear a c1 site faster. I can clear a c1 faster in a blaster proteus. C1 is all frigates and cruisers which are sub optimal for heavy missiles.
Caleidascope
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#13 - 2012-03-17 06:56:38 UTC
Derath Ellecon wrote:
Bernie Nator wrote:
A drake is my preferred ship of choice for c1 and c2 sites, followed by a tengu for c3. Anything past that, grab friends and watch the sleepers die in a c4!

For a c5 and c6, just have lots of friends. And caps! Fun abounds here in glorious wormhole space!


A drake is easy mode. But I would agree with other posters that a turret ship can clear a c1 site faster. I can clear a c1 faster in a blaster proteus. C1 is all frigates and cruisers which are sub optimal for heavy missiles.

Remind me how much Proteus cost.

Life is short and dinner time is chancy

Eat dessert first!
Lenore Leelu
Obsidian Dynamics
#14 - 2012-03-17 10:34:48 UTC
C2, I used a tech 2 rigged, passive shield fit drake.
Krixtal Icefluxor
INLAND EMPIRE Galactic
#15 - 2012-03-17 11:21:13 UTC  |  Edited by: Krixtal Icefluxor
T3 Tengu works for me in C1 & C2.

Trick is to get a descent amount of loot OUT of the WH. A Prowler is enough to close the hole behind you ! Nothing wrong with that, except it can mean a 54 jump trip home from Kor-Azor.Lol

Good luck.

"He has mounted his hind-legs, and blown crass vapidities through the bowel of his neck."  - Ambrose Bierce on Oscar Wilde's Lecture in San Francisco 1882
Derath Ellecon
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#16 - 2012-03-17 11:28:27 UTC
Caleidascope wrote:
Derath Ellecon wrote:
Bernie Nator wrote:
A drake is my preferred ship of choice for c1 and c2 sites, followed by a tengu for c3. Anything past that, grab friends and watch the sleepers die in a c4!

For a c5 and c6, just have lots of friends. And caps! Fun abounds here in glorious wormhole space!


A drake is easy mode. But I would agree with other posters that a turret ship can clear a c1 site faster. I can clear a c1 faster in a blaster proteus. C1 is all frigates and cruisers which are sub optimal for heavy missiles.

Remind me how much Proteus cost.


Proteus cost a fair amount. But not really the point. The point is in a C1 a turret ship chews through sleeper frigs faster than heavy missiles, given that sleeper frigates have a sig radius of 35. And C1 sites are frigate heavy.

Another example would be a harbinger. But my friend flies one, I cannot. So I didn't want to use an example since its not a ship I have directly flown.
Bernie Nator
Seal Club Six
Plug N Play
#17 - 2012-03-18 06:33:57 UTC
Derath Ellecon wrote:
Caleidascope wrote:
Derath Ellecon wrote:
Bernie Nator wrote:
A drake is my preferred ship of choice for c1 and c2 sites, followed by a tengu for c3. Anything past that, grab friends and watch the sleepers die in a c4!

For a c5 and c6, just have lots of friends. And caps! Fun abounds here in glorious wormhole space!


A drake is easy mode. But I would agree with other posters that a turret ship can clear a c1 site faster. I can clear a c1 faster in a blaster proteus. C1 is all frigates and cruisers which are sub optimal for heavy missiles.

Remind me how much Proteus cost.


Proteus cost a fair amount. But not really the point. The point is in a C1 a turret ship chews through sleeper frigs faster than heavy missiles, given that sleeper frigates have a sig radius of 35. And C1 sites are frigate heavy.

Another example would be a harbinger. But my friend flies one, I cannot. So I didn't want to use an example since its not a ship I have directly flown.


A harby is decent too. I just recommend the drake because in the event you get ganked, a drake loss won't set you back much. losing a t3 on the other hand, well, bit more costly. Just because drake is easy mode doesn't mean it's bad for making isk.
Derath Ellecon
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#18 - 2012-03-18 10:52:40 UTC
Bernie Nator wrote:
Derath Ellecon wrote:
Caleidascope wrote:
Derath Ellecon wrote:
Bernie Nator wrote:
A drake is my preferred ship of choice for c1 and c2 sites, followed by a tengu for c3. Anything past that, grab friends and watch the sleepers die in a c4!

For a c5 and c6, just have lots of friends. And caps! Fun abounds here in glorious wormhole space!


A drake is easy mode. But I would agree with other posters that a turret ship can clear a c1 site faster. I can clear a c1 faster in a blaster proteus. C1 is all frigates and cruisers which are sub optimal for heavy missiles.

Remind me how much Proteus cost.


Proteus cost a fair amount. But not really the point. The point is in a C1 a turret ship chews through sleeper frigs faster than heavy missiles, given that sleeper frigates have a sig radius of 35. And C1 sites are frigate heavy.

Another example would be a harbinger. But my friend flies one, I cannot. So I didn't want to use an example since its not a ship I have directly flown.


A harby is decent too. I just recommend the drake because in the event you get ganked, a drake loss won't set you back much. losing a t3 on the other hand, well, bit more costly. Just because drake is easy mode doesn't mean it's bad for making isk.


I never meant to imply a drake is bad for making isk. I use 2 drakes most of the time. Easy mode is win. A passive fit drake is warp in, align target F1 kil. Then you can easily focus on dscan .

The only thing I was agreeing with was the other poster that in a C1 most turret ships will actually be a bit faster, due to the sleeper makeup of C1 sites. This goes away in C2 on up as the spawns start having battleships and are 90km away.

Kessiaan
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#19 - 2012-03-18 16:50:08 UTC
I've done countless lv. 3 sites in an omni-tanked dual-rep sentry Domi fit with a single large armor RR. Use T1 scout drones and carry lots of spares, scoop and redeploy the sentries (and rep them if needed) when they get aggro. It's not nearly as bad as people make it out to be, and it's a heck of a lot cheaper than a tech III.

KB Link
Caleidascope
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#20 - 2012-03-18 18:31:28 UTC
Kessiaan wrote:
I've done countless lv. 3 sites in an omni-tanked dual-rep sentry Domi fit with a single large armor RR. Use T1 scout drones and carry lots of spares, scoop and redeploy the sentries (and rep them if needed) when they get aggro. It's not nearly as bad as people make it out to be, and it's a heck of a lot cheaper than a tech III.

I only wish to point out that such setup requires a lot of attention, which means that you do not pay attention to dscan and makes you vulnerable to being ganked.

Life is short and dinner time is chancy

Eat dessert first!
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