EVE General Discussion

Sure, it balances itself out somewhere, but we don't quite know where that is, and it might not be a good place. Oh, and since 90% are run in highsec, you can bet your ass that people will start clamouring for more sites if the current selection gets too crowded… it's an affliction that's making the rounds in that part of space, after all.

Also, a large portion of the bounties already follow that rule — the more people rat/explore/run anomalies, the fewer are available. So by that token, bounties aren't a problem either…

Of course, the issue is still the same: people will tend towards whatever works the best, and right now, incursions have taken the place of a lot of highsec high-end PvE. Addressing the influx will require measures across to board, or the problem will just shift around. The thing that makes incursions special is that they already have their solution built in, so there's quite literally no reason not to do it.

How do you control the EVE economy when anyone can buy a PLEX out of game and turn it into isk?

If battleship bounties get nerfed you will have a lot of angry high sec missioners. Remember those are the bulk of your costumers.
TIme to go mining i guess?

A german journalist took a look at how politics where using (very valid) statistics to support their ... well ... let's call it "political ideas". He then wrote a book with the title: "Lying with Numbers".

The amount of ISK per faucet in total tells you *beep* all. You have to look at the numbers per capita (that means player, not account or char). And highsec Incursions are bending those numbers in an extreme fashion. The high income per char per hour provides an alternative to other ways to have an income (remember: minerals you mine yourself are free). That _will_ have an effect as more and more players join Incursions _even_ if they still end up with the same income in ISK per day.

The biggest time killer in highsec is mining. And we already see the effect of the shift in income sources from highsec mining to highsec Incursions. Until Highsec Incursions are nerfed in some way (there are plenty) low min prices will keep going up until an equilibrium is reached between Incursion income per day of a single char player with income per day of a (moderate) multi char mining player.

Love makes pretty blind, you know. We all know how much you love your baby that is Incursions. Please don't cuddle it until it dies.

We (the arrogant knowledgeable palyerbase) told you that removing mineral buy orders but keeping insurance fraud was petty stupid. (OK, that was before your time).

We told you that jet can flagging will be used exclusively to grief players. (Why can't I be a shark in a 1.0 system anyway?)

We told you that the arti-change will make highsec suicide **** easy. (Look at all those tengus!)

We told you that AE DDs will make Titans mandatory.

We told you that the supcap HP boost will turn EVE into super captials online (and make dreads pointless).

We told you a lot more I forgot.

But then we are not the CSM and as such safe to ignore.

I'm not bitter tho. I will just be here and wait. I will wait for the whining that is ENDLESS!

This is only true if the the amount of ISK currently generated is = to the potential ISK of these resources. IE every belt had ratters, every anom had someone in it, and every explo site was being run as soon at it spawned. Given that there are way more belts/anoms/explo sites than incursion sites the potential global ISK injection from boutnies makes Incursions way less of an issue.

Regardless, missions do not follow the same laws given that there is an infinite supply of them.

All your knee-jerk reaction post does is show three things:

1. You're terrified CCP might reduce the amount of laughably easy ISK you grind
2. You don't know what inflation is or what causes it
3. You don't understand the difference between injecting minerals and injecting ISK into the economy

Ah... so what you are saying is all professions should be balanced income-wise? I don't think you can do that without hosing the economy. Some jobs are worth less. Some jobs are boring and suck and the only reason people do them is because they get paid. Take mining for example. It's boring. Why would anyone just sit around and mine? Well... it's easy... and it pays. The reason it pays is because it provides a vital component in production. If everyone was a miner though, it would cease to pay because the market would be flooded with cheap minerals and no one would be building ships because they were mining. If hardly anyone ever mined, mining would probably become the most lucrative profession in the game. The economy sets the balance all on it's own. Other professions that float with and are balanced by normal economic forces are market traders, shipping/courier services, PvP, Ninja Looting/salvaging, piracy, Industrialists of all kinds, people who run missions/deadspace for loot (mag/radar sites, DED plexing), Anything done in a wormhole, PI, and moon goo POS operators. None of these groups are negatively affected by inflation and all of these professions are very efficiently balanced against one-another by the economy.

Inflation hurts only the professions that are not paid by other players, but by CCP and the EvE simulator itself. These PVE professions include Incursion fleets, NPC mission runners, NPC ratters, and possibly Faction Warfare people but tbqh I don't know a lot about that last one so maybe it doesn't belong on the list. Most of CCPs economic tinkering has been in these professions because the mechanics printing ISK for these people do so at fixed rates. These are the only elements CCP can manipulate and so CCP is trying to do that because the PVE professions are not automatically balanced by the economy. They are the equivalent of government jobs IRL. So what can CCP do? Not much in my view. Sure they could try to correct mission/incursion/bounties/FW rewards for inflation, but that is a problem because 1) it will accelerate inflation and 2) it creates an imbalance in the economy. Stay with me on the last one: using the example earlier about mining and what it pays, the number of miners supported by the economy is proportional to the overall eve population. If everyone mined, prices would drop to nothing. That's to be expected in an efficient and healthy economy. Now what would happen if everyone ran missions? The EvE NPC payment system would not correct: mission payments would remain constant. Now... we have a real problem. While I can definitely agree that "a more boring homogeneous game" sounds boring and lame, the economic implications of that would be totally devastating to the economy. To put it another way: The market decides how many miners it can support and at what pay-rates. The market is very unaccommodating if you disagree with it. You cannot start a threadnought in the forums and expect the market to feel sympathy because trit is going down in price as more people mine. CCP, conversely, decides how many mission runners the economy will support. The latter is definitely more sympathetic to threadnoughts than the former, but the former is more rational.

PvE professions simultaneously represent the only demographic negatively affected by inflation and to a large degree the only thing CCP can directly influence without wrecking the brutal and speedy efficiency of the present EvE economy. What they end up doing is anyone's guess... but as the EvE economy grows, it's probably something that is going to get tweaked a lot, and if any favoritism (or maybe that's not the right word - over-correction might be better) is given it will have negative knock-on effects to the economy as a whole. Also, any correction CCP makes to PvE elements will get corrected in fairly short order by the rest of the economy (putting PvEers and CCP right back where they started before the correction in relative terms). While the market can't correct PvE elements at present against itself, the market will correct itself relative to PvE activity.

It's a tough spot those PvE'ers are putting CCP in, for sure.

I don't know that there is an easy answer. Maybe if somehow mission payments were based on a global threat level and payment was proportional to pod response relative to the threat level... I mean that would still be a faucet but at least it would get things under control, and than CCP would only have to balance one element, the global threat level relative to player population, to get the PvE economy in-line with the global EvE market.

Fail

Damn.

I did not see that coming.

How many characters are doing those activities?

Next you will say that the majority of minerals comes from mining so you are going to boost the amount of minerals drones drop.

The numbers previously posted were that the incursion isk faucet = 23% of pre incursion isk faucets. How can you guys be surprised that there is inflation when you are adding that much more isk in the faucet?

Forcing everyone to do incursions by making every other way to make isk pale in comparison is not good for the game.