Player Features and Ideas Discussion

Exactly, people are suggesting things that would be on an entirely different ship. NOT marauders. The Vargur is alright, I think it could use a bit of PG though -_- I think it should get a TP bonus, also. Mainly because it needs a web/tp bonus like the other marauders, and TP being a Minmatar module... (rp wise).

I think combining the Golem and Paladin sounds like a good idea. I just don't know if CCP could keep it balanced, though (unless they nerf it).

It would probably also cause balance issues if the Kronos and Vargur got merged.

No and no. They would completely obsolete current Marauders (they're bordering on that edge already). And why would we want two ships instead of four? -_-

Give marauders 500 calibration

Just turn Maurauders from the ultimate carebear ships into the ultimate pew pew ships. I don't care how this is done, but that is what I want.

It's not just missions with E-war.. generally missions with spawns beyond 80-100 KM.. and there are a fair few of them. Golem just sucks here. No doubt that a golem is awesome on close combat. But for a fair ammount of mission, the golem is inferior to the CNR. 60KM dmg range is just.. erm, way to low without the ability to fit a AB/MWD without hurting the fit too much. ( 2TP's just sucks)

Yeah, screw that I edited this down.

The standard exp. radius of fury cruise missiles is 550m with a 58 m/sec exp velocity.
Javelin torps have a 450m exp radius with a 71m/sec exp velocity.
In the Golem, with the same general fit, you have higher dps with javelins than you do fury cruise.

Javelin's have better applied dps, not to mention higher dps, than fury cruise.

Another thing. When shooting at bs's, the difference between javelin and rage torps on target is a difference of 0-2 volleys, so really you don't even need to change ammo.

I Have good missile skills(close to 7 mil, or so), and without rigs, it still takes 2 target painters for me to have higher applied dps with fury cruise over precision against a bs.
However, if you're using precision against a bs, then it can take as much as 6 more volleys, and the same can be said if using fury against frigs or cruisers.

Target painters are also limited to having their most effective ranges under 90km. They have an optimal and falloff similar to turrets.
So, even though cruise missiles can hit the target at the golem's max targetting range, a torp golem can aggro them, wait for them to be within 60km, and probably be done with the room at the same time as the cruise Golem. Oh, and if you're salvaging with the golem, the targets are closer. If you're salvaging with a noctis, then you only gotta have the skill to lvl 3 with t2 tractor beams.
That's a lot better than having to slow boat to distant wrecks, or train a support ship skill to lvl 5 and still not be able to reach all your wrecks.
See, i'm not just thinking about range and dps, I'm also considering skills, fittings, and other misison factors, like salvaging.... Good times...



Dude, that's another reason to have the target painters. You can aggro those distant groups without having to get near them, or waisting a volley. Besides, even if you didn't have tp's you could just launch a torp at them. Even though it wouldn't hit them, it would still aggro them.

AS far as range to hit targets, as long as you have t2 range rigs, as well as missile bombardment and missile projection to lvl 5, then you'll be able to hit any ship at orbit range. The only time range becomes an issue is when you get one of those missions where a dumb@ss npc gets stuck on a structure...

well, I have used battleclinic calculator (http://eve.battleclinic.com/calculators.php#missile)

Javs against a target with 300 sig and 200 speed and 0 resistance.
1057 dmg with trauma javelin.

Fury-cruise against the same target:
1350 dmg with trauma fury.

(Disclaimer: I don't know how accurate this is. It looks like the calc is pretty old, cause theres no damage reduction factor (javs have the higher drf btw)..

Oh, and a second Rigor II instead of the Flare II should give you more dmg. (Haven't done the math on that one, too tired atm)

Yup, I do think that both, the CNR and the Golem are comparable. Golem completely owns short range missions while the CNR is stronger in long-range and jamming-missions, but for the highest specialized PvE-ship, this is still just lama.

Well, I don't care about E-war, but I do care about not beeing able to shoot targets because of range. Nothing sucks more then having targets up there out of range. There are a fair ammount of missions with targets beyond 60 km. I can't see why I should buy a ship which sucks at those missions. Marauders should be the top ships for missions. They are designed for doing them, but still, the golem does really suck at some missions. This makes no sense at all, and I will stick to my CNR unless I trained up to the vargur (which still takes ~2 months).

My CNR kills every mission with just T1 missiles. Sure, the 300 Million I've spend for the tank (C-type XL which is arround 500 mil now?) was notable, but with it, I have no problems in any mission whatsoever. I never need to switch ships. Why shall I use the golem? For 10% better performance in some missions, and more worse performance in some other missions? Seriously, thats a bad deal. I wouldn't call that a "top PvE ship".

I guess it depends on personal flavor, but for me, the golem is not worth it. It's no allround mission ship. That's why I consider it "crap".

To answer this question:


It's the explosion velocity. You can compensate with sig-radius to a certain degree (that's why you can hit BS for full dmg), but most small targets are just waaaaaaaaaaaaaay to fast for missiles. With the hilariously low explosion velocity on torps/CM's, velocity of the target is the major factor on dmg application. The absence of a dmg module for explosion-velocity is another factor. (IMHO, it's completely unfair and a major factor for all the Torp-jokes)