EVE General Discussion

Well, I have BC at 5, so I'm gonna be one of the benefactors. I still do not agree with giving "free" skill points.

I could take my skill points that I have invested and gladlly put them in Gallente or Amarr BC.

See, I am arguing on principle, not upon self entitlement. The "Fair" way of handling it is just resetting those skill points invested. It's like that for every other racial ship type. (See BS and Cruiser).

All the whiners will be back in their pretty spam Drakes in little to no time anyway, don't worry.

Either way, It's not going to effect me.

Yes, if you can fly all battlecruisers now with perfect skills and then CCP removes that ability because they screwed up years ago when they added the non-racial battlecruiser skill then you are being punished for CCP's mistake. It would be unfair of them to diminish my ability to fly ships I currently can because they want to correct something that wasn't my fault.

There is literally no downside to how they are planning on doing this.

Just keep your hands offa my stack...

…and yet, for newer players to get into Command Ships (the one thing in the game that actually requires BC V) will actually become easier with this change — a lot easier if they want all the CSes.

On the contrary, Racial Battlecruiser V will be the same rank as regular Battlecruiser V, meaning in order to be able to fly all battlecruisers you will need to invest 4 times more skillpoints.

I believe that since Battlecruisers and Destroyers are essentially bigger versions of Cruisers and Frigates respectively, it should not take as long to train as Cruiser and Frigates.

The best solution is to make Racial Battlecruisers a rank 2 skill and Racial destroyers a rank 1 skill. Make training all 4 racials to V take the same time and SP to get the original Battlecruiser or Destroyer to V.

That way everyone will benefit.

Those who train Battlecruiser or Destroyer will not be affected in any negative way and newer players will not have to invest more time and money to be able to fly all Racial Battlecruisers and Destroyers with their respective T2 counterparts than the older players did.

By your argument we should Racialize everything.

Lets have Amarr Heavy Assault Ships, Caldari Marauders, Gallente Interceptors.

Lets make newer players train more when they want to reach higher end of multiple ships.

We should all be glad that they are announcing this in advance. Now is the time to push your BC and Dessy to 5. Prepare for the day of change and you will not be left out.

If you want to really be prepared, push all your frig skills to 4 and all your cruiser skills to 4 and BC and Dessy to 4. That way you will be able to benefit like the rest of us who have already trained all our skills when they put in racial BC and Dessy. If you have extra time take BC or Dessy to 5.

No. Probably not — that's the exact thing they're trying to remove. More likely, to get command ships you will need Racial Battlecruiser V instead of Racial Cruiser V. See my break-down here of what the old and new systems will look like if they actually do what they say they're going to do.

They're cutting out a huge chunk of prereqs, and exchanging the hull prereqs to match the actual ship you intend to fly.
They already have that prerequisite.

Skills:
If you can fly a perfect hurricane today but have no Gallente skills then you will still be able to fly a myrmidon tomorrow. This is what they mean by nested requirements. The only ones that matter are the ones that have the least amount of indentation on the prereq page. These kind of paradoxes are already possible through being podded (for instance losing battleship 5 won't stop you from flying a carrier) as well as in the form of "dev ships" like the Polaris which requires itself at 5 to be trained.

What is fair:
Technically the most fair thing to do is to give back what was trained, 1:1. What is good business, however, is to give everyone the 4 skills to the same level they had the old skill. If you're going to force a change on customers, give them the one they benefit most from. Sure this change will favor people that had the skill trained higher, but it the alternative is removing something from the customer that they had before and giving them less. Prime examples are the ones in this thread that actually can use all 4 races' command ships. BC 5 is a rather lengthy skill and in the worst case scenario you'll have people getting kick out of ships that they were previously able to fly. If they reimburse the SP 1:1 then to avoid these cases they would have to allow people to allocate the SP into the new skill before logging in. Even then a lot of problems could be caused and you're going to have a mountain of petitions for ships that got blown up or stolen cause someone was forcefully ejected from it. Additionally you'll have people rage quiting over having their BC (which could be potentially the largest ship they own) taken from them because they no longer could fly it upon logging in.

Bottom line is, the alternative is unfair because it would remove things from the player that was not the result of game mechanics or otherwise part of normal gameplay. There really isn't a middle ground here so go with the one that gives players a net gain, not a loss. And besides, no one has anything to lose if they all get the racial BC skills to their current BC level.

I like that CCP are doing this. Destroyers and battlecruisers having one central skill for all of them would have made sense longer ago when there was just one ship in each category for each race. Now that both ships play a bigger role, especially battlecruisers, it makes sense to do away with these and introduce racial skills for each type of battlecruiser. Everyone that already has Destroyers and Battlecruisers trained will get the same level for all races' battlecruisers that they had, along with making it easier for newer players to get into other ships as previously mentioned, so I don't see any bad points to this change.