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Skillpoint and Monetary Inflation in Eve - a tl;dr by hired goon

Author
TheBlueMonkey
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#61 - 2012-03-05 12:19:23 UTC
the "stick" or "wow" approach isn't going to work with eve.
The fact that ancient players and day 1 players interect all the time, introducing "new ships" that massively out perform the older ships as something for older player to aim for will just make new players feel more removed from the situation.

Eve's always been a "why do we need this ship" rather than "this ship replaces that ship"

Also,
the "end game" in eve is geared towardsthe individual player finding what they wnat to do as end game.
Be that endlessly trawling level 4 missions
0.0 warfare
or forum games

That's entirely up to them (there's a leaning towards going to 0.0 and doing pvp though)

So, think of a better way to "stop eve dieing"
Although, I'd put it a different way, eve's evolving and it's evolving into something you don't like so maybe your time is done?

I can't say I'm keen on things like "renaming meta mods" or that kinda junk
Scien Inkunen
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#62 - 2012-03-05 13:17:07 UTC
Maybe CCP should remove sector ranking - no more HS, LS and null - make it open space and implement some restrictions to overcome total mess and keeping everybody more or less happy.

Read the "Fart file" and you will understand the meaning of life !

Kain De'Stroi
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#63 - 2012-03-05 13:41:34 UTC  |  Edited by: Kain De'Stroi
You raise valid points, and i wouldn't mind seeing the "stick" method implemented.
However i think CCP is going for the carrots.
They still got a big one they have held from us since the beginning.
And i wouldn't say that eve is dying just yet.
Opertone
State War Academy
Caldari State
#64 - 2012-03-05 13:53:38 UTC  |  Edited by: Opertone
Learn PVP!

It looks to me that the nature of complaint is "I powergame, I metagame, I want to be special, I want to be number one".

Everyone wants a perfect ship, everyone wants a 3 to 1 ratio for the free win, everybody wants to cheat with spies and infiltrate alliances for easy intel.

Stop making your life easier, this game is meant to be hardcore, you by your own hands turn it in 'cheater core'.

All wieners complain that 'they've beat da game', 'they own everybody', now they need to get off the cheat codes and all on one style.

Not difficult for you? You're trying to skip built in game challenge. Do not 'turn god mode on', learn to fit into the game, not bend the rules.

This post sums up why the 'best' work with DCM inc.

WARP DRIVE makes eve boring

really - add warping align time 300% on gun aggression and eve becomes great again

JitaPriceChecker2
Doomheim
#65 - 2012-03-05 14:37:22 UTC  |  Edited by: JitaPriceChecker2
Valei Khurelem wrote:
MeestaPenni wrote:
I think the single most damaging aspect of the current game is the ease with which wealth is accumulated. It used to hurt to get a battleship blown up.


It's only easy because you're a vet, try telling that to a noob who has to grind their ISK everytime they lose their ship.


Hello my favorite troll.

Dont fly what you cant afford to lose.
Few years ago that was the most of the basics rules.

Not everyone should be flying top tier ships.
Froterka
OmniBeton Metatech
#66 - 2012-03-05 14:56:32 UTC
I think EVE looks like the Earth would look like if, like, 200 years ago people stopped ageing, dying and forgeting anything
MeestaPenni
Mercantile and Stuff
#67 - 2012-03-05 15:03:20 UTC
Valei Khurelem wrote:
MeestaPenni wrote:
I think the single most damaging aspect of the current game is the ease with which wealth is accumulated. It used to hurt to get a battleship blown up.


It's only easy because you're a vet, try telling that to a noob who has to grind their ISK everytime they lose their ship.


The PLEX market is alive and thriving....drop 37.00 USD at Shattered Crystal, convert, and voila!! Instant wealth and new ships.

I am not Prencleeve Grothsmore.

Plyn
Uncharted.
#68 - 2012-03-05 16:16:02 UTC
Valei Khurelem wrote:
MeestaPenni wrote:
I think the single most damaging aspect of the current game is the ease with which wealth is accumulated. It used to hurt to get a battleship blown up.


It's only easy because you're a vet, try telling that to a noob who has to grind their ISK everytime they lose their ship.

Honestly, they only reason it is that hard for them is because no one has shown them how to do it.

Got a friend of mine started playing and he's been playing off PLEX he earned completely by himself since his second month. Would've probably been the first if I hadn't given him his first PLEX free (I got my 30 days time off it either way <3 buddy system).

He has quite a bit extra to spare, and we've been doing it all from nullsec, where the isk pours like waterfalls from the heavens... Crap, it falls like waterfalls EVERYWHERE except in lowsec. Noobs really need more truly experienced, non-ahole players to show them how to get started.
knobber Jobbler
State War Academy
Caldari State
#69 - 2012-03-05 16:56:25 UTC
Taiwanistan wrote:
too many dumb scrubs grinding only for their plexes, for no other goddamn reason, no goal in-game
to hell with it, nerf every isk faucet, if it ticks in your wallet paid by concord nerf it, if it did not come from transactions with other players nerf it
nerf it all, null sec anomalies, incursions, missions all of it nerf it by half
it's austerity time foos we's all greek now!




Make the special snowflakes special again. I'd buy into that.
Ira Infernus
Knights-of-Cydonia
#70 - 2012-03-05 17:59:37 UTC
OP - Butt hurt that the newbs you once knew are no longer the newbs you once knew?, and can now do well in a fight, and make just as much ISK as you do?...

You also seem to forget that people drop their accounts, which is accountable; there is a relatively steady flow of new subscriptions and eve IS growing. The skill dispersion is simply becoming more even, making the game fairier.

However, despite the problems in your arguement, you have a few decent points. Eve as a whole needs fixing. Rather than putting in new ships of the same class as existing ones to draw back a playerbase, CCP should be doing more to keep it interesting for their loyal and regular playerbase...





Wormhole space needs alot of change in order to make the game more interesting:
-Make them more stable, or limit the size of the ship inside the wormhole, otherwise they are far too easy to defend.
-Make them effectively infinite; introduce low grade w-space which generate randomly in a certain web ( alimit of 5 or 6 wormholes at a time perhaps), but if these w-systems are infinite, there is infinite space to exploit, and by making them harder to defend, would increase pvp around wormholes and by limiting ship types, hopefully encourage small scale pvp.

In general space, there needs to be alot of change too.
-delay local, this will make it safer to pvp solo.
-add the new eden promised land of "more space"... dont make this 0.0 but high value lowsec (0.1-0.3), no stations, etc... and add alot of it.



And yes, new ships and modules need to be added, IMO we need a set of T3 modules (eg, an armor rep; you can alter its pg, cpu, and cap requirements, dictate its cycle time or raw rep quanitity, etc etc), T3 frigs, T3 battleships, etc etc.

Certain systems need to be added too, ccp is fixing FW apparently, why dont they fix bounty hunting? - add bounty hunter agents to aid the location and murder of the wanted.

More missions should be added, they are far too easy, and have been mapped out completely. Take this away totally, and make them semi random. Also, put them across multiple systems. IMO I would much rather run a mission which takes 6+ hours of total deadspace time, over 5 or 6 systems to uncover a plot, escort an NPC convoy, etc etc.
Tekashi Kovacs
Golfclap Inc
#71 - 2012-03-05 19:46:09 UTC
Just another nerf lvl4's thread.... Such creativity.
Nuela
WoT Misfits
#72 - 2012-03-05 19:46:59 UTC
I once brought up the idea of 'resetting' Eve on Alliance TS and was shocked at the extreme reaction it received. I don't see why it should be so but it is there so it is real.

By 'resetting' I meant setting up a new server and running another shard of Eve. People could join which they chose but if you started on the new shard you had to start a new toon and no transfering of funds/resources.

I know I'd have a toon on the new server ASAP!

The main objections seem to be that

- new people would join the new server (DUH!) and so the older server would stagnate.

- Because new people would tend to join the new server, older toons would lose their relative power.

- Old established powers-that-be would lose thier monopoly/advantage over new people coming in.

Personally, I think places need a good housecleaning now and then otherwise they get crowded and stinky. Lol
Zimmy Zeta
Perkone
Caldari State
#73 - 2012-03-05 20:48:58 UTC
Wasn't WIS supposed to be the endgame? Spend billions on NeX clothes when you already have all the ships and don't know where to spend your money anymore?

But you guys just had to shoot that monument in Jita....and now you are complaining......

(shrugs)

I'd like to apologize for the poor quality of the post above and sincerely hope you didn't waste your time reading it. Yes, I do feel bad about it.

Ocih
Space Mermaids
#74 - 2012-03-05 20:56:57 UTC
Zimmy Zeta wrote:
Wasn't WIS supposed to be the endgame? Spend billions on NeX clothes when you already have all the ships and don't know where to spend your money anymore?

But you guys just had to shoot that monument in Jita....and now you are complaining......

(shrugs)


2000 people shot a monument and CCP rolled over like a cheap trick. How's that for force projection?

I don't buy it, have said before the reason they lost subs was the Anom nerf and the reason they downsized was RL debt restructuring but the truth doesn't make for good GD trolling.
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#75 - 2012-03-05 21:01:38 UTC
Zimmy Zeta wrote:
Wasn't WIS supposed to be the endgame?
No.

Largely because there is no endgame, but more specifically because WiS was supposed to be a universal add-on for a different kind of game interaction.
Andrea Griffin
#76 - 2012-03-05 21:03:47 UTC
I had a brief stint with the game Mortal Online, and they have an interesting skill point system. Much like Eve, anyone can train anything at all; it just takes time. However, there's a skill point cap - once you reach that cap, you can't train any more skills until you untrain another.

I wonder what the consequence would be if such a system were implemented in Eve; perhaps one might be able to fly all the ships of one race very well, or would be limited to two races up to cruisers, or something silly. A character able to fly a pirate battleship, under this system, would have to be far more rare.

I don't know if it would be a good idea or not, but it is an interesting one.
Tyberius Franklin
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#77 - 2012-03-05 22:33:20 UTC
JitaPriceChecker2 wrote:
Valei Khurelem wrote:
MeestaPenni wrote:
I think the single most damaging aspect of the current game is the ease with which wealth is accumulated. It used to hurt to get a battleship blown up.


It's only easy because you're a vet, try telling that to a noob who has to grind their ISK everytime they lose their ship.


Hello my favorite troll.

Dont fly what you cant afford to lose.
Few years ago that was the most of the basics rules.

Not everyone should be flying top tier ships.

Ships that are destroyed need replaced, regardless of tier. Every loss is a hit that takes some measure of time and effort to recoup. Having the isk already available doesn't change the time it took to make it or the time it will take to replace it. which varies from player to player.
Scatim Helicon
State War Academy
Caldari State
#78 - 2012-03-05 22:54:24 UTC
hired goon for CSM8

Every time you post a WiS thread, Hilmar strangles a kitten.

Josef Djugashvilis
#79 - 2012-03-05 23:24:26 UTC
I could buy a highly skilled character...and learn how to use the skills a lot more quickly than I could train for them.
This not good for Eve.

I could buy plex, sell for isk, have pots of isk.
Then why bother running missions, industry, joining an 0.0 crew, or any other isk making venture?
This is not good for Eve.

This is not a signature.

Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#80 - 2012-03-05 23:28:39 UTC
Josef Djugashvilis wrote:
I could buy a highly skilled character...and learn how to use the skills a lot more quickly than I could train for them.
This not good for Eve.
Why not?

Quote:
I could buy plex, sell for isk, have pots of isk.
Then why bother running missions, industry, joining an 0.0 crew, or any other isk making venture?
This is not good for Eve.
Actually, it's quite good for EVE — it means the money is being used (and slowly siphoned off) while you do your thing, without you adding to the pile.