EVE General Discussion

Wow, its a pretty sad that modern eve cant see an obvious troll like that.


Not long ago that a GM response like that would have looked like a troll. I for one welcome our new WOW-in-space overlords.

Having never played WoW, I don't know what you're talking about. But it seems to me quite reasonable that a portion of the sandbox should be an opt-in only combat zone - for noob training while they get the hang of the game, or for people who just don't like PvP. I mean, wasn't that the whole point behind system security levels and Concord in the first place? The only real problem is people who want to PvP where they are not supposed to, or with people they are not supposed to, or both.

I for one would be happy with removing concord and security levels entirely and turning all of EVE into one giant arena fractured into different NBSI spaces. But of course the high sec war dec people would never want that - perish the thought of involuntary PvP happening to THEM!

EVE is never safe and we stand by that. I am not a game designer, so I have no true say in this, but I can honestly say that I do not think we will ever allow people to opt out of non-consensual danger and PVP. HOWEVER, it cannot be denied that the wardec system as it currently exists is a tool that is very often used for behavior that I, personally, would call griefing. Attacking a small, easy target for minimal cost is something for a small time criminal, not a PVP stud. Which means, in my personal opinion (in other words, this is not CCP gospel, nor a game design dogma), that paying cheap to gain an easy, semi-defenseless target should be able to be countered by equally cheap measures. EVE is harsh and often unfair, but that does not mean we cannot have some semblance of balance. When there is no balance to be had, the weight should fall in favor of the people wanting a good time. Besides, you can still suicide gank your target if you truly want that target dead. It is not like they are truly safe.

Where you go off-track is that you think there's an 'opt-in only combat zone'. That doesnt' exist in EVE. There are a few areas where combat is genuinely impossible (docked, CQ, within a shielded POS until after it is reinforced), and everywhere else, combat is a real possibility you must be at least a little prepared for.

High-sec is just that, high - not perfect - security. The point between the security levels is to provide places where it is *mostly* safe to ignore other players, to not be as ready for combat, to fly that super-shiny ship and probably get to keep it long term. This is a balance which many players are okay with.

Suicide ganking, wardecs, canflipping, ninja'ing - these all actually improve the depth of the game, provide interesting things to think about, and make high-sec less bland. I say this as a person who has only ever been on the recieving end of all of these mechanics.

The wardec mechanics need to be changed to increase risk significantly on the attacker's side - also, the mechanics (not the rules) need to be changed to mitigate the dec-shield tactics. What needs to be possible is that the attacker deeply regrets picking a war with 'these guys', because they either had more pilots, more skill, or simply more friends than the attackers could handle. When the attacker can suffer at the hands of an excellent defender as much as a defender suffers at the hands of an excellent attacker, then the mechanics are good.

I would argue if a corp cannot defend itself it (though 3rd party mercs or internally) it should not exist, its not like its 100man corps that are deccing these carebears, its probably about 5 people who want easy ganks because these people are so profit hungry they wont bother with any kind of protection.

Its your duty in eve to make it not worth the effort of others to disrupt what you want to do.


Except even that isn't true.


Its your duty in eve to make deccing your corp ever so slightly less appealing than the corp of the hulk next to you.

I have no sympathy for carebears who wish to opt out of PvP entirely, but I also have no sympathy for risk-averse gankbears who absolutely abhor the thought of losing a ship. You know, the types that hunt wartargets while they are in Aliastra or whatever only to accept their own applications with director alts before ganking their ~prey~ or whatever.

Oh, and now that you can drop from your corp while in space, it's even more broken than it used to be.

Tell me how to suicide gank an highsec POS, please.

The target that was being talked about was a player not a structure. But of course you know that already.

Why not just war-dec the corp the structure belongs to.

The problem with that argument is that a corporation will not declare war on another corporation that can defend itself. If they wanted that sort of fight, they would go to lower security space.

A new corporation that is still in the process of recruiting and training pilots in high-sec, will not be able to take on a 5 man gang of strategic cruisers. If this sort of corporation gets a declaration of war, their only option is to play it safe, dock up, or log out. If that happens, chances are that pilots will leave the corporation, further weakening the corporation as a whole.

The only way to fix this is to make it not worth the effort of the corporation declaring war. This could be done by increasing the fee to declare war, but I'm sure any dedicated griefers will pay even 500mil if it meant a possible massacre of defenseless pilots.

- - -

Now, this is a far out there solution, but it could work: a corporate classification system. A way of examining the assets of the corporation, the age of it's pilots, and the skills those pilots possess to assign the corporation a letter that signifies how capable they are.

For example:
- Corporation A consists of ten 2-month old pilots that can fly a mining barge, making them a Class "C" corporation.
- Corporation B consists of five, 2-year old pilots that could fly Strategic Cruisers, making them a Class "A" corporation.

As such, Corporation B would not be able to declare war on Corporation A, as they are two classes above them; however, if Corporation A was to anchor a POS in a high-sec system, they would automatically become a Class "B" corporation, and would be vulnerable to a war from Corporation B.

There would need to be a complex system of rules for what puts a corporation under a certain class, and safeguards to prevent a corporation from dummying up/down their class to wage war or to avoid it, but I think it would be a workable solution.

i lol'd. Do you even know what this thread is about?

The problem is that some corps flood the markets with ISK so they might change the economy and affecting every players experience risk-free. They often have a huge impact on the market but they are also "safe" at the same time. Their POS's can't be killed and their barges can only be killed by suiciding yourself. There should be Risk / Reward in eve but atm this game favours reward over risk.

And btw. imho "Industrial-Only" Corps that cant defend themselfs shouldnt exist in a "PVP" game at all. Look for another game or learn to defend yourself. Dont make the game easier for this guys.