EVE New Citizens Q&A

I understand your motives, but you told before you don't want to be shouted at by an FC. Yet you want to join a WH-corp eventually (yes I read forums a lot) without any fleet training, this will likely end up in FCs yelling at you. IMO better to try a corp out in high-sec that does PvP roams into low or nullsec and get the hang of how fleet stuff work.

And usually (unless someone is actually planning on a big heist) most POC members are quite trustworthy, if not they would have been kicked out already. And P&C is filled with bad stories, true. But if you open up a forum part for all nice guys that hang around player corps, it will overload the forum server in just 1 day I guess as the majority are actually good guys, and you never read about the good guys on the forums

This is probably one of the biggest ways to attract quality members. Spamming recruitment channel is begging for corp hoppers (they're just annoying), while being visible and freely offering advice and mentoring to new players who are genuinely interested is an investment in their future and an investment in yours. I cannot tell you how many good people I've flown with in my corporation over the years simply because I talked to the person after they were killed, or had a lively discussion with them in local chat. I have often given pointers to people who got killed (I am a mercenary and a pirate after all) as well as some isk to counteract their loss when they are plainly new to the game.

Simply being a generally active, helpful, and pleasant individual brings more people to you than any amount of channel spamming does, regardless of if you're a market tycoon or an "ebil" pirate.

Also, I haven't been new for many years, back before there was really a tutorial so I have long forgotten what it is like. Additionally, I just want to note that the animosity toward NPC corp players only comes from the people who are in the corp for years and years and do nothing but farming missions. Often, they are suspected of botting whether confirmed or not. It doesn't have to do with the new players, it has to do with the old players that do everything they can to avoid the war deccing mechanic. Which, incidentally, leads to them being suicide ganked.

As you say there is a process to recruiting and keeping newbies. It's not enough for a corp to put all its effort into advertising, hooking and reeling in a newbie and not look at their "aftersales care" (yeah I know, mixed metaphors =D).

It's often the case that the patient "people person" becomes the corp's recruiter, but they're out looking for a new catch by the time a newbie has joined and may not be able to put the time into looking after the newbie who's been caught.

I like that this comes back to the mentoring idea, or knowing at least one person in the corp who will take the time to explain the slang and details on a quiet channel. It might even be enough for the corp to advertise internally the "key" people who do a specific activity as goto people when you've got a question. Feeling completely lost in a new group is natural afterall.



I suppose another thing is keeping to what you've advertised. From what you've said in your "story"; your experienced after joining that corp and what you thought you were going to get where quite different.

Another reason to not advertise that your corp does everything if it doesn't I guess.

A lot of this is about not wasting the time that has been spent on getting newbies attention in the first place.





Since we've touched on it, the FC thing is a little different from recruiting newbies in general. I've had the honour of flying with some really good pilots and FCs, but even then it's not been unknown for a FC to lose it and shout at or be short with someone in the heat of battle. It can be a stressful job herding cats leading a fleet.

Having said that, there are some basics that a newbie should be familiar with before being dropped into a fleet of more experienced pilots. Covering off how to move around with a fleet, how to follow instructions and how to perform a given role in a specific "training fleet" should probably be included in the "aftersales" part if the corp is active in PVP.

edit: uncommon -> unknown, wrong emphasis... meant "even with good people, it can happen"

Organisation. There are a lot of EVE players that would gladly play a role of corporation training instructor and devote their playtime only (or mostly) to that. Recruiter scouts new members and don't have to keep an eye on them after recruitment. It's another persons job from now on. Training instructor teaches new members, shows them all ropes and decides when (if) anyone is ready to join "the higher ranks".


This may not be applicable to EVE, but I come from a military family and I was told that commander should never yell during a battle (when communication system allows that). If he does, it means he can't keep his nerves short, cannot adapt to new situations, is not prepared for things going bad and is focusing on scolding instead of battlefield and fixing whatever gone wrong. Scolding takes place after the battle and only subcommander responsible for the mess is yelled at, never in front of his subordinates. Then it goes down all the way to the soldier in fault (if he's still alive) and cleaning toilets with a tooth brush. Main commander is the voice of reason on the battlefield and his calm benefits to the morale of all soldiers. But, it may be different in EVE fleets. Just an off topic though.

Really? Estel Arador is one of the more famous ones? I thought that was the only corp that provided such a great service for free. It's probably also one of the only corps that anyone will ignore when looking at employment history for rookies. There's nothing wrong with having been in Estel Arador for 2 hours before leaving. That's just standard procedure for that corp. And if they already have their JCs set up, that's just an added benefit with new recruits.

First, as you and Xerces said, having someone in charge of the recruitment isn't enough, I think the mentoring idea is the key point and indeed should be advertised in the corp, but Eve being an online worldwide game, timezone matters too.

Now for the "risks", freedom? joining a corp often comes with some rules and a minimal level of commitment that some players might see like a drawback while they're in their cozy living room looking for a quick and easy entertainment.

Or, there's a certain amount of PvE in Eve and some people just find their lot of casual gaming with it. They work fulltime and don't want to find the same scheme at home while logged in Eve, with "bosses" giving directions/orders, etc.

FeralShadow mentionned the players staying years in NPC corps to avoid wardecs. With all I've read all over the forums or on the web, Eve seems to be the only game where so many players want to force pvp onto others, with a surprising rage sometimes. I lack the background and knowledge of Eve to understand the reason, but it seems odd, might be worth a seperate thread though, I'm curious about that.
But let's return to the topic.

After my first corp experiment, I took some time to read a bit and this is how it looks to me.
Eve has a steep learning curve and a terrible UI. Given a few days, that alone filters a fair amount of players I think. It takes some days to find your marks just with the interface, getting used to the shortcuts getting around various very basic mechanisms.

Then there is the "what to do? how to gain more ISK" at the sight of all the the shinies flying around you. As I mentionned in the NPE improvement thread, the tutorials do provide a little understanding of the game, but they nontheless guide new players in the PvE side of the game. Let's be fair though, when you start with Eve for the first time, after the tutorials, with a wallet nearing 6-8 mil, no wonder many players look back at the tutorials and go missioning or mining to make ISK, they don't know better yet and with all the guys screaming "Noooo!!! don't go in lowsec/nullsec/w-space, yer gonna be podded!!!" at them, well... many stick to highsec PvE and within a few weeks, it's not unusual to cross a gankers path, or fall for a scam, so a certain amount of new players can indeed lose everything they gathered from the begining quite easily, like their very first BS they rush-trained and lol-fitted, or their fresh from the factory hulk to make a small income to fund a few peeks in lowsec to pvp.
Until then, perhaps they simply figured they didn't need to join a corp, they could gather some mods from NPC, buy skillbooks with rats' bounties and mission rewards, they get PvE fitting tips from mission runners in their NPC corps...

In the NPC corp chat, when someone asks about joining a corp, the usual line of answers is "you're in a corp already, but if you want to join a POC, go check the recruitment channel". This comes out 9 times out of 10 guaranteed.

So on one hand, there's corp application 101 guides here and there, saying:
Don't join a corp to only to join a corp, take your time, lookup their website, check their requirements, gather informations, hang in their public channel, ask for facilities like jump clones/labs/ship replacement/etc.
Along with lines like:
Don't corp-jump, take the time to skill a little bit to have something to bring along and find a role, etc.

Everything in Eve suggests a lengthy involvement, from skill training to manufacturing times, from the game's complexity in itself to the complex interface needed to provide the means of achieving all the game can offer. And numerous are the occasions where a new player can fall in a "trap" that the very nature of the game encourages and some players abuse.

Besides, caution is advertised everywhere, thus giving new players a cautious approach I suppose.

I don't know if it gives some leads, but it's part of what I see in the Eve universe. I still love this game though :-)

1 On the freedom part:

There are (again) thousends of corps that let you do what you want, whenever you want. They only are there for a sense of community, so if you need help you can get it, if people ask for help you can give it.

All my previous corps were / are laidback and never order people around.

2 I agree that EVE is daunting and UI isn't the best of all games available, but POC can actually help you.

3. New players seeing shinies fly around should have guidance on how to fly them and what to do and not to do with them.

4. Also, people saying never go null/low, are the guys that are only playing for more ISK everyday

Your part on how to properly go into a POC of your choice is very very good and grounded.

I think the "what does he want from me" feeling from newbies could stem from their thoughts that what could they (the newbie) possibly offer this corporation (seen as some entity that has it all).

In my corp there is actually a pilot, although not very new, that isn't addicted to Internet Spaceships. He comes online every now and then, last time I took him with me on lvl 4 missions to give him some better income and standings so he could do his own level 2's and 3's.

Comms were quite funny, as he was amazed by the bounties and more about how good the loot was (for reference, it was loot that was worth 100k ISK and which I didn't even bothered to get the Noctis out). So being in a corp as a new player benefits you, you can have help with stuff (both just plain simple questions as well as being invited into fleets that make you learn stuff) but in the same while there will be people in corp who like to help new players out and also who like the satifaction to see that new players learned new stuff and liked it.

L'ouris has it exactly right. Enthusiasm is a valuable commodity in a game where other players provide all of the available content. A rookie in EVE has much more to offer a player organization than a rookie in another MMO that has lots of developer-seeded solo content.

How to attract rookies? Give them unconditional free stuff and advice before they've even joined. This is psychologically far more effective than promising rewards conditional on them joining you. The kind of gift that makes a rookie happy is peanuts to a player corp so you can afford to hand out stuff to people who might not even join.