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A note to CCP from a returning player who quit during Incarna-gate

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Shu Jia
Mineski Infinity
Pandemic Horde
#61 - 2012-02-27 03:24:45 UTC
I just attracted to eve again because of WIS.. i being punk by CCP
Mara Rinn
Cosmic Goo Convertor
#62 - 2012-02-27 10:50:32 UTC
Revajin wrote:
It would be like walking into a Publix, standing on a crate and announcing loudly to everyone that you hadn't shopped there in 6 months because they stopped carrying Zebracakes (truly a valid reason) but had now returned because they had put them back on the shelf. Not only are your personal consumer preferences largely irrelevant to the community as a whole but the very notion of ceasing to use a product/service for not meeting your personal standards is so universally understood that to announce it is unnecessary and just seems like a grab for attention.


In this case, the personal preferences are important to the community at a whole, since there is one group of players who don't want WiS, and another who do. This returning player is announcing that they left due to a ****-poor attempt at WiS which cost far too much developer attention, and they are returning with hope that WiS will be iterated on in the near future.

Is it a grab for attention? Of course! This thread is about people who quit the game (or cancelled recurring subscription) due to the questionable direction the company was taking (focussed so heavily on "awesome" that nothing "real" got delivered), but who were looking forward to Ambulation from the time it was first being tossed around as an idea.

So the "I'm back playing" message here is both to CCP and to the rest of the players. The reason it looks like an attention-grab is because it is an attention-grab, to spur discussion about mis-implemented features that caused players to give up on CCP, and the attempts that CCP has been making to lift their game.

Day 0 Advice for New Players
Miss Whippy
Native Freshfood
Minmatar Republic
#63 - 2012-02-27 11:19:39 UTC
Agree with OP. I wrote a similar message on the forum when I came back. Although I left a lot sooner. I saw things going badly wrong when PI came out, PI is such a shameful waste of potential. I knew back then that CCP had stopped caring.

I am back because of crucible, but I am not back for good. As someone else very rightly pointed out, many of us learnt that we can take of leave EvE. It won't be nearly as hard for me to leave next time. Crucible is what brought me back, but we still have a LONG WAY TO GO in terms of fixing the millions of small and large problems EvE. I don't particularly care for new content, I just want to see the whole content made much better.

Oh and the Soon(TM) list grows ever larger - still waiting on that slideble bar for Directional Scanner range that was promised in some Dev blog eons ago.

Things I particularly agree with include the removal of NEX and Aurum, for exactly the reasons most people have already stated.

I would also personally like to see a SERIOUS OVERHAUL of the UI. To:

1. End the click-fest.
2. End the multiple windows to perform ONE TASK fest.
3. Make it consistent throughout the different areas.
4. Make it scalelable so that future expansions don't have even more different styled menus.
5. Make it simplified.

[URL="https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=82348"]UI Iteration isn't enough, we need to start from scratch[/URL]
Signal11th
#64 - 2012-02-27 12:06:02 UTC
As expected:

you rage quit,
Nobody really cared:
CCP paid some lip service (not much, couple of apologies pretty much like any politican when he gets caught with his/her fingers in the cookie jar)
You got bored saw this as some pretense to come back.
And now like the rest of us realise feck all has changed and we are all doing the same stuff we did when the "Incarna Gate" rubbish came out.


God Said "Come Forth and receive eternal life!" I came fifth and won a toaster!
Vertisce Soritenshi
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#65 - 2012-02-27 13:54:13 UTC
I ain't a whiny little ***** that would quit playing the game over such little things as the OP but I would leave EvE if something better came along or I simply could not make the time for the game. Thats about the only few things that would make me leave. Otherwise I still laugh at whiny little bitches who think they are still relavant 8 months later because they "came back".

Bounties for all! https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=2279821#post2279821
March rabbit
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#66 - 2012-02-27 14:51:21 UTC
to OP: didn't even noticed you were away.

And no. Eve was f..ng playable last year. Maybe because of your absence? Shocked

The Mittani: "the inappropriate drunked joke"
Krixtal Icefluxor
INLAND EMPIRE Galactic
#67 - 2012-02-27 15:00:34 UTC  |  Edited by: Krixtal Icefluxor
Shepherd Steelringer wrote:
LOW SEC needs love!

I just want to go to low and pew pew lose some ships wtf'ever but gate guns, sec status, kill rights make every trip to low sec basically a career choice rather than just a fun time to watch pretty explosions.

The amount of times I have taken a small gang to low, found a target on the gate, we both want to fight but neither wants to fire the first shoot due to game mechanics >< Why you stop us from pew pew pew pew CCP? Why?



There's a Place.

It's called Null.

HTFU.

"He has mounted his hind-legs, and blown crass vapidities through the bowel of his neck."  - Ambrose Bierce on Oscar Wilde's Lecture in San Francisco 1882
Steve Ronuken
Fuzzwork Enterprises
Vote Steve Ronuken for CSM
#68 - 2012-02-27 15:50:30 UTC  |  Edited by: Steve Ronuken
FilterDecay wrote:
The canon of the back story is we are all sitting hairless in some goo with spikes in our spines.


I didn't get that feeling from the published fiction. The capsuleers are often out of their pods. And no suggestion of hairlessness.

Woo! CSM XI!

Fuzzwork Enterprises

Twitter: @fuzzysteve on Twitter
FloppieTheBanjoClown
Arcana Imperii Ltd.
#69 - 2012-02-27 16:48:46 UTC
Kale Kold wrote:
Nex Store! This stuff should be craftable from clothing patterns (like blueprints).
...
Get rid of Aurum, mt doesn't fit EVE.

I disagree. I don't have a problem with the NeX or CCP using MT to sell vanity items. It will only appeal to a certain segment of players and so long as gameplay is not impacted, I'm perfectly comfortable with them making extra money off people who like shiny useless stuff.

And no, I didn't consume any PLEX to get my monocle.

Founding member of the Belligerent Undesirables movement.
Turelus
Utassi Security
The Curatores Veritatis Auxiliary
#70 - 2012-02-27 18:42:53 UTC
Elanor Vega wrote:

So... once and for all...
You did not quit EVE because of WiS?
You quit EVE because there was no WiS and there was "golden ammo" buying problem and there was no real EVE expansions?
And you still want WiS?

I ask because few ppl wants to spread around that ppl left because of avatars and walking in stations.


I didn't quit over WiS, I was actually really excited about it! I was even excited about buying the military looking clothes for my character. Then I saw how much CCP thought a "Micro-Transaction" should be.

Pretty much the huge Nexus store prices, the email from Hilmer and the general lack of any real fixes in the game are what made me leave.
Also when bug fixes from the last patch/expansion (NPC ECM) are listed under the "new features" section.

Turelus CEO Utassi Security
Jita Alt666
#71 - 2012-02-27 19:41:21 UTC
Good Post OP. Agree completely.
Reaver Glitterstim
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#72 - 2012-02-28 02:21:27 UTC
Kale Kold wrote:

Things we'll be watching

  1. Don't dumb EVE down to drag more players in.
  2. Get rid of Aurum, mt doesn't fit EVE.
  3. Please continue with Incarna.
  4. Lowsec needs some love!



Item 1 and item 3 are mutually exclusive.

I am in support of Incarna, but not at the cost of internet spaceships. As much as I want it, I'll wait forever for it if that's what it takes. Crucible went in the right direction absolutely, and I wouldn't be against a Crucible II for the next expansion. WiS is cool but it is NOT a priority.

FT Diomedes: "Reaver, sometimes I wonder what you are thinking when you sit down to post."

Frostys Virpio: "We have to give it to him that he does put more effort than the vast majority in his idea but damn does it sometime come out of nowhere."
Sloppy Podfarts
Hedion University
Amarr Empire
#73 - 2012-02-28 03:13:53 UTC  |  Edited by: Sloppy Podfarts
Alrione wrote:

I personally feel "micro"-transactions have no place in the p2p game, EVEN if they are only cosmetic.



This is what has to be accepted and moved beyond. Digital business is changing. As long the items are just fluff, ignore them and game on.
Kale Kold
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#74 - 2012-02-28 14:00:51 UTC
Sloppy Podfarts wrote:
This is what has to be accepted and moved beyond. Digital business is changing. As long the items are just fluff, ignore them and game on.

No, it's not changing, rather than players of other games are putting up with it and giving in. Attention

EVE is one of the only MMO's that has grown year on year using the subscription model, then as soon as they added mt, they lost a lot of players and ultimately 200 staff.

Your arguments are invalid as this 'change' damaged EVE.

We have made CCP hear our voice and to recognise going down the mt route is a disaster waiting to happen. I truly believe that had we not acted, pay-to-win would of been implemented. Through the protests we have made Hilmar see sense.

To be honest CCP have been extremely lucky to have a hard core of players, MMO's rarely get second chances, see UO, AoC, SWG and DAoC, etc..

“Some people call me insane for the destruction I’ve caused, ...I believe I was just doing my duty!” -- Testimony submitted to Caldari Navy war crimes tribunal.
Bischopt
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#75 - 2012-02-28 14:11:54 UTC
Kale Kold wrote:
I've just re-subbed again after a few months break after quitting during the Incarna scandal. There are a few points that i want to make to CCP regarding why i, and many of my friends left, and why we are now back.

Why we left

  1. We are not your 'golden goose', take us for granted at your peril.
  2. You were obviously not working on EVE due to the poor expansions.
  3. Nex Store! This stuff should be craftable from clothing patterns (like blueprints).
  4. You showed Incana working in 2008, look at what we got in 2011! Don't lie to use with mock-ups.


Why we returned

  1. You are working on EVE again, simple as that.


Things we'll be watching

  1. Don't dumb EVE down to drag more players in.
  2. Get rid of Aurum, mt doesn't fit EVE.
  3. Please continue with Incarna.
  4. Lowsec needs some love!


I think the protests were for the best but its a shame that 200 people had to lose their jobs because of an arrogant CEO. Cry

Keep up the momentum on EVE and i look forward to the war themed expansion, Inferno in the summer. Pirate


YES.

welcome back.
Red Teufel
Calamitous-Intent
#76 - 2012-02-28 14:49:10 UTC
thanks CCP for saving EvE

lowsec needs love, lots of love. also great wildlands too needs a bit of love ;)
Ranger 1
Ranger Corp
Vae. Victis.
#77 - 2012-03-01 01:38:37 UTC
Kale Kold wrote:
Sloppy Podfarts wrote:
This is what has to be accepted and moved beyond. Digital business is changing. As long the items are just fluff, ignore them and game on.

No, it's not changing, rather than players of other games are putting up with it and giving in. Attention

EVE is one of the only MMO's that has grown year on year using the subscription model, then as soon as they added mt, they lost a lot of players and ultimately 200 staff.

Your arguments are invalid as this 'change' damaged EVE.

We have made CCP hear our voice and to recognise going down the mt route is a disaster waiting to happen. I truly believe that had we not acted, pay-to-win would of been implemented. Through the protests we have made Hilmar see sense.

To be honest CCP have been extremely lucky to have a hard core of players, MMO's rarely get second chances, see UO, AoC, SWG and DAoC, etc..


The implementation of a limited form of MT had very, very little to do with any significant number of people leaving the game.

Because...

Most people understand the concept of "If I don't want it, I don't buy it".

Most people understand that MT has been a part of EVE since PLEX were introduced.

Most people understand that you don't have to spend a penny to obtain any item offered in the NEX.

Poor choices made about what to offer, charge, and lack of player involvement in the item creation process contributed to some of the people leaving.

Many left simply because they were either whipped into a frenzy by our local forum trolls, or genuinely thought that their protest would prompt CCP to reassess their Developer resources in a more equitable fashion.

To say that most left because of the introduction of the NEX is flatly untrue.

View the latest EVE Online developments and other game related news and gameplay by visiting Ranger 1 Presents: Virtual Realms.
Sasha Azala
Doomheim
#78 - 2012-03-01 02:34:18 UTC  |  Edited by: Sasha Azala
Ranger 1 wrote:
The implementation of a limited form of MT had very, very little to do with any significant number of people leaving the game.

Because...

Most people understand the concept of "If I don't want it, I don't buy it".

Most people understand that MT has been a part of EVE since PLEX were introduced.

Most people understand that you don't have to spend a penny to obtain any item offered in the NEX.

Poor choices made about what to offer, charge, and lack of player involvement in the item creation process contributed to some of the people leaving.

Many left simply because they were either whipped into a frenzy by our local forum trolls, or genuinely thought that their protest would prompt CCP to reassess their Developer resources in a more equitable fashion.

To say that most left because of the introduction of the NEX is flatly untrue.



The reasons I left at that time were:

1. They would not answer the question would P2W items be sold through NeX.

2. The fact they were neglecting EVE in favour of trying to finish the other two projects.

3. The disgraceful way in which CCP handled the whole affair.



The reasons I came back:

1. They are now actually putting effort back into EVE.

2. They seem to have woken up to the fact customers do matter (or at least I'm willing to give them the benefit of any doubt in regard to this).

3. There's no other MMOs around at the moment that I have any interest in.
Adacia Calla
Native Freshfood
Minmatar Republic
#79 - 2012-03-01 03:46:09 UTC
Kale Kold wrote:
I've just re-subbed again after a few months break after quitting during the Incarna scandal. There are a few points that i want to make to CCP regarding why i, and many of my friends left, and why we are now back.

Why we left

  1. We are not your 'golden goose', take us for granted at your peril.
  2. You were obviously not working on EVE due to the poor expansions.
  3. Nex Store! This stuff should be craftable from clothing patterns (like blueprints).
  4. You showed Incana working in 2008, look at what we got in 2011! Don't lie to use with mock-ups.


Why we returned

  1. You are working on EVE again, simple as that.


Things we'll be watching

  1. Don't dumb EVE down to drag more players in.
  2. Get rid of Aurum, mt doesn't fit EVE.
  3. Please continue with Incarna.
  4. Lowsec needs some love!


I think the protests were for the best but its a shame that 200 people had to lose their jobs because of an arrogant CEO. Cry

Keep up the momentum on EVE and i look forward to the war themed expansion, Inferno in the summer. Pirate

This is pretty much me today.

Test signature....forum not applying settings :(
Flag Bravo
#80 - 2012-03-01 06:05:17 UTC
I left Eve with the intention of staying left because...

CCP were treating their paying customers like toilet paper.
Eve's development was going nowhere interesting. In fact, the path that it was going down was a complete load of cobblers.
They were introducing stuff into the game that required real money to buy.

I have come back because...
CCP are now treating us more like valued customers.
Eve's development seems to have taken a turn for the better.

I still don't like...
Having stuff in the game, except for plex of course, that requires real money to buy. Everything in Eve should be accessible to the not-so-well-off, as well as those with fat bank accounts.

It is good to see Eve becoming popular again, I just hope that CCP have learned from their disastrous mistakes.