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One EVE, One Vote, One Chairman: Why You Should Vote For The Mittani For CSM

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Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe
#261 - 2012-02-21 23:38:28 UTC
Andski wrote:
Alavaria Fera wrote:
But yes, it would seem Hans is metagaming it.

that bastard

Don't give in to the uh, highseccy carebearies?

Triggered by: Wars of Sovless Agression, Bending the Knee, Twisting the Knife, Eating Sov Wheaties, Bombless Bombers, Fizzlesov, Interceptor Fleets, Running Away, GhostTime Vuln, Renters, Bombs, Bubbles ?
Reilly Duvolle
Hydra Squadron
#262 - 2012-02-22 00:19:26 UTC
So for the tech issue, we basically went from:

Weaselior wrote:

The Mittani, King of Space, is the best-known advocate for a technetium nerf. Technetium, for those who are unaware, currently produces approximately 718 billion isk per month for goonswarm, yet The Mittani has advocated for its nerf at every turn due to the poor effect it has had on game balance. The Mittani has had the chance to advocate for Goonswarm's financial interests at the expense of the game, and has not taken it. The Mittani is the only candidate who has passed such a test.

Via this:
Reilly Duvolle wrote:
But The Mittani does not want Tech nerfed because "it has a poor effect it on game balance". Thats laughable.
He wants it nerfed because his in-game enemies has even more tech income.

This:
Andski wrote:

we don't give a **** if "Team Tech" holds more moons

To This:
Reilly Duvolle wrote:
My main issue with all this is that you take credit for it, using it for propaganda purposes to show how the Goons "care for the game", while in reality, you only care for yourself.
Reilly Duvolle
Hydra Squadron
#263 - 2012-02-22 00:22:03 UTC
As for the CSM Neutrality issue, we have come from this
Grumpy Owly wrote:
Quotes from The Mittani:
"Every CSM represents their own constituents. Some have delusions about 'representing everyone'. I do not."

Tallian Saotome wrote:
Can someone point to me where in the CSM charter it says the are supposed to be neutral?

Can you point to ANY official document stating that CCP expect the CSM to be neutral?


Full document: http://www.eveonline.com/download/devblog/CSM.pdf

with specific quote:

"The key question that council members must consider before casting their vote is whether or not the issue at hand has the potential to improve or otherwise benefit the entire EVE society, and not just a select group within the community that was successful in bringing attention to their unique case. Seeing the big picture—in this case, the needs of a society with over 300.000 individuals—is the primary responsibility of a CSM Representative, and reconciling that view with the interests that won them the election is the greatest challenge they will facein this implementation.

... and ...

CCP is unable to accommodate any issue considered detrimental to the collective interests of EVE , particularly if the issue(s) touch upon meta-level concerns."


This:
Reilly Duvolle wrote:

Fact: The CSM is supposed to be a neutral body. Your sorry ass attempts to cloud this fact is at best misinformed, at worst blantant propaganda.

Fact: The Goons have consistenly pushed for changes that benefits them in game during their term in CSM 6, while largely ignoring issues that dont affect them during the same term. there are exceptions, but pretty few and more importantly, insignificant.

Add the Goons history in EVE, their meta gaming traddition the last 6 years, and I think that my opinion is not entirely without merit. You can try to convice people that my arguments have been totally destructed, but I think you will find quite a lot of people with a diffrent opinion.


To this
Reilly Duvolle wrote:
Courthouse wrote:


I don't think you really 'get' how the CSM works. I mean, Hans is running on a lowsec platform, and will likely get on the CSM. He's campaigning on a platform of things that will benefit him. And he's not the only one who's ever done this.

You are really bad at this.



Nice. So you admit to metagaming the CSM then?
Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe
#264 - 2012-02-22 00:25:26 UTC
Let's just take all that tech from them. Lets see who whines then....

Triggered by: Wars of Sovless Agression, Bending the Knee, Twisting the Knife, Eating Sov Wheaties, Bombless Bombers, Fizzlesov, Interceptor Fleets, Running Away, GhostTime Vuln, Renters, Bombs, Bubbles ?
Weaselior
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
#265 - 2012-02-22 00:26:32 UTC
As we discussed, my friend, you have pegged "team tech", a moronic name that only people who have had their brains rotted by riverini use, at 90 tech moons. Goonswarm itself holds 67, a number you have admitted is likely correct. The CFC holds Pure Blind, and parts of Branch: both rich in technetium. It is highly likely based on public data (since I do not intend to release information about the exact numbers of tech moons our allies hold) that the CFC holds an additional 23 at least. So, by your own figures, taking your poor view of 0.0 politics as gospel, you have still failed to prove your point.

We need not mention, of course, that "team tech", a moronic name that only people who have had their brains rotted by riverini use, is hardly Goonswarm's Eternal Enemy and every second tech is not nerfed, Goonswarm gains an indescribably huge advantage over every non-technetium alliance in the game. One of two powerblocs with an indescribably huge advantage over all other alliances is a much better place to be than the post-tech world will be.

Head of the Goonswarm Economic Warfare Cabal Pubbie Management and Exploitation Division.
Weaselior
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
#266 - 2012-02-22 00:27:41 UTC
I need not mention, of course, the poor posting of merely repeating previous badposts you have made as if their progression is relevant.

Head of the Goonswarm Economic Warfare Cabal Pubbie Management and Exploitation Division.
Reilly Duvolle
Hydra Squadron
#267 - 2012-02-22 00:29:39 UTC  |  Edited by: Reilly Duvolle
Weaselior wrote:
As we discussed, my friend, you have pegged "team tech", a moronic name that only people who have had their brains rotted by riverini use, at 90 tech moons. Goonswarm itself holds 67, a number you have admitted is likely correct. The CFC holds Pure Blind, and parts of Branch: both rich in technetium. It is highly likely based on public data (since I do not intend to release information about the exact numbers of tech moons our allies hold) that the CFC holds an additional 23 at least. So, by your own figures, taking your poor view of 0.0 politics as gospel, you have still failed to prove your point.

We need not mention, of course, that "team tech", a moronic name that only people who have had their brains rotted by riverini use, is hardly Goonswarm's Eternal Enemy and every second tech is not nerfed, Goonswarm gains an indescribably huge advantage over every non-technetium alliance in the game. One of two powerblocs with an indescribably huge advantage over all other alliances is a much better place to be than the post-tech world will be.


It seems like Riverini has touched you in a bad place. He does seem to make a lot of nullsec pubbies very angry, doesnt he? Good qualities in a journalist, I think. He is obviously doing somthing right.

As for my numbers, 67 would assume that Goons holds the entire moon poulation of Deklein, Bure Blind and Branch, + about 10 elsewhere. Id estimate that the CFC as a whole holds a maximum of 70 moons.
Weaselior
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
#268 - 2012-02-22 00:35:11 UTC  |  Edited by: Weaselior
Reilly Duvolle wrote:

It seems like Riverini has touched you in a bad place. He does seem to make a lot of nullsec pubbies very angry, doesnt he? Good qualities in a journalist, I think. He is obviously doing somthing right.

as for my numbers, 67 would assume theta Goons holds the entire moon poulation of Deklein, Bure Blind and Branch-. + about 10 elsewhenre. Id estimate that the CFC as a whole holds a maximum of 70 moons.


The CFC controls Fade, Deklein, Pure Blind, and Branch completely (including Goonswarm within the CFC, which I have not done previously but this makes it easier to describe). Each is a technetium-rich region. As we have already discovered, your knowledge of moon mining approaches nil, so your estimates of what moon counts would be are, of course, not useful. However, we can go to the public data of Dotlan, to discover that the two regions with moon lists there (deklein and Pure Blind: fade is poorly listed and Branch essentially unlisted) both list ~30 technetium moons each. And, while I can assure you Dotlan is full of lies, its lies tend to be profitable ones: failing to register valuable moons, rather than 'fake' valuable moons. We can therefore presume that if Branch continues this pattern it too holds at least 30, and fade (a small region) holds maybe 15.

So therefore, we can easily conclude your numbers are without foundation based purely on public data that I am unable to manipulate.

Head of the Goonswarm Economic Warfare Cabal Pubbie Management and Exploitation Division.
Reilly Duvolle
Hydra Squadron
#269 - 2012-02-22 00:35:11 UTC
Weaselior wrote:
I need not mention, of course, the poor posting of merely repeating previous badposts you have made as if their progression is relevant.



Oh I dont know. My posts seems to increase the overall quality of this thread. Imagine where it would be without me huh?. You should thank me me tinks.
Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe
#270 - 2012-02-22 00:35:33 UTC  |  Edited by: Alavaria Fera
Riverini is great, it's like the opposite of the Mittani.

Mittani: tons+ drakes lost, no fucks given, explosions were had
Riverini: CFC lost a crucial battle, cascade emminent. Stay tuned for the Deklin by Febuary special *toot*

Triggered by: Wars of Sovless Agression, Bending the Knee, Twisting the Knife, Eating Sov Wheaties, Bombless Bombers, Fizzlesov, Interceptor Fleets, Running Away, GhostTime Vuln, Renters, Bombs, Bubbles ?
Reilly Duvolle
Hydra Squadron
#271 - 2012-02-22 00:50:36 UTC
Weaselior wrote:
Reilly Duvolle wrote:

It seems like Riverini has touched you in a bad place. He does seem to make a lot of nullsec pubbies very angry, doesnt he? Good qualities in a journalist, I think. He is obviously doing somthing right.

as for my numbers, 67 would assume theta Goons holds the entire moon poulation of Deklein, Bure Blind and Branch-. + about 10 elsewhenre. Id estimate that the CFC as a whole holds a maximum of 70 moons.


The CFC controls Fade, Deklein, Pure Blind, and Branch completely (including Goonswarm within the CFC, which I have not done previously but this makes it easier to describe). Each is a technetium-rich region. As we have already discovered, your knowledge of moon mining approaches nil, so your estimates of what moon counts would be are, of course, not useful. However, we can go to the public data of Dotlan, to discover that the two regions with moon lists there (deklein and Pure Blind: fade is poorly listed and Branch essentially unlisted) both list ~30 technetium moons each. And, while I can assure you Dotlan is full of lies, its lies tend to be profitable ones: failing to register valuable moons, rather than 'fake' valuable moons. We can therefore presume that if Branch continues this pattern it too holds at least 30, and fade (a small region) holds maybe 15.

So therefore, we can easily conclude your numbers are without foundation based purely on public data that I am unable to manipulate.


Lack of knowledge of the technical side of moon mining doesnt take from me the abilitiy to count.

So lets do Dotlan:

Fade has 6 moons.
Deklein has 19 moons
Pure Blind has 29 moons
Branch has 3 moons

All told, this is 57 moons. I know Dotlan is inaccurate. But on a macro level, its inaccuracies tend to not be concentrated on certain areas. You can count on similar inaccuracies on the team tech side of the equation. All told according to dotlan, there are 159 tech moons in the game, of which the CFC holds 57 in these 4 regions. That leaves 102, in the other northen regions that the CFC does NOT control.
Reilly Duvolle
Hydra Squadron
#272 - 2012-02-22 00:56:05 UTC  |  Edited by: Reilly Duvolle
Weaselior wrote:
Reilly Duvolle wrote:

It seems like Riverini has touched you in a bad place. He does seem to make a lot of nullsec pubbies very angry, doesnt he? Good qualities in a journalist, I think. He is obviously doing somthing right.

as for my numbers, 67 would assume theta Goons holds the entire moon poulation of Deklein, Bure Blind and Branch-. + about 10 elsewhenre. Id estimate that the CFC as a whole holds a maximum of 70 moons.


The CFC controls Fade, Deklein, Pure Blind, and Branch completely (including Goonswarm within the CFC, which I have not done previously but this makes it easier to describe). Each is a technetium-rich region. As we have already discovered, your knowledge of moon mining approaches nil, so your estimates of what moon counts would be are, of course, not useful. However, we can go to the public data of Dotlan, to discover that the two regions with moon lists there (deklein and Pure Blind: fade is poorly listed and Branch essentially unlisted) both list ~30 technetium moons each. And, while I can assure you Dotlan is full of lies, its lies tend to be profitable ones: failing to register valuable moons, rather than 'fake' valuable moons. We can therefore presume that if Branch continues this pattern it too holds at least 30, and fade (a small region) holds maybe 15.

So therefore, we can easily conclude your numbers are without foundation based purely on public data that I am unable to manipulate.


More lies I see. According to Dotlan, Fade, Deklein, Pure Blind and Branch holds a grand total of 57 tech moons, leaving 102 in regions the CFC does NOT control. And no, even if dotlan is indeed inaccurate, those inaccuracies is not concetrated to your regions exclusively. On a macro level, I think you will find that the Dotlan inaccuracies affect the Team tech side as well as yours.

When i gave my numbers I even gave you the benefit of a doubt, the real tech imbalance in your disfavour could very well be worse that I stated previously.
Johnny Marzetti
Imperial Shipment
Amarr Empire
#273 - 2012-02-22 00:56:08 UTC
Reilly Duvolle wrote:

Fact: The CSM is supposed to be a neutral body. Your sorry ass attempts to cloud this fact is at best misinformed, at worst blantant propaganda.

Fact: The Goons have consistenly pushed for changes that benefits them in game during their term in CSM 6, while largely ignoring issues that dont affect them during the same term. there are exceptions, but pretty few and more importantly, insignificant.

Add the Goons history in EVE, their meta gaming traddition the last 6 years, and I think that my opinion is not entirely without merit. You can try to convice people that my arguments have been totally destructed, but I think you will find quite a lot of people with a diffrent opinion.


I do not think the word fact means what you think it means. The things you call facts, most people would call opinions.
Johnny Marzetti
Imperial Shipment
Amarr Empire
#274 - 2012-02-22 00:57:25 UTC
Reilly Duvolle wrote:

Oh I dont know. My posts seems to increase the overall quality of this thread. Imagine where it would be without me huh?. You should thank me me tinks.


You do cause Weaselior to post more so I guess this is technically true.
Weaselior
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
#275 - 2012-02-22 00:59:01 UTC  |  Edited by: Weaselior
Reilly Duvolle wrote:


Lack of knowledge of the technical side of moon mining doesnt take from me the abilitiy to count.

So lets do Dotlan:

Fade has 6 moons.
Deklein has 19 moons
Pure Blind has 29 moons
Branch has 3 moons

All told, this is 57 moons. I know Dotlan is inaccurate. But on a macro level, its inaccuracies tend to not be concentrated on certain areas. You can count on similar inaccuracies on the team tech side of the equation. All told according to dotlan, there are 159 tech moons in the game, of which the CFC holds 57 in these 4 regions. That leaves 102, in the other northen regions that the CFC does NOT control.


Dotlan reports 29 tech moons for Deklein, 36 for Pure Blind. Fade is poorly scanned and Branch is not at all. I am unsure of how you managed to get the numbers you see above. Regardless, while you may be able to count, you do not appear to be able to read.

Deklein: http://evemaps.dotlan.net/region/Deklein/moons
Pure Blind: http://evemaps.dotlan.net/region/Pure_Blind/moons

You may read off the total tech numbers at the bottom.

I was forced to strip the links from your post as the forums could not parse them.

Head of the Goonswarm Economic Warfare Cabal Pubbie Management and Exploitation Division.
Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe
#276 - 2012-02-22 01:01:04 UTC
All these problems with pasing BBcode.

They really need to do something about the way forums handle these things,

Triggered by: Wars of Sovless Agression, Bending the Knee, Twisting the Knife, Eating Sov Wheaties, Bombless Bombers, Fizzlesov, Interceptor Fleets, Running Away, GhostTime Vuln, Renters, Bombs, Bubbles ?
Reilly Duvolle
Hydra Squadron
#277 - 2012-02-22 01:05:56 UTC
Weaselior wrote:

Dotlan reports 29 tech moons for Deklein, 36 for Pure Blind. Fade is poorly scanned and Branch is not at all. I am unsure of how you managed to get the numbers you see above. Regardless, while you may be able to count, you do not appear to be able to read.

Deklein: http://evemaps.dotlan.net/region/Deklein/moons
Pure Blind: http://evemaps.dotlan.net/region/Pure_Blind/moons

You may read off the total tech numbers at the bottom.



pardon?
Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe
#278 - 2012-02-22 01:08:07 UTC
Oh, I see, this is part of a scheme to under represent what we own, so it will not get nerfed.

This forums op wasn't opsec, was it? Cause I never heard of it...

Triggered by: Wars of Sovless Agression, Bending the Knee, Twisting the Knife, Eating Sov Wheaties, Bombless Bombers, Fizzlesov, Interceptor Fleets, Running Away, GhostTime Vuln, Renters, Bombs, Bubbles ?
Weaselior
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
#279 - 2012-02-22 01:09:36 UTC
Reilly Duvolle wrote:
Weaselior wrote:

Dotlan reports 29 tech moons for Deklein, 36 for Pure Blind. Fade is poorly scanned and Branch is not at all. I am unsure of how you managed to get the numbers you see above. Regardless, while you may be able to count, you do not appear to be able to read.

Deklein: http://evemaps.dotlan.net/region/Deklein/moons
Pure Blind: http://evemaps.dotlan.net/region/Pure_Blind/moons

You may read off the total tech numbers at the bottom.



pardon?

I see, I should have provided better instructions. Click on the orange text: this is called a "hyperlink". It will ask you if you're sure you'd like to visit this site, click "yes". When at this site, scroll down to the bottom. You will see a row of text like the following:

Quote:
Summary Moons cob sca tit tun cad van chr pla cae tec haf mer pro dys neo thu


Read off the number under "Tec", the abbreviation for technetium. For Deklein, you will find this number is 29. For Pure Blind, you will find this number is 36. This number is the amount of technetium moons Dotlan believes are in that region.

I hope this was clear enough for you, please feel free to ask any further questions.

Head of the Goonswarm Economic Warfare Cabal Pubbie Management and Exploitation Division.
Reilly Duvolle
Hydra Squadron
#280 - 2012-02-22 01:10:26 UTC  |  Edited by: Reilly Duvolle
I'm puzzled. You see, Dotlan counts abundance levels, which have never been used in game. You have to manually count moons.