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Invention and Decyptors question
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Shayla Sh'inlux
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#21 - 2012-02-20 10:32:37 UTC
Quote:

Personally, I gave up months ago. Impossible to compete with both the cost of components made from Moon Goo, and the existence of T2 BPO's which you CANNOT compete with.


:)

That argument again.

Zero tech II BPO's here. Making about 100mil/day, requiring about 40 clicks a day and a weekly Red Frog shipment from Jita to where I manufacture. Including everything, I think it takes 4 hours a week to maintain. 700mil divided by 4 hours of gametime required sounds like decent isk/hr to me. Especially since you can half of it remotely while doing something else.

Oh and I';m using Decryptors too.

As with everything in Eve, do your homework, watch the market and don't share your secrets.
Ruziel
Twilight Military Industrial Complex
#22 - 2012-02-20 22:09:19 UTC
Mavnas wrote:
So total noob questions here. Let's say I try to invent a T2 ship and use the max run decryptor on it. The T1 BPC needs at least 10 runs on it? Or does it need to be a max runs one?

Also, can the T2 BPC have ME research done on it? (Ignore how long that takes for a bit.)


To get the full additional runs, it needs to be max runs, otherwise you only get the additional runs.


No, you can't research on any BPC, let alone a T2 one.
Steve Ronuken
Fuzzwork Enterprises
Vote Steve Ronuken for CSM
#23 - 2012-02-20 22:57:18 UTC
Ruziel wrote:
Mavnas wrote:
So total noob questions here. Let's say I try to invent a T2 ship and use the max run decryptor on it. The T1 BPC needs at least 10 runs on it? Or does it need to be a max runs one?

Also, can the T2 BPC have ME research done on it? (Ignore how long that takes for a bit.)


To get the full additional runs, it needs to be max runs, otherwise you only get the additional runs.


No, you can't research on any BPC, let alone a T2 one.



It's also less important than you might think.

A lot of the materials in T2 production are 'extra materials'. Which aren't affected by ME.

Take a look at photon scattering Field 2s.

Base materials are, at worse (-6 ME) 49K or so. the extra materials are 469K. a 'perfect' blueprint would save 21k of the total.

Where a BPO has the advantage is the lack of invention. Which saves on the order of 200K or so per unit, with moderate science skills (iirc).

Yes, it's beneficial. But not /majorly/.

Woo! CSM XI!

Fuzzwork Enterprises

Twitter: @fuzzysteve on Twitter
Tau Cabalander
Retirement Retreat
Working Stiffs
#24 - 2012-02-20 23:28:02 UTC
Pink Leaf wrote:
I wasted a whole load of time and money on invention, what a let down. Ugh
I hope that other aspects of Eve are more interesting and rewarding.

Wild guess: you tried to invent ships just like every other industry rookie?

Try ammo, modules, and rigs.

I earn so much that most of the time I can't be bothered to build more.
Mavnas
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#25 - 2012-02-21 05:12:52 UTC
Hmm... so if most of those mats are not reduced my ME, I'm having trouble seeing how some of these ships are profitable at any level of ME?

(Some of the smaller ones seem like they'd be fine.)
Krixtal Icefluxor
INLAND EMPIRE Galactic
#26 - 2012-02-21 11:38:37 UTC
Shayla Sh'inlux wrote:
Quote:

Personally, I gave up months ago. Impossible to compete with both the cost of components made from Moon Goo, and the existence of T2 BPO's which you CANNOT compete with.


:)

That argument again.

Zero tech II BPO's here. Making about 100mil/day, requiring about 40 clicks a day and a weekly Red Frog shipment from Jita to where I manufacture. Including everything, I think it takes 4 hours a week to maintain. 700mil divided by 4 hours of gametime required sounds like decent isk/hr to me. Especially since you can half of it remotely while doing something else.

Oh and I';m using Decryptors too.

As with everything in Eve, do your homework, watch the market and don't share your secrets.



Spreadsheets and logs posted please, or its a lie.

"He has mounted his hind-legs, and blown crass vapidities through the bowel of his neck."  - Ambrose Bierce on Oscar Wilde's Lecture in San Francisco 1882
Krixtal Icefluxor
INLAND EMPIRE Galactic
#27 - 2012-02-21 11:40:23 UTC
Mavnas wrote:
Hmm... so if most of those mats are not reduced my ME, I'm having trouble seeing how some of these ships are profitable at any level of ME?

(Some of the smaller ones seem like they'd be fine.)



Welcome to what I discovered a year ago and got me to bail out of the fallacy that Industry is profitable.

"He has mounted his hind-legs, and blown crass vapidities through the bowel of his neck."  - Ambrose Bierce on Oscar Wilde's Lecture in San Francisco 1882
Shayla Sh'inlux
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#28 - 2012-02-22 08:46:52 UTC  |  Edited by: Shayla Sh'inlux
Krixtal wrote:

Spreadsheets and logs posted please, or its a lie.


Quote:

....... don't share your secrets.


:D
Mavnas
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#29 - 2012-02-22 16:36:56 UTC
Krixtal Icefluxor wrote:
Mavnas wrote:
Hmm... so if most of those mats are not reduced my ME, I'm having trouble seeing how some of these ships are profitable at any level of ME?

(Some of the smaller ones seem like they'd be fine.)



Welcome to what I discovered a year ago and got me to bail out of the fallacy that Industry is profitable.


Industry is quite profitable, but I don't understand why some things seem stupidly easy and profitable and some are super hard and also not profitable. And I don't just mean temporary spikes when someone sends the Jita price of something up 75% and then you can cash in if you're fast enough (I'm not usually that good).
Steve Ronuken
Fuzzwork Enterprises
Vote Steve Ronuken for CSM
#30 - 2012-02-22 17:47:49 UTC
Some T2 stuff isn't profitable.

Like the Eos, or Astarte.

For those, maybe it's a T2 BPO. That I could believe, as they're low volume products. A BPO could probably meet the needs of the market. Ships really aren't the place to look for profit. T2 or T1.

Then again, the EOS and Astarte aren't profitable if you're buying all the components,and have an ME 500 BPO.


Pretty much it all comes down to: look at what sells, then run the numbers on it. Either the market will be saturated by manufacturers and the margin will be tiny, or the manufacturers won't be able to keep up and you'll be able to make a profit.

Woo! CSM XI!

Fuzzwork Enterprises

Twitter: @fuzzysteve on Twitter
Ajita al Tchar
Doomheim
#31 - 2012-02-22 18:23:03 UTC
Krixtal Icefluxor wrote:
Mavnas wrote:
Hmm... so if most of those mats are not reduced my ME, I'm having trouble seeing how some of these ships are profitable at any level of ME?

(Some of the smaller ones seem like they'd be fine.)



Welcome to what I discovered a year ago and got me to bail out of the fallacy that Industry is profitable.


It's nice that you're working so hard to spread information that is completely untrue, if everyone went to do industry there would be a problem Twisted

-dives into a pool filled with gold coins gained from T2 invention and manufacturing-

PS: I invented some T2 ship BPCs recently just for ***** and giggles because I ran out of good BPC's to do invention on, and I can't be bothered to build them, maybe later just for fun. Many T2 ships are pretty bad ISK/hour (time here being the total time everything takes in labs and production slots, not actual game clicky time). You literally picked one of the worst ways to get started with T2 production, but a very common one.
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