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CCP! Please clarify the future plans for WiS!

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Doc Fury
Furious Enterprises
#3081 - 2012-02-18 03:36:27 UTC  |  Edited by: Doc Fury
DeMichael Crimson wrote:

CCP has already stated that WiS is here to stay.


You keep parroting that over and over like I am making an argument otherwise. You know what else is here to stay that languishes unfinished just like WIS? Factional Warfare.

If you want the so-called "anti-WIS" people to get on board with you, you can't be pushing an agenda that makes WIS anything like WOW or where you are 100% safe via consent-only PVP. CCP also needs to lead and not follow what other games are doing if they are to create a compelling expansion to EVE that has the staying-power and longevity that FIS has enjoyed. To be successful, you are also going to have to make WIS attractive enough where a lot of existing EVE players want to participate.

In EVE, a noob can kill (or beat) a vet. If you impose a skill-tree grind in WIS to be able to do that, you just discouraged the players you claim to want to attract and are asking CCP to abandon CCP's core gaming philosophy with EVE, non-consensual PVP

☼

There's a million angry citizens looking down their tubes..at me.
DeMichael Crimson
Republic University
Minmatar Republic
#3082 - 2012-02-18 04:38:39 UTC
Doc Fury wrote:
DeMichael Crimson wrote:

CCP has already stated that WiS is here to stay.


You keep parroting that over and over like I am making an argument otherwise. You know what else is here to stay that languishes unfinished just like WIS? Factional Warfare.

If you want the so-called "anti-WIS" people to get on board with you, you can't be pushing an agenda that makes WIS anything like WOW or where you are 100% safe via consent-only PVP. CCP also needs to lead and not follow what other games are doing if they are to create a compelling expansion to EVE that has the staying-power and longevity that FIS has enjoyed. To be successful, you are also going to have to make WIS attractive enough where a lot of existing EVE players want to participate.

In EVE, a noob can kill (or beat) a vet. If you impose a skill-tree grind in WIS to be able to do that, you just discouraged the players you claim to want to attract and are asking CCP to abandon CCP's core gaming philosophy with EVE, non-consensual PVP

And that's the only thing you got from my reply? Man you fail.

No need to bring up Factional Warfare, it already has a lot of game play content as well as other 'unfinished' content such as Cosmos Agents, Exploration, SOV, etc.

I've never played WoW so making that reference is irrelevant.

I don't know what game you've been playing but in Eve Online, the only truly safe place for players in Eve right now is inside NPC stations. The idea I proposed for WiS PvP will give all players an option to actively participate in WiS content while maintaining a form of safety without being 100% safe.

As for a noob being able to kill (or beat) a vet, that's basically a rumor intended to keep new players subbed. A brand new player would be extremely lucky and very hard pressed to 'beat' a Vet, especially since skills play a very important part in this game. Which brings me to your next point, of course WiS should have a skill-tree grind. That alone keeps it in line with the rest of the game.

Bottom line, you're saying CCP should have non-consensual PvP action incorporated into WiS. That's basically asking CCP to abandon years of hard work on WiS. Why? Because if WiS has non-consensual PvP everywhere, very few players will participate in that type of content. That's guaranteed.

Good job, you've figured out how to effectively kill WiS and maintain Eve Online as being a spaceship simulator game.

'The Plan' | California Eve Players | Proposal - The Endless Battle
Doc Fury
Furious Enterprises
#3083 - 2012-02-18 04:59:28 UTC
DeMichael Crimson wrote:
if WiS has non-consensual PvP everywhere, very few players will participate in that type of content. That's guaranteed.


Citation needed. Show me the data that guarantees this outcome please.

"Non-consensual PVP everywhere" is exactly how EVE works now and yet here we are, new players subscribe all the time, and existing ones re-sub. CCP has enjoyed having one of the longest-lived successful MMOs in gaming history, and overall has an increasing subscription base. As long as they don't try to bite off more than they can chew again, odds are, they will continue to do so.

I am starting to think you got ganked at some point, are bitter because of it, and see an opportunity to try to impose you own desired safety-based play-style on WIS.

CCP has already stated EVE is a PVP game.

/see what I did there?




☼

There's a million angry citizens looking down their tubes..at me.
Taiwanistan
#3084 - 2012-02-18 05:05:29 UTC
we must be able to do god's work everywhere

TA on wis: "when we have a feature that is its own functional ecosystem of gameplay then hooks into the greater ecosystem of EVE as a whole, and it provides good replayability."
DeMichael Crimson
Republic University
Minmatar Republic
#3085 - 2012-02-18 05:32:52 UTC
Doc Fury wrote:
DeMichael Crimson wrote:
if WiS has non-consensual PvP everywhere, very few players will participate in that type of content. That's guaranteed.


Citation needed. Show me the data that guarantees this outcome please.

"Non-consensual PVP everywhere" is exactly how EVE works now and yet here we are, new players subscribe all the time, and existing ones re-sub. CCP has enjoyed having one of the longest-lived successful MMOs in gaming history, and overall has an increasing subscription base. As long as they don't try to bite off more than they can chew again, odds are, they will continue to do so.

I am starting to think you got ganked at some point, are bitter because of it, and see an opportunity to try to impose you own desired safety-based play-style on WIS.

CCP has already stated EVE is a PVP game.

/see what I did there?



And yet contrary to your viewpoint of how this game is meant to be played, low sec remains pretty much uninhabited with a small amount of the player base located in null sec while the majority of players remain in high sec. That fact alone proves that the majority of players in this game are not here for non-consensual PvP.

Thanks again for proving how you still don't understand my proposal, especially since I never advocated for WiS to be completely 100% safe. I'm beginning to think you use in-game grief play and forum trolling to compensate for your inept social ability's.

'The Plan' | California Eve Players | Proposal - The Endless Battle
Doc Fury
Furious Enterprises
#3086 - 2012-02-18 05:40:33 UTC  |  Edited by: Doc Fury
DeMichael Crimson wrote:
Doc Fury wrote:
DeMichael Crimson wrote:
if WiS has non-consensual PvP everywhere, very few players will participate in that type of content. That's guaranteed.


Citation needed. Show me the data that guarantees this outcome please.

"Non-consensual PVP everywhere" is exactly how EVE works now and yet here we are, new players subscribe all the time, and existing ones re-sub. CCP has enjoyed having one of the longest-lived successful MMOs in gaming history, and overall has an increasing subscription base. As long as they don't try to bite off more than they can chew again, odds are, they will continue to do so.

I am starting to think you got ganked at some point, are bitter because of it, and see an opportunity to try to impose you own desired safety-based play-style on WIS.

CCP has already stated EVE is a PVP game.

/see what I did there?



And yet contrary to your viewpoint of how this game is meant to be played, low sec remains pretty much uninhabited with a small amount of the player base located in null sec while the majority of players remain in high sec. That fact alone proves that the majority of players in this game are not here for non-consensual PvP.

Thanks again for proving how you still don't understand my proposal, especially since I never advocated for WiS to be completely 100% safe. I'm beginning to think you use in-game grief play and forum trolling to compensate for your inept social ability's.


Sure, attack the messenger when you have no valid counter argument. That's how you win people over to your point of view. Roll

FYI, EVE being a PVP game is not my viewpoint, it's CCP's.

So, where's your data to support your prior claim that GUARANTEES very few players will participate in non-consensual PVP content? You conveniently left that info out of your latest opus and personal attack on me.

Edit: Highsec while vastly inhabited is also subject to non-consensual PVP, just as CCP intended.

☼

There's a million angry citizens looking down their tubes..at me.
Nova Fox
Novafox Shipyards
#3087 - 2012-02-18 06:44:04 UTC
Well Ill point over to team avatar, why keep people on payroll?

Also Hilmar regrets what was done in an intervew to one of the websites not to long ago but promises to redeliver 'ambulation' in way it was meant to be without forsaking Features in Space.

Dust 514's CPM 1 Iron Wolf Saber Eve mail me about Dust 514 issues.
Nova Fox
Novafox Shipyards
#3088 - 2012-02-18 06:48:15 UTC
Doc Fury wrote:
Nova Fox wrote:
Doc Fury wrote:
Nova Fox wrote:
Dues Ex style missions screw FPS. I am sick and tired of that.


How is that not FPS?



Dues Ex is an adventure game where shooting your way though is seemingly that much harder than 'gentler' methoods.


Just because something is termed an FPS does not necessarily mean you have to shoot all the time, and there's nothing wrong with that.



Actually its quite wrong. Simple principals and theories behind FPS do not belong inside a station. They belong on the ground. What Dues Ex did was philopholcally a different monster than a FPS, Mass effect barrows more traits of an FPS but doesnt inherit all the traits that makes it a shooter.

Dust 514's CPM 1 Iron Wolf Saber Eve mail me about Dust 514 issues.
Jita Alt666
#3089 - 2012-02-18 06:49:49 UTC
I am hoping WIS contains the same dark underhanded player interaction you can have through FIS;
Hacking of personal hangers
Smuggling
Interacting with direct market agents to manipulate the market
Interacting with mission agents to manipulate other players standings and mission "spawns"
...

There are lots and lots of simple ways CCP could make WIS fit into and add to the Eve Online concept. Any one who proposes that PVP should be consensual should not be listened to - those people don't get Eve.
Nova Fox
Novafox Shipyards
#3090 - 2012-02-18 07:30:14 UTC  |  Edited by: Nova Fox
I wouldnt mind having a mission where you install a bomb on some poor smucks ship and detonate it just right when he forgets to do a security sweep.

Robbing the hangers by replacing them with fake modules.

Screwing with thier buy orders.

This is the sort of combat I want to have inside the station.

Getting a temporary gene scuplted clone and fake id to get access to some war rooms. So on and so forth.

Dust 514's CPM 1 Iron Wolf Saber Eve mail me about Dust 514 issues.
Taiwanistan
#3091 - 2012-02-18 09:28:34 UTC
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Uc0Xx3MZ4I4&list=UU3cxDDMpYTZ7PqZma4NdNuA&feature=plcp
i am just going to go ahead and blame this on the incompetence of team avatar

TA on wis: "when we have a feature that is its own functional ecosystem of gameplay then hooks into the greater ecosystem of EVE as a whole, and it provides good replayability."
Indahmawar Fazmarai
#3092 - 2012-02-18 10:23:42 UTC
Just watched the "Awakening" trailer and was left with the feeling that either marketing guys are living in an alternate reality where Incarna delivered and Crucible was about WiS or CCP just does not worry about misleading people on what's the game about. Straight

Or, maybe marketing avatars for a game without avatar content (let alone avatar gameplay) is what they call a joke in Iceland.
Cyndrogen
The Greatest Corp in the Universe
#3093 - 2012-02-18 11:25:57 UTC
Issler Dainze wrote:
Reading the CCP CEO interview I was taken by this comment.

"but the voice of the community is quite clear. People want more spaceships, and more flying in space features. That's very much what we are responding to. "

I don't agree, we certainly do want FiS but that doesn't mean we don't wasn more WiS. I think a lot of us do! And leaving WiS as single player prison cell CQ is a reminder that CCP can't keep its promises. The interview makes it clear there is no plan in the works or even being discussed to take WiS beyond the prison cell.

So if you wanted WiS please post in this thread because I think a lot of us want CCP to deliver more of what they have promised use for years now.

DO NOT ABANDON WiS!!
LET US OUT THAT DOOR!!!!

Issler



Dude Mass Effect! Relax!

WIS why? so you can look at...... other avatars that will slow your machine down to a crawl?
They will spend so much time and effort for essentially something that has nothing to do with eve online but more with barbies playhouse, filled with carebears ..... maybe we can have caldari fashion shows or amarr golden awards shows for best dressed.

seriously, why? I would much rather have low orbit planetary dog fights then walking around..... booooring.

I would even be interested in a star wars like turret gunner, you have to point and shoot while someone else is piloting.

Every day in every way I improve my skills and get better.
Elanor Vega
Native Freshfood
Minmatar Republic
#3094 - 2012-02-18 16:05:40 UTC  |  Edited by: Elanor Vega
Crucis Cassiopeiae wrote:
Doc Fury wrote:
stuff...


Trinity is used for space.
Enlightenment Engine is used for WoD and WiS.

Avatar and indor graphic tech is developed for WoD using the Enlightenment Engine and then is applied for CQ too.

Carbon is just marketing name for all tech CCP have developed.


And how you ppl can not understand... there is no EVE or WoD of DUST...
There is only CCP - the development studio.
They use tech they have or can buy for what ever they think will gain them more money.
All avatar and indor graphic is made for WoD and EVE have free tech that EVE would not got on its own. Its too $$$ tech to develop so that its only used for old game.
Yea... we must realize that -> EVE is old and look at other games that are old as EVE - either they are dead or there is successor on the way.
Because that EVE need something new or it will be dead.

You can say that EVE have 300.000/400.000 accounts so it can live long time with that. Well, look what you write to other players in game when they say that minerals they mine are free. OPPORTUNITY COST - if you invest your time in something and there is something that can get you more money for your time you loose money. There is moment in future when CCP will see that there is better new things to invest hundreds of devs and their time then in OLD EVE, and EVE is dead then.
You, dont letting eve to grow into the new areas to attract new players, are killing EVE. You are killing years of your time that you invested in this game. You are killing your money that you payed for game time.

There is only one direction, known to us, in which EVE can grow and that is WiS.
And there is tech being developed for other game that can make that happen.
Why are you dumb and not letting EVE to live and use that tech?
Why you want EVE dead?

And many ppl like WiS.
Many ppl want WiS.
Many ppl need WiS to play EVE.
So why not give CCP support to make EVE what they want to make from eve - Sci-Fi simulator - and make EVE Forever?

But, i know, there is small part of ppl that are afraid of new things, new ppl, new gameplay and want to things stay how they are. (And some ppl believed them in what ever they were telling them.)
But...
Well... thats impossible.
If you dont grow, you die.
Law of the stronger.


(its late here and i wrote this in half a sleep so i hope that you understand what i want to say.)


p.s.
I know that now i will be attacked my some ppl that many ppl leaved game because of WiS.
I said many times that if they have any evidence of that, show it, but they just love empty talk.
Ppl left because of golden ammo talk, but i don't have strenght to talk about that again.


Edit:
And about that OP is only for WiS here...
LOL... Lol
You ppl that are against WiS are minority, not us.


This is one part of what i am trying so say to people, but some people just dont want to listen anything thats not theirs opinion.
Taiwanistan
#3095 - 2012-02-18 16:18:37 UTC  |  Edited by: Taiwanistan
Elanor Vega wrote:
Crucis Cassiopeiae wrote:
Doc Fury wrote:
stuff...


Trinity is used for space.
Enlightenment Engine is used for WoD and WiS.

Avatar and indor graphic tech is developed for WoD using the Enlightenment Engine and then is applied for CQ too.

Carbon is just marketing name for all tech CCP have developed.


And how you ppl can not understand... there is no EVE or WoD of DUST...
There is only CCP - the development studio.
They use tech they have or can buy for what ever they think will gain them more money.
All avatar and indor graphic is made for WoD and EVE have free tech that EVE would not got on its own. Its too $$$ tech to develop so that its only used for old game.
Yea... we must realize that -> EVE is old and look at other games that are old as EVE - either they are dead or there is successor on the way.
Because that EVE need something new or it will be dead.

You can say that EVE have 300.000/400.000 accounts so it can live long time with that. Well, look what you write to other players in game when they say that minerals they mine are free. OPPORTUNITY COST - if you invest your time in something and there is something that can get you more money for your time you loose money. There is moment in future when CCP will see that there is better new things to invest hundreds of devs and their time then in OLD EVE, and EVE is dead then.
You, dont letting eve to grow into the new areas to attract new players, are killing EVE. You are killing years of your time that you invested in this game. You are killing your money that you payed for game time.

There is only one direction, known to us, in which EVE can grow and that is WiS.
And there is tech being developed for other game that can make that happen.
Why are you dumb and not letting EVE to live and use that tech?
Why you want EVE dead?

And many ppl like WiS.
Many ppl want WiS.
Many ppl need WiS to play EVE.
So why not give CCP support to make EVE what they want to make from eve - Sci-Fi simulator - and make EVE Forever?

But, i know, there is small part of ppl that are afraid of new things, new ppl, new gameplay and want to things stay how they are. (And some ppl believed them in what ever they were telling them.)
But...
Well... thats impossible.
If you dont grow, you die.
Law of the stronger.


(its late here and i wrote this in half a sleep so i hope that you understand what i want to say.)


p.s.
I know that now i will be attacked my some ppl that many ppl leaved game because of WiS.
I said many times that if they have any evidence of that, show it, but they just love empty talk.
Ppl left because of golden ammo talk, but i don't have strenght to talk about that again.


Edit:
And about that OP is only for WiS here...
LOL... Lol
You ppl that are against WiS are minority, not us.


This is one part of what i am trying so say to people, but some people just dont want to listen anything thats not theirs opinion.

just when i was about to run out of trollpacitor, you had to post something like this.

TA on wis: "when we have a feature that is its own functional ecosystem of gameplay then hooks into the greater ecosystem of EVE as a whole, and it provides good replayability."
Mukuro Gravedigger
Republic University
Minmatar Republic
#3096 - 2012-02-18 18:45:31 UTC
I asked this before, but apparently was glossed over...

Since one of the members of Team Avatar was a very strong supporter of microtransactions as presented during the last farce, errr... Alliance Tournament, how much of WIS will be involved with the Nex store?
DeMichael Crimson
Republic University
Minmatar Republic
#3097 - 2012-02-18 19:00:23 UTC
cyndrogen wrote:
Issler Dainze wrote:
Reading the CCP CEO interview I was taken by this comment.

"but the voice of the community is quite clear. People want more spaceships, and more flying in space features. That's very much what we are responding to. "

I don't agree, we certainly do want FiS but that doesn't mean we don't wasn more WiS. I think a lot of us do! And leaving WiS as single player prison cell CQ is a reminder that CCP can't keep its promises. The interview makes it clear there is no plan in the works or even being discussed to take WiS beyond the prison cell.

So if you wanted WiS please post in this thread because I think a lot of us want CCP to deliver more of what they have promised use for years now.

DO NOT ABANDON WiS!!
LET US OUT THAT DOOR!!!!

Issler



Dude Mass Effect! Relax!

WIS why? so you can look at...... other avatars that will slow your machine down to a crawl?
They will spend so much time and effort for essentially something that has nothing to do with eve online but more with barbies playhouse, filled with carebears ..... maybe we can have caldari fashion shows or amarr golden awards shows for best dressed.

seriously, why? I would much rather have low orbit planetary dog fights then walking around..... booooring.

I would even be interested in a star wars like turret gunner, you have to point and shoot while someone else is piloting.


Dude, plain and simple, upgrade your computer.
Seriously.
My computer has no problem at all running 2 accounts with Eve settings all set to high with Captains Quarters active. And it's not even a high end gaming computer.

Obviously you missed this statement in the OP:
Quote:
So if you wanted WiS please post in this thread because I think a lot of us want CCP to deliver more of what they have promised use for years now.


All it takes is a little bit of imagination to envision the game play possibilities that could be added to Eve. Eve Online is advertized by CCP as a MMORPG Science Fiction Simulator, not a space ship simulator. CCP has stated time and time again that their vision has always been from the very start to make Eve a Science Fiction Virtual Reality. WiS content is the 'Final Frontier' to achieve CCP's vision.

Your statement denotes a very limited imagination as well as a closed minded viewpoint:
Quote:
They will spend so much time and effort for essentially something that has nothing to do with eve online but more with barbies playhouse, filled with carebears ..... maybe we can have caldari fashion shows or amarr golden awards shows for best dressed.


LOL, seems Anti-WiS posters always use the same terminology, probably due to reading the same newsletter. Try being creative and come up with another term, something like 'Characters On Catwalk'. Oh right, that would require using your imagination. Anyway, this thread is filled with lot's of various ideas for WiS game play content and if you had bothered to read it, would have seen it's a lot more than just 'Avatars On Parade'.

'The Plan' | California Eve Players | Proposal - The Endless Battle
oldbutfeelingyoung
Perkone
Caldari State
#3098 - 2012-02-18 19:37:27 UTC
cyndrogen wrote:
Issler Dainze wrote:
Reading the CCP CEO interview I was taken by this comment.

"but the voice of the community is quite clear. People want more spaceships, and more flying in space features. That's very much what we are responding to. "

I don't agree, we certainly do want FiS but that doesn't mean we don't wasn more WiS. I think a lot of us do! And leaving WiS as single player prison cell CQ is a reminder that CCP can't keep its promises. The interview makes it clear there is no plan in the works or even being discussed to take WiS beyond the prison cell.

So if you wanted WiS please post in this thread because I think a lot of us want CCP to deliver more of what they have promised use for years now.

DO NOT ABANDON WiS!!
LET US OUT THAT DOOR!!!!

Issler



Dude Mass Effect! Relax!

WIS why? so you can look at...... other avatars that will slow your machine down to a crawl?
They will spend so much time and effort for essentially something that has nothing to do with eve online but more with barbies playhouse, filled with carebears ..... maybe we can have caldari fashion shows or amarr golden awards shows for best dressed.

seriously, why? I would much rather have low orbit planetary dog fights then walking around..... booooring.

I would even be interested in a star wars like turret gunner, you have to point and shoot while someone else is piloting.



barbie? lol didn,t heard that before

low orbit flight? interesting pls make a post in feature and ideas section or just dump that idea on GD


turret gunner? on what ship?

R.S.I2014
Elanor Vega
Native Freshfood
Minmatar Republic
#3099 - 2012-02-19 04:05:23 UTC  |  Edited by: Elanor Vega
Taiwanistan wrote:
Elanor Vega wrote:
Crucis Cassiopeiae wrote:
Doc Fury wrote:
stuff...


Trinity is used for space.
Enlightenment Engine is used for WoD and WiS.

Avatar and indor graphic tech is developed for WoD using the Enlightenment Engine and then is applied for CQ too.

Carbon is just marketing name for all tech CCP have developed.


And how you ppl can not understand... there is no EVE or WoD of DUST...
There is only CCP - the development studio.
They use tech they have or can buy for what ever they think will gain them more money.
All avatar and indor graphic is made for WoD and EVE have free tech that EVE would not got on its own. Its too $$$ tech to develop so that its only used for old game.
Yea... we must realize that -> EVE is old and look at other games that are old as EVE - either they are dead or there is successor on the way.
Because that EVE need something new or it will be dead.

You can say that EVE have 300.000/400.000 accounts so it can live long time with that. Well, look what you write to other players in game when they say that minerals they mine are free. OPPORTUNITY COST - if you invest your time in something and there is something that can get you more money for your time you loose money. There is moment in future when CCP will see that there is better new things to invest hundreds of devs and their time then in OLD EVE, and EVE is dead then.
You, dont letting eve to grow into the new areas to attract new players, are killing EVE. You are killing years of your time that you invested in this game. You are killing your money that you payed for game time.

There is only one direction, known to us, in which EVE can grow and that is WiS.
And there is tech being developed for other game that can make that happen.
Why are you dumb and not letting EVE to live and use that tech?
Why you want EVE dead?

And many ppl like WiS.
Many ppl want WiS.
Many ppl need WiS to play EVE.
So why not give CCP support to make EVE what they want to make from eve - Sci-Fi simulator - and make EVE Forever?

But, i know, there is small part of ppl that are afraid of new things, new ppl, new gameplay and want to things stay how they are. (And some ppl believed them in what ever they were telling them.)
But...
Well... thats impossible.
If you dont grow, you die.
Law of the stronger.


(its late here and i wrote this in half a sleep so i hope that you understand what i want to say.)


p.s.
I know that now i will be attacked my some ppl that many ppl leaved game because of WiS.
I said many times that if they have any evidence of that, show it, but they just love empty talk.
Ppl left because of golden ammo talk, but i don't have strenght to talk about that again.


Edit:
And about that OP is only for WiS here...
LOL... Lol
You ppl that are against WiS are minority, not us.


This is one part of what i am trying so say to people, but some people just dont want to listen anything thats not theirs opinion.

just when i was about to run out of trollpacitor, you had to post something like this.



Just quoting logical thought that i agree with.
And if you don't know what logic is, well, i am sorry for you.
Taiwanistan
#3100 - 2012-02-19 04:36:08 UTC
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=endscreen&NR=1&v=W0M4QUUsG1E

TA on wis: "when we have a feature that is its own functional ecosystem of gameplay then hooks into the greater ecosystem of EVE as a whole, and it provides good replayability."