Player Features and Ideas Discussion

INB4 Trolling: This isn't really another thread about AFK cloaking, in fact it would probably buff it in the short term. I just decided on an "AFK cloaking" title because AFK cloaking is currently a necessary gameplay style I'd one day like to see become redundant, and it is relevant to the thread's topic.

Anyway, this idea addresses the issue that gives rise to AFK cloaking, which is the way in which local, intel channels and safe havens such as stations and player owned structures render a non-AFK player completely invulnerable to attack from roaming gangs (to roaming gangs, obviously they're still vulnerable to spies etc.). I won't debate the safety of running anomalies in a deep blue sov null sec pocket, I'm pretty sure we all know it isn't very dangerous.

As a forewarning, this is a pretty simplistic idea I've heard mentioned numerous times in game. I'm posting it because I've oddly never seen it on the forums before, and I'm well aware that there are a metric **** tonne of issues with it (I'll list as many as I can think of myself).

Anyway: NPCs warp disrupt players more often.

That's pretty much it. Currently in anomalies only a few frigates will scram, and even then rarely. I think some in a sanctum do sometimes, and some of them scram in the last room of the 8/10. I've honestly never noticed it in the 9/10 or 10/10, but that's probably because I'm usually too busy shitting bricks about how I should have brought more than shield maintenance drones as logi. And out of all these sites, I don't think I've ever seen a high EHP NPC point me.

The lack of warp disrupting NPCs means that at the moment a neutral enters local, everyone can dock up. There is no real incentive to rush killing the scrammers, because they insta-pop to any decently fitted ship. What I propose is a (slight) increase to the number of disrupting NPCs, so that when a new local enters if you haven't killed them, and they warp straight to your site, you are screwed.

Ideally, if this could be implemented in a way that actually worked, then people clearing sites slowly, killing NPCs in the wrong order or not watching intel channels for the neighboring systems would occasionally be caught in a site pointed by rats. Again, in an ideal scenario this would revive the effectiveness of roaming gangs for killing ratters, and AFK cloaking could finally be put to rest with items such as the system scanning array.

Anyway, this thread is already longer than I had planned it on being so I'm going to skip to the massive list of downsides I can see with this proposal:

1. AFK cloaking would be massively buffed unless the system scanning array and changes to NPC mechanics were made concurrently. This makes testing this idea a complete nightmare, and it is not the kind of idea that can be realistically tested on singularity. This is a pretty damning flaw.


2. This would not really effect miners, and I cannot really see a way to make it effect miners. It also wouldn't really effect people doing PI, or otherwise prattling about in a system. This idea does not propose an alternate method for attacking them, meaning it doesn't provide a complete alternative to the AFK cloaking tactic. Another pretty massive flaw.


3. This would effect people running anomalies and combat sites in NPC null sec far more than the ones in the "safe" areas it is trying to protect. Entities who do not control large swathes of null would also be effected to a far greater extent, since they operate without massive intel channels and buffer systems. This disadvantage could be negated somewhat with scouts, but I'm still going to count this as a massive issue.


4. People disconnecting mid-fight in anomalies would likely lose their ships, modules could be made to remain on (and ships to continue moving) when player is logged off to combat this. Since players no longer disappear after 14 minutes modules remaining on for logged off ships hopefully wouldn't effect PvP. Possibly a solvable flaw, but it feels messy to me.


5. Player ships may not disappear if pointed by NPCs when they suffer a serious computer or network issue, since aggression now refreshes when you have logged off. I'm unsure if this differs for NPC aggression, and I'm unwilling to log my loki off in the 10/10 to test.


6. It would be very difficult to strike a balance between too many NPCs pointing a player, and not enough. If only one high EHP battleship points in most anomalies it may just become common practice to fit a single WCS to ship fits, or a roaming gang would be so unlikely to find a ship pointed that the mechanic may as well have never been changed. Alternatively if half a room point you, you have no chance of escape if you're in the only sanctum in a small system and a gang just jumped in.


7. I'm unsure how multi-boxing would effect this. Seeing the NPCs point multiple ships would be nice, but might be unrealistic given the limitations of the NPC AI. Improving that AI beyond telling it to randomly point everything on grid is also unrealistic, as given the number of NPCs in game more complex AI would increase server load dramatically.

Bah, my fingers are tired so that's all the flaws I can think of for now. Hopefully some of the other posters on here can think of some more, or some solutions to the ones I've listed. I genuinely think this has some potential to reintroduce an element of risk to null, and could be balanced easier than the idea of removing cloaked ships from local.

Anyway I don't make threads here very often, because most ideas have been gone over before. This, however, I have honestly never seen suggested. Although as I said I've heard people say it in game numerous times.

Worth noting for anyone in this thread, this offer still stands.

@Griptus, "Anyway: NPCs warp disrupt players more often." was the proposal, from what I read.

Personally, I'm not sure how I feel about it. I'm not sure what all impact it would have, but it seems like it would be more of a pain than anything, I'm not really sure what the upside would be.

Edit- Upon actually reading your idea, I like it.

Make all NPC's Web and/or Scram.

Supported, all pirate NPC's should TRY and scram/web you, since their ARE trying to kill you. and since NPC's are suposedly WHOLE CREWS its far less liekly that ALL OF THEM were ******** enough to leave dock without a point-system.

also, anyone who rats in a pve setup DESERVES to die, YES it means you need more people to kill your targets before you take damage, but the look on "roaming gangs' " faces when your "ratting" harbinger/megathron has a point-system of its own and DPS to kill you, is priceless.

:notsureifretarded:


I will personally make any war dec with an active alliance or corporation mutual.

Um... AFK Cloaking is working as intended, and is not an issue. Does not need fixing, ergo this post is pointless.

I'm not a fan of implementing an idea that is really just designed to cover for the faults of the player. I get what you are saying, that everyone can dock up blah blah, but at the same time it also means that roaming suddenly requires a whole lot less skill. Cause now you can just warp to someone's plex and join in with about 10-15 NPCs in nuking down their DPS. On top of that, why even bother fitting tackle anymore?

...

nvm I like this idea. I would no longer need skill OR have to give up my midslots.

DOWN WITH THE NULLBEARS!

Heh, the idea wasn't to make it so the rats would have a player permanently pointed, the way I'd like to see it is a roaming gang jumping into a system, multiple tackle ships warping to different anomalies and hoping *one* of the players in them wasn't paying attention to intel, or that they didn't have scouts out to begin with.

It would have to be balanced so that if you knew a gang was coming, you could either OH and burn out of point range, or just kill the rats in a reasonable time frame. As it stands, there is no point in any site I've run that you will be pointed for more than 20-30 seconds, even then the only time I can think of is three rooms deep into a rated combat site.

Anyway at the moment there is really very little skill in avoiding PvP in null sec pockets, there's no particular rush if you hear a gang is coming, it's just a question of whether or not you were paying attention to intel/local. I've never lost a PvE ship in Eve, and I'm a giant carebear, it just feels too safe This isn't purely about adding skill to catching carebears, it's about adding some skill to avoiding gankers.

Even in signatures, any decent carebear is going to have a scout cloaked off the acceleration gate. By the time someone warps into system, even if they have the site scanned down already you're going to be warping out and bouncing safes.


Lol, read the proposal. It's also worth noting I'm well aware this proposal will never be implemented, I still think it's interesting, and I'm also a pretty firm believer that null sec is too safe. If anyone wants to prove me wrong, come and kill me or one of my alts in a PvE ship and I'll eat my words. I also drop phat lootz.