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Jobbing for Machariel, what to learn the ropes on?

Author
stoicfaux
#41 - 2012-02-02 15:01:13 UTC
M'ktakh wrote:

for targeting range (why bother when I cant shoot past it?), or perhaps go the sentry drone route and fir drone rigs?


There are some missions where the NPCs are outside your standard targeting range. With an AB fitted it will take forever to get into range. You can lock those faraway spawns, fire a shot and let them come to you while you're dealing with closer things. Also, there's Barrage.

Sentry drones are stationary and go against on of the Mach's strengths, namely speed.

Pon Farr Memorial: once every 7 years, all the carebears in high-sec must PvP or they will be temp-banned.

M'ktakh
Republic University
Minmatar Republic
#42 - 2012-02-02 19:44:38 UTC  |  Edited by: M'ktakh
Large Aux Thrusters (plus 40 m/s speed)
Large Ionic Field Projector (95 km targeting range)
Large Semiconductor Memory Cell (better cap)

The dps rigs stack heavily with a lot of other dps stuff, so no real gain there, but maybe a tracking rig instead of the thrusters?

Decisions, decisions.
stoicfaux
#43 - 2012-02-02 21:49:57 UTC
M'ktakh wrote:
Large Aux Thrusters (plus 40 m/s speed)
Large Ionic Field Projector (95 km targeting range)
Large Semiconductor Memory Cell (better cap)

The dps rigs stack heavily with a lot of other dps stuff, so no real gain there, but maybe a tracking rig instead of the thrusters?

Decisions, decisions.

Eh, you only need tracking when you get in close. Instead of wasting a rig slot on tracking, use Web and TP drones instead. IIRC, Target Painters provide the same benefit as a tracking bonus (30% TP bonus = 30% tracking bonus,) whereas webs provide three times the bonus (50% web bonus = 150% tracking bonus.) If you mount a stasis web module, then carry 1xHeavy Web drones and 3xHeavy TP drone. Otherwise use 3xWeb and 1xTP drone.

60% Fed Navy web + 3xTP drones + 1xWeb drone = target reduced to 33% speed and sig increased to 149%.
3xWeb Drones + 1xTP drone = target reduced to 59% speed, and sig increase to 120%.

It's not like you use light drones all that much with a Mach anyway.

Pon Farr Memorial: once every 7 years, all the carebears in high-sec must PvP or they will be temp-banned.

Sicex
#44 - 2012-02-02 23:21:16 UTC
The assuredness in which the fail fit was posted is a little more worrying, as if a large percentage of the populace has no idea they are even doing it wrong. It's one of those managerial training situations where your employees don't even know what they don't know.
Firebolt145
The Hatchery
RAZOR Alliance
#45 - 2012-02-03 19:45:45 UTC  |  Edited by: Firebolt145
I have yet to see a really good fit here in this thread. One or two have come close.


[Machariel, Ideal Mach]

800mm Repeating Artillery II, Republic Fleet EMP L
800mm Repeating Artillery II, Republic Fleet EMP L
800mm Repeating Artillery II, Republic Fleet EMP L
800mm Repeating Artillery II, Republic Fleet EMP L
800mm Repeating Artillery II, Republic Fleet EMP L
800mm Repeating Artillery II, Republic Fleet EMP L
800mm Repeating Artillery II, Republic Fleet EMP L
Small Tractor Beam I

Gist C-Type 100MN MicroWarpdrive
Gist C-Type X-Large Shield Booster
Invulnerability Field II
Invulnerability Field II
Tracking Computer II, Optimal Range

Tracking Enhancer II
Tracking Enhancer II
Tracking Enhancer II
Republic Fleet Gyrostabilizer
Republic Fleet Gyrostabilizer
Republic Fleet Gyrostabilizer
Republic Fleet Gyrostabilizer

Large Core Defence Capacitor Safeguard I
Large Capacitor Control Circuit I
Large Capacitor Control Circuit I


Hobgoblin II x5
Whatever drones you want.

---

Reason for fit: highs are obvious. Tractor beam lets you pull in mission items. Lows are also pretty much obvious. If you don't feel confident about tanking missions then start with a DCU in place of a 4th gyro, but the 4th gyro is worth it when you feel sure of yourself.

Now for the areas others will disagree with:

Ammo: I use RF ammo because I blitz. It's completely up to you whether you want to do the same.

Mids: MWD, X-L booster, 2 invulns, tracking computer.
For missions, you should aim for the minimum tank possible that will keep you alive in missions easily, and spam all the other slots with dps mods. A deadspace shield booster is very important and should be the first pimped mod you buy, before the mwd and the gyro's. Gist is advisable for better cap efficiency, although slightly more expensive than its pith counterparts. This combination of shield booster + 2 invulns gets you 350 dps tank. This is far more than you'll ever need if you fly smartly and you'll only need to pulse the shield booster now and then. I assure you that I never go below 70% shields or 70% cap with this tank setup.
The MWD is there because the mach doesn't need to speed tank. It also multiplies one of the mach's advantages as a ship - its speed and manoeuvrability. You use the MWD to get to the next acceleration gate, pick up loot etc. It is there for you to be zippy, cutting down mission completion times. If you know how to blitz missions, it becomes even more invaluable.
The tracking computer is there because you've already got enough tank, and it is the only mid slot dps mod available. I usually put a optimal range script in there but for missions with lots of frigates (buzz kill comes to mind) I sometimes switch to tracking speed.

Mid mods: Close but no cigar.
- Stasis web: next to useless. You should never be within 10k of any ship because you can't track anything at that range, including battleships. In all missions you should be alphaing the frigates one by one at the start before any of them reach <30km. If any of them somehow squeeze through, you can release your 5x hobs to kill them.
- Another tank mod of any form (shield resists, shield boost amp, etc): you have more than enough tank already, put a damage mod there instead. If you're still having trouble, then you're doing the mission wrong.

Now for rigs: 2x CCC, 1x cap safeguard.

Someone above recommended using the semiconductor memory cell because of your MWD. This is not optimal. You are not perma running your mwd, you are only pulsing it once in a while. The main usage of your cap comes from the shield booster, not the MWD. A combination of 2 CCC's and 1 cap safeguard gives you best cap for this.

I have corpmates that are even more dps-hungry than I am and do not equip the cap rigs, instead they fit a t2 large burst aerator. This is an option when you are extremely confident in missioning.

If you are having difficulty in missions because of your tank, I can honestly say (with no elitism involved) that you are not doing the mission correctly/optimally. My best advice for that would be to go to www.eve-survival.org and read up on every mission that you accept. That site is absolutely amazing for this sort of thing.
stoicfaux
#46 - 2012-02-03 21:41:23 UTC
Firebolt145 wrote:

- Stasis web: next to useless. You should never be within 10k of any ship because you can't track anything at that range, including battleships. In all missions you should be alphaing the frigates one by one at the start before any of them reach <30km. If any of them somehow squeeze through, you can release your 5x hobs to kill them.

Someone needs to spend more time with pyfa's DPS graph.

Counter Example: Let's pick a small fast cruiser such as the Mercenary Commander with a 125m sig and 200m/s orbit speed. We'll also set the target angle to 90 degrees, which is worst case. A 1048 DPS, three TE, .0675 tracking Mach will do:
* ~450 DPS at 10km and
* ~700 DPS at 15km.
* DPS maxes at ~25km at 850 DPS.
Not so great.

If we drop a 14km, 60% web on the Mercenary Commander and also hit it with a 20% Web Drone and 3x20% TP drones, we increase the sig size to 149% and drop speed down to 33%. That gives us a new sig size of 186m and speed of 67m/s. The new DPS numbers are:
* 1000+ DPS from ~4km+

And that's with a worst case target angle of 90 degrees. If we reverse course and reduce the target angle to say 20 degrees as the target tries to give chase, we get:
* 1000+ DPS at ~3km+


Long story short, don't underestimate the power of MWD + web + web drone + 3xTP drones + 12km 'keep at range' (to avoid overshooting.) It's been working well for me in level 4s in Minmatar space even against the smaller and faster than average Angels from cruisers to battleships.

Note to self: set 'keep at' to a lower value.

Pon Farr Memorial: once every 7 years, all the carebears in high-sec must PvP or they will be temp-banned.

Firebolt145
The Hatchery
RAZOR Alliance
#47 - 2012-02-03 21:50:40 UTC
I must admit that I blitz and thus I'm never within web range of anything or even releasing drones, for that matter.

I haven't considered using TP/web drones and they may help the average missioner who wants to kill everything, though you should compare the dps gain of using those drones to the dps gain of using regular drones. Also, how often are you shooting ships at 14km range (assuming FN webs) compared to ships outside 14km, where a TC would help all the time?
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