Missions & Complexes

Hello space friends;

I like this game, and if you're reading this message then you probably do, too! As you may or may not know, I am running for CSM7 on a platform devoted entirely to the promise that I will to the best of my ability represent to CCP the expressed desires of anyone and everyone who cares to tell me what they'd like to see done to improve EVE Online. One of the ideas that has been put to me already is to adopt the AI and functionality that has already been introduced in Incursions, and to a lesser extent in Sleeper sights in wormholes, and incorporate that functionality into Missions in all security status regions of space. It is my hope that this thread may serve as a discussion of that specific topic.

Looking at my Standing screen, you can see that I have a little bit of experience running missions: I have 10.00 standings with Theology Council, and pretty good standings with a few others. I got to this point via the regular Level 4 mission grind with which I am sure many of you are familiar. I say this because I want you to know that I am not just talking blindly about things with which I am not at all familiar: I have been there, and I have seen it and done it. At the same time, over the course of the last year or so I have run a few dozen hours of Incursion fleets, as both a Logistics pilot and as a DPS position; so, I know that deal, too. I can say that regardless of which one you prefer, they are both good sources of money; but, that they appeal to different kinds of people and that people in different situations are going to be more inclined to choose one over the other.

But why not combine them? Most other MMOs have group content that is available for even the newest characters, and for many it is entirely possible and viable to progress one's character through a PVE career with nothing but group content. In EVE Online, this is not yet true. We have made progress towards this paradigm with the introduction of Incursions and Wormholes, but in those environments one quickly comes to realize that new players are at a disadvantage and are often shunned for being a burden on the optimal efficiency of the other players. Even within my own organisation, Goonswarm being perhaps the single most newbie-friendly Alliance in the game other than EVE University, there has been expressed a lot of complaints about newbies showing up to Incursion fleets in ships like Hurricanes or Harbingers. There just does not exist a low-level, newbie-friendly group content.

The proposal that has been voiced to me, and which I would like to discuss with you, the members of the PVE community, is the introduction of a new type of mission, which would be available at all mission levels. This new kind of mission would allow for and explicitly promote group play that even newer characters can accomplish without feeling like they are a detriment to the other players.

Please, share your thoughts!

Please give me L1 missions I can complete every 5 minutes for 15m and 2k LP. That would be awesome functionality from Incursions which, imo, missions utterly lack.

Fix scouts. Income, difficulty, access the gates at max with something cruiser sized. Or maybe even maximum frigate size. Income level between l3 and l4 in those. Problem solved partly. Group content worth doing for starters. Actually it would be even worth for vets who are waiting for a fleet "real fleet" to form up ... but that is just a nice extra.

Just make sure those missions are not easy to do solo at all. Easy achieved via heavy tanked sansha vessels which can not be destroyed with a single frig sized vessel, but can be tanked via speed, signature or ecm.
This would actually even add to that scout feeling of scout sites. Hard hitting, big npc ships in low numbers, maybe sometimes waves of support ships for those, which need to be eliminated fast before that start to hurt the player fleet.

Key Element must be small player ships vs boss like hard-tanked ships.

If you want to add some flavor to those sites, you could have hacking, salvage, or even scrambling objectives in those scout sites. "Find the enemy base in this deadspace pockets, bring down the remote shield transfer arrays protecting this dreadnought and prevent him from warping away", sounds like a perfect scout mission. Once mission completed a few navy ships warp in and do the shooting. But ok, I got carried away, sounds a bit to complex for incursions, maybe some type of new group missions? CCP told us last year that the incursion tools can be used for so much more ...

The first issue that comes to my mind in using the Sleeper/Incursion AI in missions is that it completely invalidates drone boats due the the AI's propensity to go for the drones. Yes, there are some ways to mitigate this, but there's a reason that done users are mostly told to try a different ship for WHs/Incursions. I think that alienating a whole group of ships (and a popular one at that) from missions would be unwise.

— Genetic Weapon, GoonWaffe, Goonswarm Federation


I dare say that I am not the Goon candidate you think I am.

If EvE would force me to play with randomscrubs, I would quit.
The problem is, that it's not rewarding at all to group up. (Imho, even incursions are not. You need an advanced fleet to get similar ISK like lv4 income, through VG's. for HQ/Assault's, its even worse.)

To change this, it would require a more rewarding system for grouping up and taking the risk that this randomscrub can screw you up pretty damn fast (If he know's what he's doing / is a total ******).

I agree though, that missions needs more excitement. But I don't want a complete overhaul to a system, which forces you to fit different stuff (Like scramblers, webs, damps, core stabs etc.) for every mission. Imho, relaxing LV 4's are good and a nice way to have a decent income. Imho, give me a chunk of new missions (Lv 5 in highsec would be okey too), or randomize mission NPC's for every mission (Like the oldschool diablo mapchange for every game). It would be nice to have 40 BS on a blockade, and only 12 the next time. Make them different everytime we fly them. Even if it's only the number of ships.

More storyline missions like a 10 part "mini-epic arc" with the chance for a nice reward (maybe increase salvage or s.th.)

my 2 cents.

I agree with both your C&P forum post and I like the concept of what you're saying here.. Missions are awful, they have become extremely outdated compared to the rest of EVE. They have to be the most underdeveloped aspect of EVE (bar perhaps the bounty system.)

I think despite people's gripes with incursions, they are by far a better way to earn PvE income than missions. In short these are the reasons I liked incursions:

• They are quick.. No lengthy boring rooms unless the player chooses to opt into longer sites. Whilst they are repetitive like missions I think this is largely off-setted by the speed at which they can be completed.
• They are a group activity - I can't stand missions because whilst doing them I feel very isolated from all the other players. This is an MMO after all!
• Good income considering investment into expensive ships and SP requirements (no decent fleets take a non-shiny T1 fitted ship.)
• The competition between another fleet every so often provided some variety and motivation to work a little harder.

Now I'll move onto the reason I don't like missions:

• Boring and repetitive.
• Predictable AI.
• No interaction with other players.
• No sense of competition or urgency.
• A lack of compelling storyline.
• Basically they are too formulaic.

I think there are clear ways you can make missions more enjoyable. Shorten the length of the missions perhaps by instead introducing encounters with smaller but stronger waves of ships.. Keep the income of high sec missions at roughly the same level but considerably buff low sec income. Perhaps make every mission have both a solo version and a fleet version (fleet paying marginally more if done with the optimal amount of players.) Finally, a little more of a long shot - introduce time-based bonuses i.e. have the player race through the mission in order to complete it in as short a time as possible for scaled bonuses. Perhaps introduce a leaderboard.

I think the above suggestions would actually make missioning entertaining but the leaderboards part isn't particularly lore-friendly. Lets be honest though: who the **** RPs in EVE? I might make a thread with these suggestions and further develop them since it really should be looked at soon.

just what the CSM needs another goon...