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Yet Another Legion Thread #1
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Skydell
Bad Girl Posse
#21 - 2012-01-30 00:39:48 UTC
Teras Lakkos wrote:
Skydell wrote:
I rather like all the Amarr ships. Having one ammo (conflag) and if you are hard up, navy multifreq pretty much makes a laser obselete though.

wat?

Being annoyed over a couple useless legion subs has nothing to do with how good lasers and amarr is.


T3 subsystems are an amalgamation of T2 Cruisers. There are no "useless" subsystems that are exclusive to Amarr. While I don't understand why Gallente got Localized Injectors and the other three races got Fuel Catalyst, 3 races got it and it's identical. The thing that holds T3 Amarr back is what holds all Amarr back. They have crappy ammo and it makes thier guns impotent, they don't and can't tank out the impotence, add in slow speeds they can't adapt optimal without the impotence factor.

T3 Amarr is an emblem of Amarr ships. Designed not to chase but to brick up and adjust optimals to fight on the spot. It fails due to poor choice of optimals in Ammo. Even that isn't exclusive to Amarr. Its why Blasters suck. Optimal is useless.
Teras Lakkos
SuperMassive Torque
#22 - 2012-01-30 02:10:41 UTC
Skydell wrote:
stuff



I think you are missing the point of this thread
Hicksimus
Torgue
#23 - 2012-01-30 02:28:44 UTC
Pinaculus wrote:


Blaster/Rail Tengu?

Yeah, I've never seen one either.



http://eve.battleclinic.com/killboard/killmail.php?id=14797129


Here.....words cannot describe this. It was found trapped in a drone anom unable to pop the wee little drones buzzing around it.

Recruitment Officer: What type of a pilot are you? Me: I've been described as a Ray Charles with Parkinsons and a drinking problem.
Teras Lakkos
SuperMassive Torque
#24 - 2012-01-30 17:38:39 UTC
Hicksimus wrote:
Pinaculus wrote:


Blaster/Rail Tengu?

Yeah, I've never seen one either.



http://eve.battleclinic.com/killboard/killmail.php?id=14797129


Here.....words cannot describe this. It was found trapped in a drone anom unable to pop the wee little drones buzzing around it.


Blaster tengu is silly with the strength of the missile sub.

Anyways, amarr have the awesome that is curse and pilgrim yet the legion utterly fails to emulate them. But T3s are super hacs and recons yet we get the legion short stick here.
ElQuirko
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#25 - 2012-01-30 17:44:01 UTC
Frankly, the proteus has barely any useful subs at all. Buff that before you buff the "OMG WTF NEUT HAM LEEJUNNN!11!1one!1!1"

Dodixie > Hek
Teras Lakkos
SuperMassive Torque
#26 - 2012-01-30 17:52:45 UTC
ElQuirko wrote:
Frankly, the proteus has barely any useful subs at all. Buff that before you buff the "OMG WTF NEUT HAM LEEJUNNN!11!1one!1!1"


Crazy buffer, 1k dps + 5 mediums, 45km/18km points before o/h, cap stable mwd.

Sure, some of the proteus propulsion subs aren't great, but that doesn't break it at all.
Petrus Blackshell
Rifterlings
#27 - 2012-01-30 22:31:53 UTC
Teras Lakkos wrote:
I think you are missing the point of this thread


Your thread was hijacked by a bunch of trolls. FWIW, you have a +1 from me on some of the Legion's subsystems needing balancing.

Accidentally The Whole Frigate - For-newbies blog (currently on pause)
Adeena Torcfist
Right Hand Of The Legion.
Get Off My Lawn
#28 - 2012-01-31 02:29:59 UTC
i must admit, the Legion is really sub par compared to the other races. The biggest let down, for me, is parasitic sub system. its range is so useless, i actually look forward to being webbed up close so i can suck them dry. however, if i get a Loki on me, i cant even disable their webs as they are that far out. so it usually ends up by me just perma tanking untill one of us gets bored.

FIX THAT DAMN SYSTEM!!

+1 for 100% range

as for the Covert Ops subsytem, christ, id rather fit a T1 cruiser with a prototype cloak on it, for all that its worth. what a useless piece of butthole that is.

it could also do with an agility buff, or, remove/change the rig drawbacks. again, pointless drawbacks. Roll It can be be such a great ship, it just needs some damn fine tuning.
Teras Lakkos
SuperMassive Torque
#29 - 2012-01-31 05:07:02 UTC
So I am seeing people either agree with me or say the legion is fine. To those who say it is fine: Ever use the covops, drone and energy parasitic subs?
Vimsy Vortis
Shoulda Checked Local
Break-A-Wish Foundation
#30 - 2012-01-31 05:12:04 UTC
Where did all of my cap go.
Selinate
#31 - 2012-01-31 05:12:47 UTC
I think a big point in this thread is that all of the T3 cruisers have some subsystems that could use a bit of tweaking.

The biggest thing is, for the huge investment in these ships (isk AND sp), they really should do a damned good job in anything they do. Maybe not completely surpass ships with specific functions, but definitely shouldn't be left so far behind that the subsystem is useless either.
Ioci
Bad Girl Posse
#32 - 2012-01-31 05:15:15 UTC
Teras Lakkos wrote:
Skydell wrote:
stuff



I think you are missing the point of this thread


No, actually you guys are missing the point of subsystems.

R.I.P. Vile Rat
Eternus8lux8lucis
Guardians of the Gate
RAZOR Alliance
#33 - 2012-01-31 09:10:58 UTC
Range for me wasnt as much of an issue but being able to use the drone and covert sub would be nice. Not having the option of drones, cloak and parasitic combo is the most frusterating part of the legion for me.

Have you heard anything I've said?

You said it's all circling the drain, the whole universe. Right?

That's right.

Had to end sometime.
Shivus Tao
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#34 - 2012-01-31 09:35:06 UTC
Tengu: The rich kid that just has girls fall all over him.

Loki: The joker that has to work the charm a bit.

Proteus: The slightly hefty kid that's rumored to be a monster in the sack

Legion: The one that overslept by 4 hours and never made it to the party.
Gnidex
Shadow Legion X
Seriously Suspicious
#35 - 2012-01-31 10:45:32 UTC
It is a blasphemy that you'r better off fitting autocannons on your cloaky legion than lasers. Selectable damage types, better tracking, easier to fit and the fact that by doing so you actually double the bonus the cloaky sub gives you (no cap use lulz) makes the amarrian inside me wonder why God hates us so much.

The dev that thought that up should be forced to fly a cloaky legion forever if he/she actually even plays this game.

Hell, i'd be happy if the neut sub would actually give you a bonus to range instead of cap drain since well, amarr is the easiest race to kite (an added bonus would be having lasers actually be useful due to longer optimals and the ability to neut out their cap for propulsion).
Eternus8lux8lucis
Guardians of the Gate
RAZOR Alliance
#36 - 2012-01-31 11:05:33 UTC
Shivus Tao wrote:
Tengu: The rich kid that just has girls fall all over him.

Loki: The joker that has to work the charm a bit.

Proteus: The slightly hefty kid that's rumored to be a monster in the sack

Legion: The one that overslept by 4 hours and never made it to the party.

Funny **** right there. That got a like.

Have you heard anything I've said?

You said it's all circling the drain, the whole universe. Right?

That's right.

Had to end sometime.
Adeena Torcfist
Right Hand Of The Legion.
Get Off My Lawn
#37 - 2012-01-31 13:12:39 UTC
still waiting on a developer to take a look at this thread & comment:

" we are aware of the flaws of the Legion & other T3 subsytems. a fix in the next update should rectify these problems. keep an eye out for our next blog on our T3 fine tuning "
Gnidex
Shadow Legion X
Seriously Suspicious
#38 - 2012-01-31 13:44:41 UTC
Adeena Torcfist wrote:
still waiting on a developer to take a look at this thread & comment:

" we are aware of the flaws of the Legion & other T3 subsytems. a fix in the next update should rectify these problems. keep an eye out for our next blog on our T3 fine tuning "


Sometimes silence can be an answer too.
The Snowman
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#39 - 2012-01-31 13:56:53 UTC
This is the first time I've heard anyone say anything bad about the legion. Im a Proteus pilot and I've never encounterd a legion Pilot who doesnt laugh and spit at the proteus .

Maybe you have discoverd some small area where the legion is worse.... but thats the whole point of ships, balance and variety in general. For every benefit a ship has, there should be a disadvantage as well.

It sounds to me like your saying the legion should be best at everything and have no negative's at all, which simply discredits your understanding of balance.
Teras Lakkos
SuperMassive Torque
#40 - 2012-01-31 17:39:29 UTC
The Snowman wrote:
This is the first time I've heard anyone say anything bad about the legion. Im a Proteus pilot and I've never encounterd a legion Pilot who doesnt laugh and spit at the proteus .

Maybe you have discoverd some small area where the legion is worse.... but thats the whole point of ships, balance and variety in general. For every benefit a ship has, there should be a disadvantage as well.

It sounds to me like your saying the legion should be best at everything and have no negative's at all, which simply discredits your understanding of balance.


Are these legions fitted with a cloak/drone or with the neut subsystem? Most likely not. I will reiterate the legion isnt a bad ship, it just fails with drones/cloak and the neut subsystem is way under powered.

Eve recons vs t3:
lachesis/aruzu 20% disruptor range/level vs 10% for proteus
Huginn/rapier 60% web range/level vs 30% for loki
Curse: 20% amount/level 40% range/level pilgrim 20% amount/level legion 10% amount/level
Caldari: ecm is bad mmmkay

as you can see t3 get half strength bonus in addition to losing the secondary ewar bonus. No big deal til you get to the curse vs pilgrim, where the pilgrim loses the range bonus. So the legion is a half bonused pilgrim. This is simply weak. Make the legion a half bonused curse with 20% range/level. Simple enough. Did I mention merging covops and drone sub? Blink
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