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Viator/"Blockade Runner" assistance
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Sethimothy
Chicken Manufacturing
#1 - 2012-01-25 16:10:02 UTC
I recently purchased a Viator, and am 12d away from being able to fit one the way I would like. This ship will predominantly be used to dip into lowsec, and will be replacing my Exequeror. However, I have a few questions I'm not getting great answers on. I will ask them broadly, at the risk of repeat info and in hopes that the cracks will fill themselves.

" -5% armor repairer duration per level"

Is there any reason at all to have an armor rep on an Industrial? Shouldn't I focus on a passive tank, coupled with GETTING THE EXPLETIVE OUT OF THERE? Or am I missing something?

" Can fit covert ops cloaks"

My experiences with cloaks was a Prototype Cloaking Device I had on an Iteron V. It was not a very good experience. How do covert ops cloaks differ from their lesser variants? How do I get the most out of it?

" Can use black-ops jump portals. "

What are these, and how can I use them?

Thank you for your time and consideration on these questions.
BrutalButFair
Fleet of the Damned
#2 - 2012-01-25 16:22:48 UTC  |  Edited by: BrutalButFair
Sethimothy wrote:
I recently purchased a Viator, and am 12d away from being able to fit one the way I would like. This ship will predominantly be used to dip into lowsec, and will be replacing my Exequeror. However, I have a few questions I'm not getting great answers on. I will ask them broadly, at the risk of repeat info and in hopes that the cracks will fill themselves.

" -5% armor repairer duration per level"

Is there any reason at all to have an armor rep on an Industrial? Shouldn't I focus on a passive tank, coupled with GETTING THE EXPLETIVE OUT OF THERE? Or am I missing something?

couldn't agree more.

" Can fit covert ops cloaks"

My experiences with cloaks was a Prototype Cloaking Device I had on an Iteron V. It was not a very good experience. How do covert ops cloaks differ from their lesser variants? How do I get the most out of it?

You can warp with a covert ops cloak

" Can use black-ops jump portals. "

What are these, and how can I use them?

Blackops are ships that can portal thru other ships just like a titan can only at a much shorter range.

Thank you for your time and consideration on these questions.
Derath Ellecon
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#3 - 2012-01-25 16:24:37 UTC
Sethimothy wrote:
I recently purchased a Viator, and am 12d away from being able to fit one the way I would like. This ship will predominantly be used to dip into lowsec, and will be replacing my Exequeror. However, I have a few questions I'm not getting great answers on. I will ask them broadly, at the risk of repeat info and in hopes that the cracks will fill themselves.

" -5% armor repairer duration per level"

Is there any reason at all to have an armor rep on an Industrial? Shouldn't I focus on a passive tank, coupled with GETTING THE EXPLETIVE OUT OF THERE? Or am I missing something?


No tank needed on a BR. If you are in a situation where you need a tank, you are dead anyhow

Sethimothy wrote:
" Can fit covert ops cloaks"

My experiences with cloaks was a Prototype Cloaking Device I had on an Iteron V. It was not a very good experience. How do covert ops cloaks differ from their lesser variants? How do I get the most out of it?


Covert ops cloaks allow you to warp cloaked. Jump through gate, warp, cloak.

Optionally, moon gatecamp as you leave.

Sethimothy wrote:
" Can use black-ops jump portals. "

What are these, and how can I use them?


Google it. Short answer, you need a toon with a black ops battleship that can create a Black ops portal, as well as another toon who can light a black ops cyno.
Kattshiro
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#4 - 2012-01-25 16:35:35 UTC
Uh no. No real reason to fit a repper. At that point unless it's a solo bird you're SOl and repping wont help. Better to fit agility mods than an armor repper in the low.

and yeah covops cloaks allow for warping cloaked.

Any cyno stuff you need another account or friend.
Zhilia Mann
Tide Way Out Productions
#5 - 2012-01-25 16:36:27 UTC  |  Edited by: Zhilia Mann
I wrote something up on cloaks last week. Basically, if you can fit a covops cloak, you want to fit a covops cloak. Because I can't seem to make links work, try just clicking this:

https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=636782#post636782

As already mentioned, the active tanking bonus is garbage. The jump bridge bit is something you don't need to worry about yet, but in a nutshell a Black Ops can open a bridge between it and a cyno field that allows ships to jump directly, bypassing gates. Only certain ships can go through the portal; Blockade Runners happen to be on that list. It's of fairly situational usefulness to start with, though, and this is yet another aspect of the game where if you don't know how to make it work, it probably isn't going to work for you in the first place. Annoying answer, but true.

Edit: CCP, can you please at least fix the forums so that links work to other pages on the damn forums?
Tarunik Raqalth'Qui
Native Freshfood
Minmatar Republic
#6 - 2012-01-25 20:01:31 UTC
In turn:


  • Yes, the BR active tank bonus is useless. I'd much rather have seen a 5%/level agility bonus in its place, but then they'd probably be too slippery...
  • Covops cloaks have 0 (you got that right, 0) speed penalty, will let you warp while cloaked, and also have a much shorter (5-6s) recal delay than T1 (Prototype) or T2 (Improved) cloaks. This combined with the frigate-esque speed and agility (as well as the align, MWD, cloak trick) will allow you to laugh at all but the very best gatecamps in lowsec and (combined with some smart flying) many types of 0.0 camp setups as well.
  • Black Ops Battleships can create covert jumpbridges to covert (and regular!) cynosural fields. Covert jumpbridges (like the Black Ops jumpdrive) have a short range compared to their Titan counterparts, and are only usable by covert-cloaked ships (covops, stealth bomber, force recon, blockade runner, covert T3, and maybe other black ops). Admittedly, jumpbridging blockade runners isn't used very often (the best idea I could think of would be as a cloaky, portable torps/ammo/bombs/paste/jumpfuel can for a Black Ops/Stealth Bomber gang).
Arele
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#7 - 2012-01-25 20:31:29 UTC
There's certain areas where black ops bridging a BR can save a number of jumps, as well you can avoid some instant death 0.0 camps with it if you really need to get a haul in / out. They're also sometimes brought along with BO drop gangs for hauling topes / loot.

The active tanking bonuses on the hulls are pretty much useless as stated above.
Lili Lu
#8 - 2012-01-25 20:41:59 UTC
Sethimothy wrote:
I recently purchased a Viator, and am 12d away from being able to fit one the way I would like. This ship will predominantly be used to dip into lowsec, and will be replacing my Exequeror. However, I have a few questions I'm not getting great answers on. I will ask them broadly, at the risk of repeat info and in hopes that the cracks will fill themselves.

" -5% armor repairer duration per level"

Is there any reason at all to have an armor rep on an Industrial? Shouldn't I focus on a passive tank, coupled with GETTING THE EXPLETIVE OUT OF THERE? Or am I missing something?

Yes, the bonus is completely useless and I remember pointing this situation out to devs on the old forums. I tried to tell them that on a blockade runner the lows were only ever going to be fitted either with cargo expanders or agility/speed mods. Unforutnately they were still stuck in thinking "but it's a Gallente ship and that is a Gallente tanking bonus."Roll BTW, it's not as critical in low sec as it is in nullsec, but killboards are littered with fools who fit all their lows with cargo expanders and all their rig slots with cargo rigs thinking that the cloak alone would save them.Lol

Sethimothy wrote:
" Can fit covert ops cloaks"

My experiences with cloaks was a Prototype Cloaking Device I had on an Iteron V. It was not a very good experience. How do covert ops cloaks differ from their lesser variants? How do I get the most out of it?
Cov ops cloaks allow you to warp cloaked. This is a big deal. Make sure you have the skills for a cov ops cloak and have one fit, otherwise you will be horribly laughed at for a good long time. Basically you jump into system and click warp to and immediately the cloak module. In null sec you have to align to, mwd, cloak usally to get out of a bubble then warp. This is where many of the tards that maxed their m3 for cargo get caught. Of course there are some other tricks to not getting ganked in null in a blockade runner but those who need to know already probably know. If everything was posted on the forums then gatecamps would be even more Sadface affairs than they already are. Seeing as you are low sec flying you won't have to worry about bubbles.

Sethimothy wrote:
" Can use black-ops jump portals. "

What are these, and how can I use them?

Thank you for your time and consideration on these questions.

Black ops BSs have bridging they can do like titans but only with ships that can warp cloaked. Most often this is bombers and recons. Sometimes a Blockade runner will tag along with extra bombs in the cargohold. And agin this is mostly a nullsec mechanic so you will not need to worry about it unless you move out there.

You're welcome Smile
Hijeri
Interstellar Manufacturing of Gravity Aided Yields
#9 - 2012-01-26 13:25:11 UTC
Also, if you fit expanded cargo hold modules and/or rigs on a BR, you are an idiot.
Sethimothy
Chicken Manufacturing
#10 - 2012-01-27 15:49:48 UTC
Hijeri wrote:
Also, if you fit expanded cargo hold modules and/or rigs on a BR, you are an idiot.


I'm curious about your opinion on this. Obviously the point of a blockade runner is to move stuff quickly, so using low slots to expand cargospace is counter-intuitive (barring specific situations like running a mission where you need that extra space.) But why not rigs? The set-up I'm planning on using has a a low friction nozzle and a medium cargohold expander, for example. A number of set-ups I've seen, killboards and elsewhere, all have differing opinions on what rigs to use... but they all have them.

While it's some time off before I have the optimum fit I'd like for this ship, I've been able to fit it reasonably well so far and I'm pleased with the results. The Covert Ops cloak really is different from the Proto Cloak I was used to, and makes a large difference. I'm still getting the hang of things, of course. I doubt I'll be going into nul-sec with this ship before my skills (training wise and playing wise) get better, for obvious reasons.

Thank you all again for your responses. I'd done some basic research into things like the black-ops portals, but have never seen them applied, so your feedback really pointed me in the right direction.
Cyniac
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#11 - 2012-01-27 17:14:22 UTC
Just a simple note on tanking viators -

The tank on a Viator has really only two uses:

1) If you plan to take it somewhere were it *might* get shot at by NPCs - then it can help. (There are a few situations where you might just want to do that)

2) Helps to make suicide ganks in highsec a bit harder (Jita - I'm thinking of you)

If a gang catches you in low/null then your tank, whatever it is, is unlikely to make much difference. (With exception of a silly frig solo tackling you next to sentry guns in lowsec... but pilots tend to learn pretty fast that's not a good idea).

With that in mind - you want to tank for buffer and resists. Shield tank can work. Forget everything else, and it's even better if you are using passive resists.

What *really* helps on a viator:

1) That cov-ops cloak. It's a must. Get it.
2) A propulsion module - they increase your GTFO ability which is a good thing.

Low slots depends really on how much you need to haul. My little viators need to haul cruiser hulls around the universe so that means they are going to have cargo rigs to make that happen. If you need to haul less, then there are other options available for the lows / rigs which include:

Rigs / modules to increase agility and/or speed.
WCS (Warp Core Stabilizers) -- Transport ships are one of the few ships where a WCS is somewhat justified.


Viators are sturdy little ship. They are hard to catch and most of the time if they are caught it's due to a piloting error on the side of the viator pilot.
Newbie Ned
Real Nice And Laidback Corporation
#12 - 2012-01-27 19:37:33 UTC
Well that was pretty unique there - a thread where everyone agreed - until Hijeri chipped in!

Personally I think you should fit cargo expander rigs and low slots as required. In low sec its a no brainer - you can't get caught unless you screw up or get system issues such as lag.

In 0.0 it is a different story - full expander fit adds significant risk due to the loss of speed/agility to get out of bubbles and into warp. Sometimes it's worth it, sometimes it isn't!