These forums have been archived and are now read-only.

The new forums are live and can be found at https://forums.eveonline.com/

EVE General Discussion

 
  • Topic is locked indefinitely.
 

the dumbing down of names to bring in new blood?

First post
Author
Previous Topic Next Topic
CCP Greyscale
C C P
C C P Alliance
#41 - 2012-01-26 10:25:47 UTC
The less time you have to spend fighting the game, the more time you have left over to play it. Any simplification which increases the amount of time players can be interacting with each other, while keeping the interaction sufficiently interesting, is a good simplification.

Or, put another way, how good a player you are should be defined by how good your decisions are, not by how many tasks and lists you've memorized.

(We could add a window that doesn't let you undock until you can identify the NPC corp a random logo belongs to, and people could spend a lot of time learning all the logos, and become "really good" at "the undock quiz", but it would still be a terrible mechanic.)
Ciar Meara
PIE Inc.
Khimi Harar
#42 - 2012-01-26 10:45:34 UTC  |  Edited by: Ciar Meara
OP: If you think the game got easier because somebody changed the name of a module you are not playing EVE.

- [img]http://go-dl1.eve-files.com/media/corp/janus/ceosig.jpg[/img] [yellow]English only please. Zymurgist[/yellow]
DarkAegix
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#43 - 2012-01-26 10:47:23 UTC
CCP Greyscale wrote:
(We could add a window that doesn't let you undock until you can identify the NPC corp a random logo belongs to, and people could spend a lot of time learning all the logos, and become "really good" at "the undock quiz", but it would still be a terrible mechanic.)

Quizzes are fun!
EVE needs more mandatory quizzes!
Kata Amentis
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#44 - 2012-01-26 10:52:25 UTC
CCP Greyscale wrote:

We could add a window that doesn't let you undock until you can identify the NPC corp a random logo belongs to, and people could spend a lot of time learning all the logos, and become "really good" at "the undock quiz", but it would still be a terrible mechanic.


maybe not for a undock quiz.... but put that kind of thing on a trivia game in the WiS "pub" establishment and you've got a fun game that's better than the ship spinning counter! ... might want to add to the categories though, just corp logos would get boring after a while Lol

Curiosity killed the Kata... ... but being immortal he wasn't too worried about keeping a count.
Cryten Jones
Advantage Inc
#45 - 2012-01-26 10:52:59 UTC
CCP Greyscale wrote:
The less time you have to spend fighting the game, the more time you have left over to play it. Any simplification which increases the amount of time players can be interacting with each other, while keeping the interaction sufficiently interesting, is a good simplification.

Or, put another way, how good a player you are should be defined by how good your decisions are, not by how many tasks and lists you've memorized.

(We could add a window that doesn't let you undock until you can identify the NPC corp a random logo belongs to, and people could spend a lot of time learning all the logos, and become "really good" at "the undock quiz", but it would still be a terrible mechanic.)




Don't disagree with you but would rather that the little things that make this a believable world to live in don't all get removed in favor of easy to understand names.

The old names had a 'product feel' about them

-CJ
Vera Algaert
Republic University
Minmatar Republic
#46 - 2012-01-26 10:56:49 UTC  |  Edited by: Vera Algaert
CCP Greyscale wrote:

(We could add a window that doesn't let you undock until you can identify the NPC corp a random logo belongs to, and people could spend a lot of time learning all the logos, and become "really good" at "the undock quiz", but it would still be a terrible mechanic.)

http://phase.org/Eve/ShipQuiz/

one of my first CEOs actually made us practice with this Straight

(his idea was a sound one - you have to know the different ships/shiptypes to be a good scout;
but memorizing that "the chimera is a caldari carrier" when you have never seen a chimera and have no idea what a carrier is supposed to do in EVE was a little stupid^^)

.
Fix Lag
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#47 - 2012-01-26 11:04:42 UTC
Instead of giving everything a generic and terrible name, you could've renamed it slightly to something like "1 MN Inferior Catalyzed Cold Gas Arcjet Thrusters" and "1 MN Superior Catalyzed Cold Gas Arcjet Thrusters" and people would be able to figure out the damn difference without being treated like idiots. Or you could've put in the description something that made the superior one sound better so people would take the hint. But no. You chose the literal dumb route and made things for stupid people.

I have some bad news for you, Greyscale. Eve doesn't tolerate stupid people, and renaming modules isn't gonna help said morons. I don't know why I'm telling you this because you work on a game whose learning curve made it famous, but then again, you guys thought the NeX store was brilliant too. vOv some people, you just can't reach.

CCP mostly sucks at their job, but Veritas is a pretty cool dude.
Disdaine
#48 - 2012-01-26 11:21:11 UTC  |  Edited by: Disdaine
Is not simple enuff.

I suggest followink meta level naming convention :

Afterburner
Better Afterburner
More Betterer Afterburner
Bestest Afterburner

Der will be no confusion anymore.
Niko Takahashi
Yoshitomi Group
#49 - 2012-01-26 11:55:29 UTC
Bloodpetal wrote:
CCP Lemur wrote:
Vera Algaert wrote:
there is complexity that revolves around decisions and trade-offs.

then there is complexity that revolves around memorizing random stuff.

One type adds to the game, the other doesn't.


This fine lady hits the point home. Yes, people love the old names and we all got accustomed to them since back in the days. But I like the new system way better since I don't have to go through dozens of clicks and comparisons to find the thing I want. So no meaningful complexity at all is lost only a naming scheme that was based on randomness alone.


Except now you can't find the missile type you want without sorting through another dozen missile types you don't want.

Mjolnir Rocket is insufficient because it doesn't show the t2 variants because the naming scheme doesn't match.

And still, Trauma is an awful name, and Nova is just... ya.

Nova means "new". It doesn't mean anything to do with thermic reactions. "Supernova" has to do with the birth of a star.

"Nova Torpedo" means "New Torpedo".


The names are stupid. Seriously, straight out. Change them again to something that isn't useless.

Also, there is no reason that "Guided Missiles" and "unguided missiles" should share the same names anyways. They're very different. This whole "I want EM missiles to share the same name" needs to have been handled a different way.



Wow a voice of reason in the forums pretty much what ther person said.
Naming conventions should be adjusted I agree with CCP on that but could have been done better
DarkAegix
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#50 - 2012-01-26 11:59:30 UTC
Bloodpetal wrote:

"Nova Torpedo" means "New Torpedo".


The names are stupid. Seriously, straight out. Change them again to something that isn't useless.

A 'nova' is also a cataclysmic nuclear explosion in a star.
Not to be confused with supernova, which is just a much, much, much more powerful variety.
Lilly Shiroimozu
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#51 - 2012-01-26 12:02:19 UTC
I think this could have been handled better by keeping the flavor text in the titles but adding the damage type somewhere within it so they were easily distinguishable/searchable.

I.E. Thorn kinetic rockets I, Flamebusrt thermal rockets I etc.

P.S. trauma is a horrible name.


As for the AB/MWD I miss the flavor titles, and the same thing could have been applied having a quality descriptor added to the flavor titles so they are easy to distinguish/search but retain their charm. (also the new names pretty much make no sense as I cant determine if limited, prototype or experimental is supposed to be the top tier in either category)

It would be better to have something like
stabalized
Improved
accelerated
optimized
as the quality descriptors and add them tot he flavor titles so you stilll have the flavor, but you have a common quality word to seach for and remember.

I.E 1MN Catalyzed Cold-Gas I Arcjet Optimized Thrusters etc,..
Ravcharas
Infinite Point
Pandemic Horde
#52 - 2012-01-26 12:04:16 UTC  |  Edited by: Ravcharas
CCP Greyscale wrote:
The less time you have to spend fighting the game, the more time you have left over to play it. Any simplification which increases the amount of time players can be interacting with each other, while keeping the interaction sufficiently interesting, is a good simplification.

Or, put another way, how good a player you are should be defined by how good your decisions are, not by how many tasks and lists you've memorized.

(We could add a window that doesn't let you undock until you can identify the NPC corp a random logo belongs to, and people could spend a lot of time learning all the logos, and become "really good" at "the undock quiz", but it would still be a terrible mechanic.)


"Quad LiF Fueled Booster Rockets" are now known as "Prototype 100MN MicroWarpdrive I
"Catalyzed Cold-Gas Arcjet Thrusters" are now known as "Limited 1MN MicroWarpdrive I"
"Y-T8 Overcharged Hydrocarbon Microwarpdrive" are now known as "Experimental 10MN MicroWarpdrive I"

These are the meta mwd modules you usually go with. The prefix is different for all three sizes and are in no way aptly named. Limited sounds like something you'd rather not use, gotta be a downside with one of those.

How is this a simplification? You've traded one set of obfuscating names for another, confusing old players without helping new players one iota.
Something Random
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#53 - 2012-01-26 12:22:16 UTC
Alara IonStorm wrote:
Roosterton wrote:

LET'S MAKE A FORUM THREAD ABOUT THIS!

No the five people who care won't be able to convince CCP like that.

THEY SHOULD MAKE FIFTEEN EACH AND EACH ONE AFTER THE OTHER NEEDS TO BE FARTHER AWAY FROM REALITY THEN THE LAST!

Missiles have been renamed EVE is Dead.


OK - were getting a consensus going here....

Lets make threads people!!! THIS is SERIOUS BUSINESS!!!!!

"caught on fire a little bit, just a little."

"Delinquents, check, weirdos, check, hippies, check, pillheads, check, freaks, check, potheads, check .....gangs all here!"

I love Science, it gives me a Hadron.
Reilly Duvolle
Hydra Squadron
#54 - 2012-01-26 12:26:13 UTC  |  Edited by: Reilly Duvolle
Ravcharas wrote:


How is this a simplification? You've traded one set of obfuscating names for another, confusing old players without helping new players one iota.


It is a simplification once you consider that all meta items in the game will be renamed in this way. I.e. all meta 4 items will be "prototype" ones.

Personally I support these changes, for reasons given by Greyscale. Complexity is good, but only if it enhances gameplay. One point though Greyscale, if you are still monitoring this thread, is that once again CCP fails at communication. The player reaction to this change - given that people are heavily invested in the game for years - should have been pretty predictable. Yet you just do it, without prior communication.

But since you are planning to do this change all across the board, I strongly advise you to train player communication to level 5. Come on mate, you dont want to leave an essential support skill like that at level 2.
Siigari Kitawa
New Eden Archery Club
#55 - 2012-01-26 12:37:22 UTC
DUMBING DOWN EVE IS NOT THE ANSWER TO YOUR PROBLEMS CCP (whatever problems they may be.)

Need stuff moved? Push Industries will handle it. Serving highsec, lowsec and nullsec - and we do it faster and more reliably than anyone else. Ingame channel: PUSHX
Revajin
Doomheim
#56 - 2012-01-26 12:52:01 UTC
Are you guys seriously crying now because of the name change? You people will ***** about anything. The game hasn't changed because Catalyzed Cold Gas Arc-Jet Thrusters are now called what...Limited 1MN Microwarpdrive?

Wait a second. Holy **** that's way easier to understand. Now I know its a microwarpdrive, I know a general power comparison to other microwarpdrives, and I know by the fluff adjective that it is slightly different than the typical module. But no, you guys are right, having a new player learn what a Catalyzed Cold Gas Arc-Jet Thruster is definitely seems more important.
Imuran
Zentor Industries
#57 - 2012-01-26 12:57:23 UTC
CCP Greyscale wrote:
The less time you have to spend fighting the game, the more time you have left over to play it. Any simplification which increases the amount of time players can be interacting with each other, while keeping the interaction sufficiently interesting, is a good simplification.

Or, put another way, how good a player you are should be defined by how good your decisions are, not by how many tasks and lists you've memorized.


So the Science and Industry dialogs are high on your list for streamlining? or is it the view that industrialists dont need to interact with other players?
Solstice Project
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#58 - 2012-01-26 12:58:41 UTC
Making stuff sound less interesting sure in hell
will attract people... *rollseyes*
Dr Sodius
#59 - 2012-01-26 13:03:52 UTC
this thread....not sure if serious.....
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#60 - 2012-01-26 13:04:15 UTC
Solstice Project wrote:
Making stuff sound less interesting sure in hell
will attract people... *rollseyes*
It certainly won't drive them away.