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Server cycle time vs. module cycle time
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M'ktakh
Republic University
Minmatar Republic
#1 - 2012-01-25 22:48:54 UTC
Potentially stupid question based on outdated or wrong knowledge. Will take full responsibility in that case.

So, IIRC, the server has a base frequency of 1Hz, or something like that.

Modules, however, have a frequency (1/repetition time, whatever is convenient to you) that is not an integer multiple of 1. (Aka they have repetition times of x.4123 seconds)

So is there a way to calculate the actual frequency of the modules? How does this all work out. Horribile dcitu, is it worth to train skills beyond the integer point (beyond the point where cycle time goes from x to x-1.54534 seconds)?
Dark Pangolin
The Tuskers
The Tuskers Co.
#2 - 2012-01-25 23:02:42 UTC
M'ktakh wrote:
Potentially stupid question based on outdated or wrong knowledge. Will take full responsibility in that case.

So, IIRC, the server has a base frequency of 1Hz, or something like that.

Modules, however, have a frequency (1/repetition time, whatever is convenient to you) that is not an integer multiple of 1. (Aka they have repetition times of x.4123 seconds)

So is there a way to calculate the actual frequency of the modules? How does this all work out. Horribile dcitu, is it worth to train skills beyond the integer point (beyond the point where cycle time goes from x to x-1.54534 seconds)?


I don't know, but its a valid question. I wonder if that runs on the client side or the server side...QUICKLY FORUM PROGRAMMING PEOPLE GIVE US THE ANSWER!
Liang Nuren
No Salvation
Divine Damnation
#3 - 2012-01-25 23:07:04 UTC
CCP has confirmed that this happens on the server because the clients are effectively 'dumb'.

-Liang

Ed: They have also confirmed that 1 / repetition time works.

I'm an idiot, don't mind me.
DarkAegix
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#4 - 2012-01-25 23:08:29 UTC
M'ktakh wrote:
is it worth to train skills beyond the integer point (beyond the point where cycle time goes from x to x-1.54534 seconds)?

Question
Wouldn't the cycle time of the module need to be less than 1 second, before we should even bother considering whether it's server or client side?

I've probably misread your whole post. Ugh
M'ktakh
Republic University
Minmatar Republic
#5 - 2012-01-25 23:09:27 UTC
Liang Nuren wrote:
CCP has confirmed that this happens on the server because the clients are effectively 'dumb'.

-Liang

Ed: They have also confirmed that 1 / repetition time works.



So, whats the real cycle time? It cant be module time, since I, and I think everyone else, have seen the "progress bar" fill up further and further with each shot/cycle/whatever.
Liang Nuren
No Salvation
Divine Damnation
#6 - 2012-01-25 23:14:26 UTC
CCP has confirmed that cycle times work as expected and I've validated things like shield booster tank and weapon DPS. I think where things like server cycle time come into play is on module activation... though I have to admit that I didn't actually ask whether they used server receipt timestamp as the activation time. :-/

Suffice it to say that just because the server has a 1hz cycle time doesn't mean that 1hz is the minimum cycle time. :)

-Liang

I'm an idiot, don't mind me.
Dark Pangolin
The Tuskers
The Tuskers Co.
#7 - 2012-01-25 23:20:25 UTC
Liang Nuren wrote:
CCP has confirmed that cycle times work as expected and I've validated things like shield booster tank and weapon DPS. I think where things like server cycle time come into play is on module activation... though I have to admit that I didn't actually ask whether they used server receipt timestamp as the activation time. :-/

Suffice it to say that just because the server has a 1hz cycle time doesn't mean that 1hz is the minimum cycle time. :)

-Liang


Indeed, I tend to lean towards the idea that once the server acknowledges that you did something, it tracks the time and effects appropriately from that point...but that nasty little lag monster can make that "acknowledge" part super fun in pvp :)
M'ktakh
Republic University
Minmatar Republic
#8 - 2012-01-25 23:21:41 UTC
So while they, once activated, cycle with their native frequency, the activating clicks only start at each server tick?

Then why do I see the cycle bar fill up more and more with each shot? On the first shot, the shot and the cycle starts indication (no glowy ring) coincide. Then, on let n-th shot, I see the ring rise to 20-25% when the actual shot catches up.


(appologies for the obtuse wording, should go to bed and/or study)
Liang Nuren
No Salvation
Divine Damnation
#9 - 2012-01-25 23:26:09 UTC  |  Edited by: Liang Nuren
Uh, can you video what you're talking about because I really have no clue? It sounds like its something on the client which has been totally and utterly confirmed by CCP Sreegs (and others) as being a 'dumb terminal'.

-Liang

I'm an idiot, don't mind me.
stoicfaux
#10 - 2012-01-26 00:09:45 UTC  |  Edited by: stoicfaux
The green ring around the module button that indicates how far into the cycle the module is. It turns red with you disable the module. The problem is that "rings" don't necessarily start and stop at the middle bottom of the module button.

Could be a synch issue. It may or may not have been fixed/improved by this in the patch: "The clock of clients is now synchronized regularly with the server to reduce problems (like freezes at jumping) caused by unstable client clocks."


As for the original topic, if you look at the LogServer, your module cycle times have sub-second timestamps. So while the server may "tick" at 1 hertz, I think it's processing events in order and in sub-second intervals but updates are sent out and positions in space are processed at 1 hertz. Or not. We really need a dev to confirm.


edit: An example of the 1 hertz effect is when you try to fire multiple missiles in a staggered sequence. If you press F1 and F2 too close together, then the two missiles seems to get automatically combined into a single group. I'm not sure if the server handles them as a group or as individual missiles. Might be worth testing with the LogServer.

Pon Farr Memorial: once every 7 years, all the carebears in high-sec must PvP or they will be temp-banned.
Abdiel Kavash
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#11 - 2012-01-26 03:07:35 UTC
The simulation itself runs "smoothly" - by smoothly I mean at least a dozen ticks per second. Otherwise you would see ships spazzing around once a second. The thing that happens only once per second is the simulation considering new input. So the server gets the commands from all the players, and then lets the simulation run on its own for a while (one second) before accepting new input.

So if a hypothetical module has a cycle time of 0.5 seconds, you can activate it and run it for 10 seconds, and it will activate exactly 20 times. But you can't deactivate it right after the 21st activation, as the server will only process your command at the whole second.