These forums have been archived and are now read-only.

The new forums are live and can be found at https://forums.eveonline.com/

Ships & Modules

 
  • Topic is locked indefinitely.
 

Shield tanked Gallente carrier?
Author
Previous Topic Next Topic
Denuo Secus
#1 - 2012-01-24 15:33:16 UTC
Hi,

sub capital Gallente ships are quite usable when shield tanked. I was wondering if it would make any sense to shield tank a Thanatos. Seeing the latest capital shield transfer and shield hardener changes it would be an option maybe?

Idea is to fit into a shield fleet. How would a Thanatos perform here?

Thanks for not trolling me Big smile
Luba Cibre
Global Song Setup
#2 - 2012-01-24 15:34:26 UTC
I've never heard of a shield tanked thanatos, but you can shield tank the moros.

"Nothing essential happens in the absence of noise." 
Denuo Secus
#3 - 2012-01-24 15:37:37 UTC
Luba Cibre wrote:
...but you can shield tank the moros.


Active shield tanking oder just a huge buffer?
Luba Cibre
Global Song Setup
#4 - 2012-01-24 15:38:39 UTC
Active of course.
It's a ******* dread and can't be repped while sieged.

"Nothing essential happens in the absence of noise." 
mxzf
Shovel Bros
#5 - 2012-01-24 16:51:08 UTC
Here's the big question: Why? If you're doing it because that's how you flew your Domi/Ishtar, that's probably the wrong reason. It kinda makes sense on the Moros because that way it can fit pure gank with MagStabs in the lows instead of worrying about the tank, but carriers don't get damage bonuses from their low slots.

The only reasons I can think of to shield-tank a Thanny is: a. If you're in Angel space and you want to use the higher natural Exp resists (though I'd need to look at the numbers to see if it would work well). b. If the fleet you're flying with is mostly Chimeras and is shield tanking. Other than that, or you just not having any armor skills to begin with (which should be remedied anyways if that's the case), I can't see why you would need to shield tank a Thanny.

I suppose it falls under the "It would probably work, if you have a good enough reason to need to" category.
Cambarus
The Baros Syndicate
#6 - 2012-01-24 17:13:30 UTC
The irony here is that the active tank on a dread makes such a small difference that even in small scale engagements it doesnt really matter. I don't have access to EFT from here but if you look at the extra buffer you gain from replacing reps with more resists/buffer, I'd wager that you'll find that even if you start getting shot at the start of your siege cycle, you'd STILL be better off fitting for pure buffer most of the time.

That said, if memory serves, short of having a slave set your best bet in terms of how long you'll survive in a decent sized fleet fight vs your own damage output, hull rankings actually keeps you alive the longest (assuming you were going to die enforce your cycle ends ) Not that I'd recommend it,given the bonuses from titans and gang links.

As for the question t hand, shield tanking a thanny is definitely doable (same slot layout as the nid if memory serves),the main advantage being that it has more cap. It might be worth looking into for a triage thanny, but then I can't run the numbers. From here so I can't be sure.
Denuo Secus
#7 - 2012-01-24 17:19:18 UTC
mxzf wrote:
Here's the big question: Why? If you're doing it because that's how you flew your Domi/Ishtar, that's probably the wrong reason. It kinda makes sense on the Moros because that way it can fit pure gank with MagStabs in the lows instead of worrying about the tank, but carriers don't get damage bonuses from their low slots.

The only reasons I can think of to shield-tank a Thanny is: a. If you're in Angel space and you want to use the higher natural Exp resists (though I'd need to look at the numbers to see if it would work well). b. If the fleet you're flying with is mostly Chimeras and is shield tanking. Other than that, or you just not having any armor skills to begin with (which should be remedied anyways if that's the case), I can't see why you would need to shield tank a Thanny.

I suppose it falls under the "It would probably work, if you have a good enough reason to need to" category.


Indeed, a (triage) armor rep Thanatos is able to support a pure shield gang quite well since it has bonus to shield transfer. Reason for considering a local shield tank are other shield RR carriers in our fleet. If the whole fleet is shield..a friendly Nid would waste valueable shield transfers only for me as armor tank. Not to speak of the Chimera ofc.
Cambarus
The Baros Syndicate
#8 - 2012-01-24 17:40:17 UTC
Denuo Secus wrote:
mxzf wrote:
Here's the big question: Why? If you're doing it because that's how you flew your Domi/Ishtar, that's probably the wrong reason. It kinda makes sense on the Moros because that way it can fit pure gank with MagStabs in the lows instead of worrying about the tank, but carriers don't get damage bonuses from their low slots.

The only reasons I can think of to shield-tank a Thanny is: a. If you're in Angel space and you want to use the higher natural Exp resists (though I'd need to look at the numbers to see if it would work well). b. If the fleet you're flying with is mostly Chimeras and is shield tanking. Other than that, or you just not having any armor skills to begin with (which should be remedied anyways if that's the case), I can't see why you would need to shield tank a Thanny.

I suppose it falls under the "It would probably work, if you have a good enough reason to need to" category.


Indeed, a (triage) armor rep Thanatos is able to support a pure shield gang quite well since it has bonus to shield transfer. Reason for considering a local shield tank are other shield RR carriers in our fleet. If the whole fleet is shield..a friendly Nid would waste valueable shield transfers only for me as armor tank. Not to speak of the Chimera ofc.

Lone trage carriers get no remote reps. Because of this it may well be viable to shield tank a thanny even in an armor fleet, since your buddies won't be repping you anyway. ( provided that it's a fairly small fleet)
Wacktopia
Fleet-Up.com
Keep It Simple Software Group
#9 - 2012-01-24 17:42:08 UTC
Discussion on shield tanking Dreads.

Kitchen sink? Seriousy, get your ship together -  Fleet-Up.com
Wilddragon25
B.A.S.E.D
The Initiative.
#10 - 2012-01-24 23:23:51 UTC
I just played with a fit tool on my phone(at work). And reasonably the only way I find a sheild tanking thanny viable is a passive recharge only issue with that is any RR will cap out rather quickly. Either way you severely suffer cap problems, with an armour tank you can effectively run either single rep plus remote transfer or dual rep cap stable. Only carriers I know that can effectively pull crazy wtf triple local rep fits or double plus remote stable are archon and nid.
Cambarus
The Baros Syndicate
#11 - 2012-01-25 01:07:45 UTC
Wilddragon25 wrote:
I just played with a fit tool on my phone(at work). And reasonably the only way I find a sheild tanking thanny viable is a passive recharge only issue with that is any RR will cap out rather quickly. Either way you severely suffer cap problems, with an armour tank you can effectively run either single rep plus remote transfer or dual rep cap stable. Only carriers I know that can effectively pull crazy wtf triple local rep fits or double plus remote stable are archon and nid.

Some eft whoring (not saying the fit is viable, frankly I'm not well versed enough in triage carrier fits to say):

Lows filled with Cap power relay IIs

1 cap recharger
CSB I
2 invulns
SBA II

Triage mod, 2 cap remote armor reps, other highs to taste.

3 CCCs

I then compared that fit to a watered down version of what R&K use (or used, been a while since I checked) and used t2 mods and no pills/gang bonuses (same basic fit though)

This fit gave me ~7600DPS tanked locally on the shield thanny, and ~8600 on the armor tanked one (though they overload to the same amount of about 11.2k each, with the shield one pulling slightly ahead)

HOWEVER, the shield thanny has 634 cap/second recharge rate, while the armor thanny has only 516, meaning the shield one can permanently run 2 remote reps while the armor one cannot (caps out in a bit under 7 minutes)

Not sure I'd use such a setup, but in theory at least it seems reasonable.
Wilddragon25
B.A.S.E.D
The Initiative.
#12 - 2012-01-25 02:58:41 UTC
The setup we commonly use involves a dual repped thanny with 2 remote armour reps and 2 cap transfer, this is isnt a triage fit so much as a spider tanking fit. When shooting both cap transfers with other carriers it is cap stable running all mods, when not chaining cap it is stable running one remote and one local or both local. Honestly the thanny is a viable sheild tanker but the slot layout favors armour tanking.
Cambarus
The Baros Syndicate
#13 - 2012-01-25 04:50:15 UTC
Wilddragon25 wrote:
The setup we commonly use involves a dual repped thanny with 2 remote armour reps and 2 cap transfer, this is isnt a triage fit so much as a spider tanking fit. When shooting both cap transfers with other carriers it is cap stable running all mods, when not chaining cap it is stable running one remote and one local or both local. Honestly the thanny is a viable sheild tanker but the slot layout favors armour tanking.

I'm going to put this as gently as I can:
I looked at your KB, and going by what I saw, you have no business offering people advice on how to fit their pvp ships.
Jack Miton
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#14 - 2012-01-25 06:36:13 UTC
Works fine:

Quote:
[Thanatos, Triage, Shield]
Dark Blood Capacitor Power Relay
Dark Blood Capacitor Power Relay
Dark Blood Capacitor Power Relay
Dark Blood Capacitor Power Relay
Dark Blood Capacitor Power Relay
Dark Blood Capacitor Power Relay

Capital Neutron Saturation Injector I
Shield Boost Amplifier II
Invulnerability Field II
Invulnerability Field II
Cap Recharger II

Capital Murky Shield Screen Transmitter I
Capital Murky Shield Screen Transmitter I
Imperial Navy Large EMP Smartbomb
Imperial Navy Large EMP Smartbomb
Triage Module II

Large Capacitor Control Circuit II
Large Capacitor Control Circuit II
Large Capacitor Control Circuit I


Only place it's worth using it is a Pulsar WH and even then only for 40days while you train Chimera skills.

There is no Bob.

Stuck In Here With Me:  http://sihwm.blogspot.com.au/

Down the Pipe:  http://feeds.feedburner.com/CloakyScout
AstarothPrime
Pecunia Infinita
#15 - 2012-01-25 09:02:59 UTC
Problem with shield cap mods is:

CPU !!!!

You can barely properly fit chimera which has much more CPU then any of other carriers... let alone thanatos, while archon and nid basically cant be properly fit for triage in shield tanked versions...

I.
Cambarus
The Baros Syndicate
#16 - 2012-01-25 15:34:29 UTC
AstarothPrime wrote:
Problem with shield cap mods is:

CPU !!!!

You can barely properly fit chimera which has much more CPU then any of other carriers... let alone thanatos, while archon and nid basically cant be properly fit for triage in shield tanked versions...

I.

If I'm not mistaken CCP is actually reducing the CPU needs of capital shield mods, and the changes are already on sisi.
mxzf
Shovel Bros
#17 - 2012-01-25 17:00:54 UTC  |  Edited by: mxzf
Cambarus wrote:
AstarothPrime wrote:
Problem with shield cap mods is:

CPU !!!!

You can barely properly fit chimera which has much more CPU then any of other carriers... let alone thanatos, while archon and nid basically cant be properly fit for triage in shield tanked versions...

I.

If I'm not mistaken CCP is actually reducing the CPU needs of capital shield mods, and the changes are already on sisi.


Crucible 1.1 Patch Notes wrote:
We have made a slight decrease to the CPU requirements of all capital shield transfer modules.


I would have rathered if they had included the numbers though, since I don't have the client on this comp ATM, lol.