These forums have been archived and are now read-only.

The new forums are live and can be found at https://forums.eveonline.com/

EVE General Discussion

 
  • Topic is locked indefinitely.
 

0.0 fix - Nurf Moon Goo!!
Author
Previous Topic Next Topic
Rixiu
PonyTek
#21 - 2012-01-24 12:54:48 UTC
Remove the moon-goo pos module and use titans for moon-mining. Fix 0,0.
Tore Vest
#22 - 2012-01-24 12:55:25 UTC
Remove moon goo...
And leave technetium to hauler spawns Bear

No troll.
Defecanda
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#23 - 2012-01-24 12:59:08 UTC
Option #1: Sovereignty upgrades make all systems self-sustaining. (i.e. integrate moon harvesting into sovereignty)
Problem: No conflict, no objectives, hyper-inflation, PLEX buildup

Option #2: Diminishing moon materials (i.e. Overall quantity in sandbox static, but single moon resources deplete)
Problem: The market would be a $h|t-fest of fluctuation and no one would want to spend time in a game re-scouting new resources. -1 to fun factor

Option #3: Re-write T2 manufacturing in a way that balances moon materials (i.e. Technetium not used across the board. However, inter-regional dependence still necessary for full production to encourage trade and minor conflict for the greedy.)
Problem: I would like feedback. Cannot think of any

[i][b]CCP Zulu.....      Forcing players to dock at the captain's quarters is a form of what we actually wanted to get through, which is making Incarna a seamless part of the EVE Online experience. [/b](i like to steal sigs)[/i]
My Postman
Royal Amarr Institute
Amarr Empire
#24 - 2012-01-24 13:07:21 UTC
And remove T2 BPO - you forgot.

(I hope Akita does´nt read that but i will get my flameproof suit, just in case)
Iniquita
Perkone
Caldari State
#25 - 2012-01-24 13:13:07 UTC
You could just increase the volume of goo producted on high end moons. The increased supply should drive down prices. For example if tech produced 200 units/hr instead of 100.
Akrasjel Lanate
Immemorial Coalescence Administration
Immemorial Coalescence
#26 - 2012-01-24 13:13:37 UTC
saltrock0000 wrote:
A Simple quote from another thread which i think deserves a thread of its own:

Moon mining has horribly unbalanced nullsec pvp. Remove moon mining and make people play eve to earn isk again so that the blobbers have to run around in pve ships and get shot at too.

Now this to me sounds like a eureka moment!


Balance moon poo

CEO of Lanate Industries

Citizen of Solitude
Hemmo Paskiainen
#27 - 2012-01-24 13:19:00 UTC
Solution:

Make every r64 moon worth 2b. Make evry R32 worth 1b a month. 10b is magnet, 500m is meh not worth the effort. 2-1b is perfect for big and small alliances to fight over. 70 r64 = still 140b.

with all moons worth something, there will be much more pew pew and internal battle and ripoffs, agrues fights about moons. in other words, 0.0 would become more dynamic.

If relativity equals time plus momentum, what equals relativity, if the momentum is minus to the time?
Levija Saplina
Ken Interplanetary Communication
#28 - 2012-01-24 13:20:57 UTC
Translation from the OP : "I does not have mai technetium moon and I are very jealous, please mother CCP tell on them and do something, please please please I are useless".
lilol' me
Comply Or Die
Pandemic Horde
#29 - 2012-01-24 13:23:44 UTC
alliances should be made to work for it! Simple as. The issue is that moons have stayed in the same place, so all the nullsec alliances no the location of pretty much every moon in eve, null, empire and low sec, and they have taken THEM ALL!!! its a fecking joke! and you know what there is nothing you can do about it. When you have 1000 supers or sub caps willing to defend the pos at all costs.

Moons should be randomised every 3 months. So that you have to actually go and work for them, spend time building and moving poses, going to actually find them! and also give the little guy a chance to hit the jackpot now and again. Even just for a few months! its totally totally wrong how unbalanced and unfair moongold works at the moment..

and if i get a comment, that you expect ppl to up poses and move them, damn right i do! you think making billions a month for doing sweet FA is right? work for your damn money...There will be less throw away ships and battles also. Perhaps alliances will think tactically instead of blobby and know that hey dont worry we lose 10 supers we have 100 in the hanger to insta replace.

Consequences! Risk vs Reward aint that what eves about? doesnt seem the case for the large nullsec alliances now does it!
Holy One
Privat Party
#30 - 2012-01-24 13:26:35 UTC
Tech moon ~ 8bn pcm.
Incursion runner ~8bn pcm.

Don't see the problem.

:)
Andski
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#31 - 2012-01-24 13:31:01 UTC
how about making racial R32s be used in the production of intermediate racial t2 components

holy hell i solved the whole problem, give me a cushy job, CCP

Twitter: @EVEAndski

"It's easy to speak for the silent majority. They rarely object to what you put into their mouths."    - Abrazzar
Lyrrashae
Hellstar Towing and Recovery
#32 - 2012-01-24 13:32:12 UTC
It's "nerf," not "nurf."

Ni.
March rabbit
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#33 - 2012-01-24 13:44:47 UTC
saltrock0000 wrote:
Just because moons wouldnt be desirable - other than building caps, owning SOV and desirable systems to plex/rat/mine in would still be, therefore still offering incentive for the average blob PvPer to participate in battles, if not more! Isn't someone more likely to fleet up if they are defending thier own personal income, and not that of some alliance leader scooping billions in moon goo?

how would you get info fleet to defend your own personal income if nearest enemy is 50 jumps away? And those enemy are lazy and selfish carebears like you?

have you ever heard about Droneland? About its main problem which caused last war?

The Mittani: "the inappropriate drunked joke"
Hemmo Paskiainen
#34 - 2012-01-24 13:45:39 UTC
lilol' me wrote:
alliances should be made to work for it! Simple as. The issue is that moons have stayed in the same place, so all the nullsec alliances no the location of pretty much every moon in eve, null, empire and low sec, and they have taken THEM ALL!!! its a fecking joke! and you know what there is nothing you can do about it. When you have 1000 supers or sub caps willing to defend the pos at all costs.

Moons should be randomised every 3 months. So that you have to actually go and work for them, spend time building and moving poses, going to actually find them! and also give the little guy a chance to hit the jackpot now and again. Even just for a few months! its totally totally wrong how unbalanced and unfair moongold works at the moment..

and if i get a comment, that you expect ppl to up poses and move them, damn right i do! you think making billions a month for doing sweet FA is right? work for your damn money...There will be less throw away ships and battles also. Perhaps alliances will think tactically instead of blobby and know that hey dont worry we lose 10 supers we have 100 in the hanger to insta replace.

Consequences! Risk vs Reward aint that what eves about? doesnt seem the case for the large nullsec alliances now does it!


You do have to work for it, sov grinding is really boring. Sov bills to keep you members happy with ratting space are also expencise. Reimbursments are expencise. Defending your space is als needed. There is much more. To much to type. There is effort the issue is effort vs reward thingy. 8B for a tech moon is a bit el mucho vs the effort

If relativity equals time plus momentum, what equals relativity, if the momentum is minus to the time?
Rek Seven
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#35 - 2012-01-24 13:50:34 UTC
Allow 100 titans to link up to form a super doomsday that can crack a moon = best fix Big smile

The wishlist is pretty much complete...
Andski
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#36 - 2012-01-24 13:55:21 UTC  |  Edited by: Andski
lilol' me wrote:
alliances should be made to work for it! Simple as. The issue is that moons have stayed in the same place, so all the nullsec alliances no the location of pretty much every moon in eve, null, empire and low sec, and they have taken THEM ALL!!! its a fecking joke! and you know what there is nothing you can do about it. When you have 1000 supers or sub caps willing to defend the pos at all costs.


alliances don't tend to nationalize lower-end moons, you can easily find untowered lower-end moons and extract them at a profit

if you're asking why you can't get a personal tech moon, you're a hypocrite

lilol' me wrote:
Moons should be randomised every 3 months. So that you have to actually go and work for them, spend time building and moving poses, going to actually find them! and also give the little guy a chance to hit the jackpot now and again. Even just for a few months! its totally totally wrong how unbalanced and unfair moongold works at the moment..


and every 3 months the T2 market would screw up as every goddamn region has to be scanned again, and who do you think has the advantage when coordinating large-scale, region-wide moon scanning? heh

lilol' me wrote:
and if i get a comment, that you expect ppl to up poses and move them, damn right i do! you think making billions a month for doing sweet FA is right? work for your damn money...There will be less throw away ships and battles also. Perhaps alliances will think tactically instead of blobby and know that hey dont worry we lose 10 supers we have 100 in the hanger to insta replace.


I don't consider the hours spent fueling towers, emptying silos and shipping to market as "sweet **** all," do you?

lilol' me wrote:
Consequences! Risk vs Reward aint that what eves about? doesnt seem the case for the large nullsec alliances now does it!


because moon mining is totally risk free and effortless

Twitter: @EVEAndski

"It's easy to speak for the silent majority. They rarely object to what you put into their mouths."    - Abrazzar
lilol' me
Comply Or Die
Pandemic Horde
#37 - 2012-01-24 14:19:54 UTC
Andski wrote:


lilol' me wrote:
alliances should be made to work for it! Simple as. The issue is that moons have stayed in the same place, so all the nullsec alliances no the location of pretty much every moon in eve, null, empire and low sec, and they have taken THEM ALL!!! its a fecking joke! and you know what there is nothing you can do about it. When you have 1000 supers or sub caps willing to defend the pos at all costs.


alliances don't tend to nationalize lower-end moons, you can easily find untowered lower-end moons and extract them at a profit

if you're asking why you can't get a personal tech moon, you're a hypocrite


This is not exactly true now is it, yes there maybe the 'odd' moon out of thousands, but people like PL and many other large alliances have pretty much swallowed up the moons in low sec. You know this be true...

lilol' me wrote:
Moons should be randomised every 3 months. So that you have to actually go and work for them, spend time building and moving poses, going to actually find them! and also give the little guy a chance to hit the jackpot now and again. Even just for a few months! its totally totally wrong how unbalanced and unfair moongold works at the moment..


and every 3 months the T2 market would screw up as every goddamn region has to be scanned again, and who do you think has the advantage when coordinating large-scale, region-wide moon scanning? heh

Look it wouldnt screw it up at all, you cant tell me all the plentiful trillions of stock would just crash. Thats nonsense. I might actually be a good thing and stop the constant building of supers etc. Yes large alliances will have the advantage of course, but at least you are working for it, and doing something, rather than just maintaining a tower.

lilol' me wrote:
and if i get a comment, that you expect ppl to up poses and move them, damn right i do! you think making billions a month for doing sweet FA is right? work for your damn money...There will be less throw away ships and battles also. Perhaps alliances will think tactically instead of blobby and know that hey dont worry we lose 10 supers we have 100 in the hanger to insta replace.


I don't consider the hours spent fueling towers, emptying silos and shipping to market as "sweet **** all," do you?

OK look this is a specific person(s) role, who do this day in day out, where they make a good living out of it! You make trillions in ISK what do you think you should do just sit there and do nothing for it? Alliances like yourselves have the manpower the logistics setup everything to make this pretty much a breeze to resupply poses and maintain them. I mean jesus christ its just made even easier with the new fuel blocks for god sake. How many hours will that cut off!. Its got easier and easier to maintain poses now. You dont need a billion poses in one system to keep sov anymore, you only have tactical poses and moon ones now, so again a MASSIVE reduction, yet more tech moons came available. So a massive increase in profits and massive decrease in how to get it.

lilol' me wrote:
Consequences! Risk vs Reward aint that what eves about? doesnt seem the case for the large nullsec alliances now does it!


because moon mining is totally risk free and effortless

For the large alliances, all in all yes... You all blue balled, and who is going to try get them off you? So yes its risk free.
Niko Takahashi
Yoshitomi Group
#38 - 2012-01-24 14:28:14 UTC
Andski wrote:
Ned Black wrote:
The major problem with moon mining is that it is completely static. If you have a tech moon then you have free isk in abundance.

All they would have to do is to make them switch moon goo around a bit now and then. That super duper tech moon suddenly runs dry and starts spouting the least valuable moon goo of all and just as suddenly that little miniature alliance in the back end of nowhere suddenly has a moon that is pure gold... and then after exploiting that moon for a while it runs out as well... that really is all the "nerf" you need.


this would only screw up the T2 market even further when there's a choke on supply after the periodic "moon rotation" or whatever where everyone and their mother is out scanning moons for the next month

moon rotation would be a terrible mechanic


I agree no rotation

Use same patterns as ore belts basics in High bit better in low best in null but you can get the stuff almost everywhere.

OR

Use PI type or types of moons with the Null being best richest and the high lowest poorest. With lets say 64 moons having deposits of all 64s 32 all of and so on and on.
Only setup of the Harvester will determine which one you extract and it will be on ever lower units per day until you allow to replenish and switch different material.

Both alternatives make the better moons more valuable then the crappy ones but would make cartels almost impossible since people would just switch extractors to meet market demand.

So you would still ahve the motivation to tke the better moons of other people but it would be more market driven pricing and not cartels.
Orion Guardian
#39 - 2012-01-24 14:31:43 UTC
I wonder: Why do people think moonmining would give the normal nullsec player ANYTHING?

Unless you are an Alliance CEO that skims of his fellow mates (and steals from the alliance at that) you have no gain whatsoever from Moons. Most Alliances I know put their moonincome into "Ship replacement Programs"to defend into subsiding Capital ships to defend, paying for sov to hold an defend some more.

I would doubt that from 10*7B/month Moons a rich alliance may own only 1% is going into someones pockets to get rich. Unless ofc your alliance CEO is an ass which may as well be the case for alot of allies I don't see the audits ;) But the normal Nullsec player will enver see a single ISK of that unless he gets a ship replaced he LOST during defense
Andski
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#40 - 2012-01-24 14:35:46 UTC
I'm not going to bother to quote when you don't bother to split quotes, ugh:

CCP has not added tech moons to the game since they added the Black Rise region in the Empyrean Age, FYI, and that was several expansion cycles before Technetium became the primary bottleneck.

Large alliances don't gobble up every moon that coughs up the slightest margin. Lower-end moons are mined by smaller alliances or even individual corporations, for reaction chains.

If the market is dependent on a few depleting stockpiles over a significant period of time (two weeks to a month) the prices will skyrocket. Also, supercapitals are T1 hulls, the intermediate capital components do not require T2 components to build.

Correct, alliances have logistics teams. Isn't it hard to believe that an organized logistics team with delegated responsibilities can be efficient? Wow.

The large alliances like Morsus Mihi and RAZOR which held massive numbers of tech moons across the north? Gee, I wonder what ever happened to them.

Twitter: @EVEAndski

"It's easy to speak for the silent majority. They rarely object to what you put into their mouths."    - Abrazzar