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Hauling probleem and Citadels
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Danial Qima
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#1 - 2017-06-21 23:50:41 UTC
I like to attend you a bout Citadel probleem atm in game,atm many Industralist/Minners/Traders/..... cant get their items easy from tradehub to their citadels or from their citadels to tradehubs ,the reason is haulers dont
deliver to players citadels (because of Citadel scamming ),ofc scamming is always part of game but here many players and specialy the new players who bought or own the citadel are dupe I hope you can fix this probleem
so many citadel owners can easly get their items and deliver their items .

Second probleem I think you must change little a bout our Transportships ,tradehubs like Rens/Hek/Dodixie are
less attractieve for players and most of players directly move to jita or Amar area because of that,Hauling risk is not worth to reward ,in EVE risk and reward must be in same lvl ,but when you can destroy Freighter with some cargo of couple of billion ISK with some cruiser that are not worht that much ,is not in same lvl
also speed of Freighter is very slow and many player dont like sit behind pc for 3 hourse for one delivery of 40 jump ,JF prices is very expensieve and again not worth compare to risk .

Eve have thousend of systems and all players like to explore this but at same time it must be easier for them to get their items to tradehubs or their items in their systems .
Cypherous
Liberty Rogues
Aprilon Dynasty
#2 - 2017-06-22 00:48:16 UTC
Danial Qima wrote:
I like to attend you a bout Citadel probleem atm in game,atm many Industralist/Minners/Traders/..... cant get their items easy from tradehub to their citadels or from their citadels to tradehubs ,the reason is haulers dont
deliver to players citadels (because of Citadel scamming ),ofc scamming is always part of game but here many players and specialy the new players who bought or own the citadel are dupe I hope you can fix this probleem
so many citadel owners can easly get their items and deliver their items .

Second probleem I think you must change little a bout our Transportships ,tradehubs like Rens/Hek/Dodixie are
less attractieve for players and most of players directly move to jita or Amar area because of that,Hauling risk is not worth to reward ,in EVE risk and reward must be in same lvl ,but when you can destroy Freighter with some cargo of couple of billion ISK with some cruiser that are not worht that much ,is not in same lvl
also speed of Freighter is very slow and many player dont like sit behind pc for 3 hourse for one delivery of 40 jump ,JF prices is very expensieve and again not worth compare to risk .

Eve have thousend of systems and all players like to explore this but at same time it must be easier for them to get their items to tradehubs or their items in their systems .



Risk vs reward, they won't ever balance ease of killing a ship around its cost as its impossible to do so, you don't "have" to use 3rd party services to deliver things to your citadel you can do it yourself, plan your routes in advance, always have scouts and have a ship follow the freighter to web it in to warp faster, there are tools to solve your "problems" and its very clear that not all citadel owners have this issue

The smart adapt
Piugattuk
Litla Sundlaugin
#3 - 2017-06-22 00:56:38 UTC  |  Edited by: Piugattuk
Well in theory I'm with you especially about the scams, I've thought about training for a freighter however because exactly what you point out they are too squishy and can't fit anything to beef yourself up because of CPU/power grid limitations, which is why a new class of freighter is needed, a jump freighter would solve much if you could bypass choke points or make bumping at gates a criminal flag this way escorts can actually do something, but the bigger picture is that losing cargo drives prices so this would make the market more stable If no losses and less dynamic.
Cypherous
Liberty Rogues
Aprilon Dynasty
#4 - 2017-06-22 01:04:57 UTC
Piugattuk wrote:
Well in theory I'm with you especially about the scams, I've thought about training for a freighter however because exactly what you point out they are too squishy and can't fit anything to beef yourself up because of CPU/power grid limitations, which is why a new class of freighter is needed, a jump freighter would solve much if you could bypass choke points or make bumping at gates a criminal flag this way escorts can actually do something, but the bigger picture is that losing cargo drives prices so this would make the market more stable If no losses and less dynamic.


Right off the bat thats exploitable, i would just park a hauler next to my bowhead and wait for someone warping in to bump it, get a free suspect timer on them and just swap ships to blap them, would make ganking freighters even easier, i love it add it now CCP, which is exactly why this would never be done, its why they were looking in to a timer that made your ship warp even while bumped, but even then you just get suicide alphas to tackle the freighter every now and then

At the end of the day, if someone wants to kill you in EVE they will bring enough firepower to do it, and thats just the way the game has always worked, empire space has NEVER been safe, i've already given you ways to minimise the risks of getting killed, this is an MMO, if you want to risk moving billions in an untanked ship by yourself you're welcome, but you'll find it a lot easier if you actually interact with others or use an alt or two
Chainsaw Plankton
FaDoyToy
#5 - 2017-06-22 01:41:28 UTC
imo the whole point of freighters is to move large volume low value goods. Trit and Pyerite take up a ton of volume, a full cargo freighter could carry a bit over ~100mil units of trit, that's like 10 BS worth. Full cargo is low EHP though and easy to gank, but even 120m trit is only 500-600mil and probably not worth it to a ganker unless it is code doing it out of principle. With a webbing alt the actual movement doesn't take too long and is pretty safe.

Moving multiple billions worth of stuff is a huge risk in a freighter. When moving low volume high value use a DST or blockade runner.

As far as citadels go yea, that is a huge risk. Can always have them deliver to an NPC station in system and then it would be pretty easy and safe to use a freighter to move between station and citadel.

@ChainsawPlankto on twitter
Marcus Tedric
Zebra Corp
Goonswarm Federation
#6 - 2017-06-22 06:50:23 UTC
Chainsaw Plankton wrote:
imo the whole point of freighters is to .......................


No...

The whole point of Freighters is to move Station Eggs.

Now that we no longer need these - then perhaps Freighters should go now too........Blink

Don't soil your panties, you guys made a good point, we'll look at the numbers again. - CCP Ytterbium
Do Little
Bluenose Trading
#7 - 2017-06-22 08:13:35 UTC
Under no circumstances should CCP make it easier or safer to do business in Jita. Having a third of the online population in the Forge (and another third in Delve) is not healthy. I could make a case for dropping Uedama to 0.4 - forcing people to take the long way around. Might help balance activity between the trade hubs.
Gregorius Goldstein
Queens of the Drone Age
#8 - 2017-06-22 08:36:03 UTC
Somewhere was a DEV quote that a way to deliver stuff to a citadel without docking rights was planned. Kind of a drop-off mechanic. Are there any news on that?
Sequester Risalo
German Corps of Engineers 17
Federation of Respect Honor Passion Alliance.
#9 - 2017-06-22 11:58:31 UTC
To address your Problem you could set up a hauling contract to the starbase next to your citadel and carry the stuff the last meters yourself. If you aren't prepared to do this, there is no Point in Setting up a citadel. Especially since it is nothing new. With POSes it was also impossible to get stuff delivered at the doorstep.
Herzog Wolfhammer
Sigma Special Tactics Group
#10 - 2017-06-22 20:27:14 UTC
We just had a thread ball pit session over this topic.

Bring back DEEEEP Space!
Dark Lord Trump
Infinite Point
Pandemic Horde
#11 - 2017-06-23 13:40:07 UTC
Danial Qima wrote:
I like to attend you a bout Citadel probleem atm in game,atm many Industralist/Minners/Traders/..... cant get their items easy from tradehub to their citadels or from their citadels to tradehubs ,the reason is haulers dont
deliver to players citadels (because of Citadel scamming ),ofc scamming is always part of game but here many players and specialy the new players who bought or own the citadel are dupe I hope you can fix this probleem
so many citadel owners can easly get their items and deliver their items .

Second probleem I think you must change little a bout our Transportships ,tradehubs like Rens/Hek/Dodixie are
less attractieve for players and most of players directly move to jita or Amar area because of that,Hauling risk is not worth to reward ,in EVE risk and reward must be in same lvl ,but when you can destroy Freighter with some cargo of couple of billion ISK with some cruiser that are not worht that much ,is not in same lvl
also speed of Freighter is very slow and many player dont like sit behind pc for 3 hourse for one delivery of 40 jump ,JF prices is very expensieve and again not worth compare to risk .

Eve have thousend of systems and all players like to explore this but at same time it must be easier for them to get their items to tradehubs or their items in their systems .


1. Totally agree. Since there's no real counter to a proper citadel scam short of "don't take any contracts that go to citadels" the response is simply to do just that. Kinda defeats the purpose of citadels if you ask me.
2. Maybe you should have done one of the many things that can save you from getting ganked with that couple of billion ISK cargo then. Or charge more. Similarly, if you don't want to make a 3 hour trip in a freighter, I'll find someone willing.

I'm going to build a big wall that will keep the Gallente out, and they're going to pay for it!
Dracvlad
Taishi Combine
Astral Alliance
#12 - 2017-06-23 19:50:34 UTC
Just do not deliver to Citadels, simple as that.

When the going gets tough the Gankers get their CSM rep to change mechanics in their favour.

Blocked: Teckos Pech, Sonya Corvinus, baltec1, Shae Tadaruwa, Wander Prian, Daichi Yamato, Jonah Gravenstein, Merin Ryskin, Linus Gorp
Mara Pahrdi
The Order of Anoyia
#13 - 2017-06-23 21:28:58 UTC
*sigh*

Just another bottle of "make it easier" vintage.

Even when the number of players in Jita was still a thing, it never was a problem to get into system. There were just two simple rules to be followed:


  • Be at your keyboard when you approach Jita
  • Don't use the Perimeter gate when incoming


The same principle applies to Citadels. Just follow some simple rules.

Remove standings and insurance.
Mr Epeen
It's All About Me
#14 - 2017-06-23 21:37:47 UTC
Danial Qima wrote:
I like to attend you a bout Citadel probleem atm in game,atm many Industralist/Minners/Traders/..... cant get their items easy from tradehub to their citadels or from their citadels to tradehubs ,the reason is haulers dont
deliver to players citadels (because of Citadel scamming )
It feels good to see my predictions come true. Especially since I decided against setting up in a citadel and kept my building line in an NPC station where you get public hauling contracts accepted in minutes instead of never.

Mr Epeen Cool