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[June] Nullsec Asteroid Cluster and Excavator Drone changes

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Author
Teckos Pech
Hogyoku
Goonswarm Federation
#661 - 2017-06-13 05:12:07 UTC
Terminal Insanity wrote:
im pretty sure the only thing ccp took into account with the nerfs is how many new mining accounts youll open up to maintain the same isk level that your single rorqual could have mined.


this is just about forcing people to multibox more


So if your employer cuts your pay, you work 2x the number of hours right?

"The curious task of economics is to demonstrate to men how little they really know about what they imagine they can design."--Friedrich August von Hayek

8 Golden Rules for EVE Online

alex tow
Real One Corp
Equinox Space Technologies
#662 - 2017-06-13 10:02:34 UTC
Teckos Pech wrote:
Terminal Insanity wrote:
im pretty sure the only thing ccp took into account with the nerfs is how many new mining accounts youll open up to maintain the same isk level that your single rorqual could have mined.


this is just about forcing people to multibox more


So if your employer cuts your pay, you work 2x the number of hours right?



Well, if you need minerals, some will do :)
Jamu Sarain
Serenity Cartel
Obscura Infinitum
#663 - 2017-06-13 11:33:12 UTC  |  Edited by: Jamu Sarain
So correct me if I am wrong here.

You put Rorqs on grid in Ascension, I have no issues there what so ever, as they should be on grid, you gave rorq pilots immense mining abilities to compensate for the risk/cost factor, again great no issues.

Slowly you are removing the great mining abilities, so now with this current patch, the Rorq has only a slightly better yield than 1 Hulk, oh but it boosts as well, big deal. Soon it will just be the same old Rorq as pre-ascension only on grid, so essentially will just be a 10b useless sitting duck.

A 10b-12b fitted rorq on grid that gives boosts and mines the same as 1 hulk, yep I see the logic Roll

WTS Rorq, buying a hulk...costs less, gets into warp quicker....mines as good as a rorq for a fraction of the cost.

So much for the beast of a miner you boasted about in your Ascension expansion notes hey CCP.

Concerned for the eve economy, sounds more like concerned for the CCP wallet IMO!!
Millpucky
KarmaFleet
Goonswarm Federation
#664 - 2017-06-13 11:36:58 UTC
This is hilariously obscene.
Rexxar Santaro
Forex Corp
#665 - 2017-06-13 12:25:26 UTC
Poor mining goons…
Hoko Sal
Fearless Tiger.
#666 - 2017-06-13 12:31:08 UTC  |  Edited by: Hoko Sal
  • 20 minutes for the Small Asteroid Cluster
  • 1 hour for the Medium Asteroid Cluster
  • 2 hours for the Large Asteroid Cluster variants
  • 4 hours for the Enormous Asteroid Cluster variants
  • 5 hours for the Colossal Asteroid Cluster variants


  • OMG!! now we can finally get EVERY nullsec system 's col belt to Onyx Ochre only! as no one is gonna mine it to clear a belt that well.... wont exist while they wait to go to sleep.

    That's your plan isn't in Fozzie? sadistic and childish self achievements? ... come on, be honest with me...

    *Cancels Eve for Netflix subscription for same price*

    Ohhh!!! maybe your leaving the Dev team to work for Netflixs....clearly need to rethink my game plan here...
    Brem Thellere
    Inter-com
    #667 - 2017-06-13 16:03:15 UTC
    I find it interesting that you guys don't take into consideration the very Cost of the ships, vs their income.
    Teckos Pech
    Hogyoku
    Goonswarm Federation
    #668 - 2017-06-13 17:12:59 UTC
    alex tow wrote:
    Teckos Pech wrote:
    Terminal Insanity wrote:
    im pretty sure the only thing ccp took into account with the nerfs is how many new mining accounts youll open up to maintain the same isk level that your single rorqual could have mined.


    this is just about forcing people to multibox more


    So if your employer cuts your pay, you work 2x the number of hours right?



    Well, if you need minerals, some will do :)


    It is sad that EVE players do not grasp the concept of opportunity cost.

    "The curious task of economics is to demonstrate to men how little they really know about what they imagine they can design."--Friedrich August von Hayek

    8 Golden Rules for EVE Online

    Sharnhorst von Deathwish
    STK Scientific
    The Initiative.
    #669 - 2017-06-13 23:52:08 UTC
    Day 1..

    Colossal belt has ochre and a handfull of spod. Euro had 12 hours to clear it.

    It's 8pm my time. Sure I could. Then play again at 1am.. because you know, I don't need sleep for work.

    Mission accomplished. CCP demonstrates euro tz best tz.

    Here's my two cent.

    -,I,,
    PurpleKush
    Kilo India Alpha
    #670 - 2017-06-14 00:54:45 UTC
    @ CCP Fozzie is there a dislike button? I just cannot seem to find it.

    Anyways, just want to say Europe loves you... You apparently hate the American continents, and I'm sure you'll find our love at a loss for you in the near future.

    Totally was going to write more, however, I concluded that you really could care less seeing as you have yet to respond to any of the previous post. Of which a lot of their comments are valid from my point of view as a pay to play account on this game.

    So, knowing that you have my email already, feel free to write me if you would like some feed back from us little guys.... You know, the majority of us who actually have jobs and pay to play this game... Yeah those guys, the ones that are now wearing those new awesome hats! That look like ****....

    Dorn Val
    Ministry of War
    Amarr Empire
    #671 - 2017-06-14 06:32:16 UTC
    CCP Fozzie wrote:

    We are also making some more small adjustments to the Excavator drones themselves. In June the changes are:
    • About 9% less yield for Ore Excavators
    • 12.5% lower speed for Ore Excavators
    • About 11% longer cycle time for Ice Excavators
    • 10% lower speed for Ice Excavators


    We will continue observing the economy after these changes and making adjustments as necessary to keep it healthy for all our players.


    How about creating more incentive for peeps to blow each other up so demand catches up with supply?...

    Sandbox: An enclosed area filled with sand for children engaged in open-ended, unstructured, imaginative play. Also a place for cats to urinate and defecate...

    Nevyn Auscent
    Broke Sauce
    #672 - 2017-06-14 06:52:13 UTC
    Sharnhorst von Deathwish wrote:
    Day 1..

    Colossal belt has ochre and a handfull of spod. Euro had 12 hours to clear it.

    It's 8pm my time. Sure I could. Then play again at 1am.. because you know, I don't need sleep for work.

    Mission accomplished. CCP demonstrates euro tz best tz.

    Here's my two cent.

    -,I,,

    So why is it CCP's fault that your Euro TZ players are asses and left you a bad anom. It would suck even before the changes having them cherry pick it and not clean it all for you anyway.
    I suggest getting better alliance mates.
    Gieriger Fuchs
    Arctic Ice Solutions
    #673 - 2017-06-14 08:01:20 UTC
    CCP wants to move the people to other systems????

    CCP please ,what is the reason while miners go to some Systems with high SEcstatus??
    Right..the miningyield

    Please begin to play your own game.
    I leave Eve a few Month ago and when i see this Patchnotes i think it was a good dicision.

    Remove this ******* Secstatus and the people will move to other unbusy Systems from itself.


    CCP....many People gives you a Tip... hear on it...play your own Game.

    Patch the Rorqaul out of game...its have the same affects like your fu... bullshitpatches.

    at last..... cooldown for Miningbelts.... LoL



    Kist Shi
    Miners Legion
    Already Replaced.
    #674 - 2017-06-14 18:12:08 UTC
    Grognard Commissar wrote:
    Teckos Pech wrote:
    Radious Servasse wrote:
    CCP is nerfing mining. "The economy is unhealthy." 32 pages of rage in a week. CCP is nerfing carrier ratting. 51 pages of rage in a day.

    CCP thinks the economy is in bad health because of too much isk. You don't nerf rorqs and carrier ratting at the same time. Rorqs account for most of the mining done in New Eden and now they are being nerved because of the bad economy. CCP has not changed a thing, just ruined the amount of isk that is to be made. Since ore has subjective value based on supply and demand, rorqs in the long term won't be too bad off as ore prices rise (Except for the new tears involved in mining). Carrier ratting on the other hand are going to be screwed.

    Looks like CCP is delibratly trying to kill it's long-term players.



    A rapid rise in the money supply can be bad for an economy. It can lead to inflation. Now while there is not much inflation at the moment, letting this go until prices start rising dramatically is probably not a good thing.

    As for minerals the mineral price index has been falling for the past 13 months. This suggests that ALOT of minerals are entering the markets and depressing prices.

    Both of these are two macro trends are troubling at the very least.

    Now, perhaps if you cut out the hysterics and engaged your brain a bit you'd see that these while unfortunate for rorqual and carrier/super pilots, these changes should probably be made.

    you realize it's literally your alliance that's responsible, riiight?

    Kist Shi
    Miners Legion
    Already Replaced.
    #675 - 2017-06-14 18:20:32 UTC
    I was on the understanding that this is a player led game and economy. The players don't want this , there are 35 pages on this forum that prove this .
    Ccp need to concentrate on creating more pvp opportunities like reducing reinforcement timers on structures so the isk being made gets spent . Yes I'm a miner , yes I have a rorqual but I1 thing I never have is isk as I reinvest it all to bpo's. it would be better to make bigger ships slower to warp off so they can be killed . Carriers and supers are gone soon as intel spikes . Rorquals are stuck . Also make cynosure not work in anoms so it's all manual warp ins at random points so more ships are at risk .
    Don't nerf the very things people like and enjoy doing
    SurrenderMonkey
    The Exchange Collective
    Solyaris Chtonium
    #676 - 2017-06-14 18:27:53 UTC
    Kist Shi wrote:
    I was on the understanding that this is a player led game and economy.


    Do people really think this is a clever or compelling argument?

    When they initially announced their plans to introduce Excavators and turn the Rorqual into a mining behemoth, did you complain that you thought this was a player-run economy then?

    I'm betting you didn't.

    "Help, I'm bored with missions!"

    http://swiftandbitter.com/eve/wtd/

    Teckos Pech
    Hogyoku
    Goonswarm Federation
    #677 - 2017-06-14 20:59:14 UTC
    SurrenderMonkey wrote:
    Kist Shi wrote:
    I was on the understanding that this is a player led game and economy.


    Do people really think this is a clever or compelling argument?

    When they initially announced their plans to introduce Excavators and turn the Rorqual into a mining behemoth, did you complain that you thought this was a player-run economy then?

    I'm betting you didn't.



    Heh, the irony.

    And when an unbalanced ship appears, let it stay because of "player driven economy."

    Yup, that is about a logical as a 3 year old.

    "The curious task of economics is to demonstrate to men how little they really know about what they imagine they can design."--Friedrich August von Hayek

    8 Golden Rules for EVE Online

    Sgt Ocker
    What Corp is it
    #678 - 2017-06-14 22:40:10 UTC
    Teckos Pech wrote:
    SurrenderMonkey wrote:
    Kist Shi wrote:
    I was on the understanding that this is a player led game and economy.


    Do people really think this is a clever or compelling argument?

    When they initially announced their plans to introduce Excavators and turn the Rorqual into a mining behemoth, did you complain that you thought this was a player-run economy then?

    I'm betting you didn't.



    Heh, the irony.

    And when an unbalanced ship appears, let it stay because of "player driven economy."

    Yup, that is about a logical as a 3 year old.

    Not sure if either of you followed the threads leading up to Rorqual/Orca changes but CCP was warned over and over that their changes would cause problems - CCP went ahead regardless and are now in "oh Shite what did we do" mode.

    They made a lot of RL money from people injecting to get more Rorqual characters due to bad game design .

    The problem now is CCP/Devs are not addressing the underlying problem with Rorquals and simply nerfing everyone due to the actions of a minority - Or in other words, doing the only thing this lot of Devs is capable of as they have no idea what "game balance" actually is or how to achieve it.

    Reality is, we haven't had a player driven economy for a long time - It is closely monitored by CCP who will and do intervene when it suits them...


    You can try to defend CCP as much as you like but they did wrong...

    My opinions are mine.

      If you don't like them or disagree with me that's OK.- - - - - - Just don't bother Hating - I don't care

    It really is getting harder and harder to justify $23 a month for each sub.

    SurrenderMonkey
    The Exchange Collective
    Solyaris Chtonium
    #679 - 2017-06-14 23:06:33 UTC  |  Edited by: SurrenderMonkey
    Sgt Ocker wrote:
    Teckos Pech wrote:
    SurrenderMonkey wrote:

    Do people really think this is a clever or compelling argument?

    When they initially announced their plans to introduce Excavators and turn the Rorqual into a mining behemoth, did you complain that you thought this was a player-run economy then?

    I'm betting you didn't.



    Heh, the irony.

    And when an unbalanced ship appears, let it stay because of "player driven economy."

    Yup, that is about a logical as a 3 year old.

    Not sure if either of you followed the threads leading up to Rorqual/Orca changes but CCP was warned over and over that their changes would cause problems - CCP went ahead regardless and are now in "oh Shite what did we do" mode.


    Mostly what I remember about the early rorqual change threads is a lot of hilarious crying about how they're still not worth putting on grid, and never will be, and the rorqual is dead and will never be used again. Roll


    Quote:

    Reality is, we haven't had a player driven economy for a long time - It is closely monitored by CCP who will and do intervene when it suits them...



    If that distinction is your definition of "player driven economy" then, spoiler alert: Eve has NEVER had a player driven economy.

    There has never been a single moment in the lifespan of Eve where anything introduced to the economy via a faucet wasn't subject to the possibility of tweaking. The entire point was the astonishing number of people who don't seem to realize that, and are making moronic, "B...but the player driven economy!!1!" arguments now.

    Ore compositions have been rebalanced. Tiericide included huge ship material rebalancing. Bounties have been adjusted before. Gun mining was killed. Drone minerals went away. The plex market has seen direct intervention before. That's just a tiny fraction of examples. Remember when ore anomalies didn't exist? I sure do.

    But, whoa, a completely necessary Rorqual yield adjustment? That's just totally over the line! Clutch your pearls, and wring your hands, because NOW is the time to get precious about the player driven economy. Roll

    Quote:
    You can try to defend CCP as much as you like but they did wrong...


    It's not about defending CCP, it's just that blaming them doesn't ******* matter. Sure, it's entirely their fault, and back when they had an economist, they seemed to be keenly aware that a bigger, badder mining yield ship - especially a capital-grade mining ship - wouldn't actually be a good thing. I agree with that sentiment.

    Now, tell me how that has any impact on the necessity of continuing to manage the influx of new material. What, CCP ****** up so they should just say, "Well, guess we done goofed. We'll just have to let this train run right off the rails, now, because it simply won't do to upset a bunch of FOTM chasers by rebalancing things now that we realize we made a mistake. It was a good run while it lasted?"

    "Help, I'm bored with missions!"

    http://swiftandbitter.com/eve/wtd/

    Teckos Pech
    Hogyoku
    Goonswarm Federation
    #680 - 2017-06-14 23:44:29 UTC  |  Edited by: Teckos Pech
    Sgt Ocker wrote:

    Not sure if either of you followed the threads leading up to Rorqual/Orca changes but CCP was warned over and over that their changes would cause problems - CCP went ahead regardless and are now in "oh Shite what did we do" mode.


    And what does this prove, imply, even mean? CCP were warned, it went bad, but because they were warned we have to leave an unbalanced ship in the game?

    Sgt Ocker wrote:
    They made a lot of RL money from people injecting to get more Rorqual characters due to bad game design .

    The problem now is CCP/Devs are not addressing the underlying problem with Rorquals and simply nerfing everyone due to the actions of a minority - Or in other words, doing the only thing this lot of Devs is capable of as they have no idea what "game balance" actually is or how to achieve it.


    Let me get this straight...people are upset because they spent RL money accelerating their training on a ship that you indicate was known to be unbalanced...and when CCP about faces people should be upset.

    Here is an idea: If it looks too good to be true, it probably is. Stop chasing the latest fad and go with what works.

    Sgt Ocker wrote:
    Reality is, we haven't had a player driven economy for a long time - It is closely monitored by CCP who will and do intervene when it suits them...

    You can try to defend CCP as much as you like but they did wrong...


    CCP takes a pretty hands off approach to the economy, IMO.

    "The curious task of economics is to demonstrate to men how little they really know about what they imagine they can design."--Friedrich August von Hayek

    8 Golden Rules for EVE Online